jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:22 am
A not-unwise school of thought would be to give Georgia's move three weeks, then assess.
(Un)fortunately this is an uncontrolled experiment. I have family in the Atlanta area and they are not venturing out unless absolutely necessary and so are most of their friends and acquaintances. This means that regardless of the Gov’s wishes most are staying home. This allows Kemp to declare victory for any success which happen in spite of him, not because of him
You just described exactly WHY we need to begin the process. It’s gonna take the good folks some time.
The sooner we dip our toe in, the sooner we can begin to feel comfortable inching back to whatever our normal is.
MICHHAWK wrote: ↑Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:10 am
The notion that the folks are going to rush right back to normalcy the minute we get the all clear to open back up is wrong wrong wrong. It’s going to take some time.
The longer we wait, the longer we wait. We gotta start dipping our toe in.
True, I think. The timetable here in Utah is very slowly opening up starting this Friday, and some sense of normalcy by October. We shall see.
have you seen the county-by-county numbers?
salt lake county hasn’t changed the curve trend at all, but the rest of the state (even summit co./park city) look pretty good
call me a pessimist, but i don’t think opening up is a good thing (and i’m one that has had to continue going to work through all of this)
Geezer wrote: ↑Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:10 pm
Riches to poverty in 2 months, 2020 in the world of right wing hyperbole.
For those of us in higher ed, two more months is about all it will take to lose our jobs, and for some, for the institution to close altogether. Small colleges are already closing across the country, and, if Fall semester ends up online, which is a net revenue loss for most schools, mine will likely do so as well.
It's not hyperbole for a 50 year-old to think that it will be extremely difficult to find another job in academia in a market that will be flooded with new grads and non-tenured unemployed faculty willing to work for peanuts. Maybe that amuses you, but I find it decidedly un-funny.
so leave academia
not much different than propping up the steel or coal industries...if the model is no longer sustainable, change course (or you could whine and cry about it)
MICHHAWK wrote: ↑Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:10 am
The notion that the folks are going to rush right back to normalcy the minute we get the all clear to open back up is wrong wrong wrong. It’s going to take some time.
The longer we wait, the longer we wait. We gotta start dipping our toe in.
True, I think. The timetable here in Utah is very slowly opening up starting this Friday, and some sense of normalcy by October. We shall see.
have you seen the county-by-county numbers?
salt lake county hasn’t changed the curve trend at all, but the rest of the state (even summit co./park city) look pretty good
call me a pessimist, but i don’t think opening up is a good thing (and i’m one that has had to continue going to work through all of this)
Of course the SAH ain’t affecting you. Your still collecting your regular paycheck. Think of someone other than yourself.
Geezer wrote: ↑Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:10 pm
Riches to poverty in 2 months, 2020 in the world of right wing hyperbole.
For those of us in higher ed, two more months is about all it will take to lose our jobs, and for some, for the institution to close altogether. Small colleges are already closing across the country, and, if Fall semester ends up online, which is a net revenue loss for most schools, mine will likely do so as well.
It's not hyperbole for a 50 year-old to think that it will be extremely difficult to find another job in academia in a market that will be flooded with new grads and non-tenured unemployed faculty willing to work for peanuts. Maybe that amuses you, but I find it decidedly un-funny.
so leave academia
not much different than propping up the steel or coal industries...if the model is no longer sustainable, change course (or you could whine and cry about it)
I should learn to code, huh?
“There are lies, damned lies, and statistics.” - Mark Twain
Geezer wrote: ↑Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:10 pm
Riches to poverty in 2 months, 2020 in the world of right wing hyperbole.
For those of us in higher ed, two more months is about all it will take to lose our jobs, and for some, for the institution to close altogether. Small colleges are already closing across the country, and, if Fall semester ends up online, which is a net revenue loss for most schools, mine will likely do so as well.
It's not hyperbole for a 50 year-old to think that it will be extremely difficult to find another job in academia in a market that will be flooded with new grads and non-tenured unemployed faculty willing to work for peanuts. Maybe that amuses you, but I find it decidedly un-funny.
Just like you can't say cause of death of a car accident victim is COVID-19, how much can you really blame the closure of these tiny private NAIA schools in Kansas on COVID-19?
Reasonable re-openings can be discussed and they are happening. Our two states had two of the shortest stay-at-home orders of any of the states that had them. But, nowhere in the world are students fully going back to on-campus school as of today. That doesn't belong anywhere near reasonable reopening for the immediate future.
For those of us in higher ed, two more months is about all it will take to lose our jobs, and for some, for the institution to close altogether. Small colleges are already closing across the country, and, if Fall semester ends up online, which is a net revenue loss for most schools, mine will likely do so as well.
It's not hyperbole for a 50 year-old to think that it will be extremely difficult to find another job in academia in a market that will be flooded with new grads and non-tenured unemployed faculty willing to work for peanuts. Maybe that amuses you, but I find it decidedly un-funny.
so leave academia
not much different than propping up the steel or coal industries...if the model is no longer sustainable, change course (or you could whine and cry about it)
jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:22 am
A not-unwise school of thought would be to give Georgia's move three weeks, then assess.
(Un)fortunately this is an uncontrolled experiment. I have family in the Atlanta area and they are not venturing out unless absolutely necessary and so are most of their friends and acquaintances. This means that regardless of the Gov’s wishes most are staying home. This allows Kemp to declare victory for any success which happen in spite of him, not because of him
You just described exactly WHY we need to begin the process. It’s gonna take the good folks some time.
The sooner we dip our toe in, the sooner we can begin to feel comfortable inching back to whatever our normal is.
It's not about"FEELING comfortable"
It's about doing it in a way that doesn't cause a massive spike in cases, overwhelm our healthcare facilities, and cause us to shut down again.
We need and are and will continue to "re-open" or whatever you want to call it. And we should do so as quickly and safely as we can. Numbers of infected WILL go up, we just need it to go up slowly enough that we can take care of those who are sick, that we can do our best to test for infected and track and trace, etc.
For those of us in higher ed, two more months is about all it will take to lose our jobs, and for some, for the institution to close altogether. Small colleges are already closing across the country, and, if Fall semester ends up online, which is a net revenue loss for most schools, mine will likely do so as well.
It's not hyperbole for a 50 year-old to think that it will be extremely difficult to find another job in academia in a market that will be flooded with new grads and non-tenured unemployed faculty willing to work for peanuts. Maybe that amuses you, but I find it decidedly un-funny.
so leave academia
not much different than propping up the steel or coal industries...if the model is no longer sustainable, change course (or you could whine and cry about it)
I should learn to code, huh?
better than being unemployed?
i left my academic position at KU last summer, with minimal reservations...now, i’m even happier with the decision if for no other reason than job security. i’ve said before that not once since this mess started have i worried about 1) not getting paid, 2) completely loosing my job, or 3) loosing my health insurance. as an aside, i make more working in industry than i could have ever hoped for working in academia...plus i’ve got the opportunity for quarterly bonuses and annual raises (and by raises i mean actual, substantial raises...not the scraps that the state of kansas tries to pass off as raises)
For those of us in higher ed, two more months is about all it will take to lose our jobs, and for some, for the institution to close altogether. Small colleges are already closing across the country, and, if Fall semester ends up online, which is a net revenue loss for most schools, mine will likely do so as well.
It's not hyperbole for a 50 year-old to think that it will be extremely difficult to find another job in academia in a market that will be flooded with new grads and non-tenured unemployed faculty willing to work for peanuts. Maybe that amuses you, but I find it decidedly un-funny.
so leave academia
not much different than propping up the steel or coal industries...if the model is no longer sustainable, change course (or you could whine and cry about it)
I should learn to code, huh?
Meat packing plants are likely going to be hiring. Or maybe get hired on with a butcher, they're about to see a boon in business.
Amazon is hiring, I assume FedEx and UPS are as well.
A lot of us are going to have to pivot in terms of our careers.
I feel badly for everyone that loses their job due to COVID-19. Even psych and his day job.
That doesn't mean we should sacrifice a million people's lives for the jobs--and it's a fallacy to think that having kept everything open the entire time would have kept those jobs, anyway. There are other ways to remedy the economic situation, though. Can't bring people back from the dead or build hospitals/supplies/doctors/nurses overnight.
TraditionKU wrote: ↑Wed Apr 29, 2020 11:51 am
so leave academia
not much different than propping up the steel or coal industries...if the model is no longer sustainable, change course (or you could whine and cry about it)
I should learn to code, huh?
Meat packing plants are likely going to be hiring. Or maybe get hired on with a butcher, they're about to see a boon in business.
Amazon is hiring, I assume FedEx and UPS are as well.
A lot of us are going to have to pivot in terms of our careers.
If you were really feeling threatened yourself, you wouldn't be so glib about putting your PhD to use cutting meat or delivering packages, nor would you confuse a job with a career.
“There are lies, damned lies, and statistics.” - Mark Twain
Meat packing plants are likely going to be hiring. Or maybe get hired on with a butcher, they're about to see a boon in business.
Amazon is hiring, I assume FedEx and UPS are as well.
A lot of us are going to have to pivot in terms of our careers.
If you were really feeling threatened yourself, you wouldn't be so glib about putting your PhD to use cutting meat or delivering packages, nor would you confuse a job with a career.
I wasn't being glib, if I was unemployed those are places that are hiring.
Pivoting in a career might mean taking a temporary job between careers to keep the lights on and food on the table.
You in particular strike me as someone who, in the past, wouldn't be too forgiving of someone staying on unemployment and welfare because he used to work at a better job and considers himself too good for a job that pays a wage.
Shit, just the other day you were ok with teachers needing to get summer jobs and side jobs just to make ends meet and today you're too fucking good to go get a job delivering packages because it's beneath you.
I guarantee if it was a poor black woman on unemployment you'd be shouting at her to "GET A JOB!" but everyone is supposed to feel sorry for you while you still have a job, just one that you're a little less secure about. WTF.
Written by someone I'm close to.
Obviously about the Boston Marathon bombing but correlations with the "crisis" we are going through now.
Echoes of a past crisis:
Like the Marathon bombing, the COVID-19 pandemic is undoing expectations of what is normal.
“No. The governor and lieutenant governor need to remain separated until we know more, and know it is safe.”
Those words were spoken to me by a member of the Massachusetts State Police’s Executive Protection Unit while in an underground bunker in the hours after the 2013 Boston Marathon Bombing. Surreal doesn’t even begin to describe it.
Now, seven years later and with the COVID-19 crisis bearing down upon our society, I decided to review my notes and pictures from the days immediately following the bombing. As a believer in the importance of understanding and learning from our past, I don’t want these never before seen pictures and memories to fade away and be lost to history.
Citizens’ expectations and needs of their leaders following the terrorist attack unsurprisingly present natural synergies with the current pandemic situation. As I reflect on the aftermath of the bombing, I find that our community can learn a lot about the importance of compassionate leaders making sound and timely decisions based on facts, and how clear and honest communication genuinely connects elected officials with constituents on an emotional level and ultimately leads to a more rapid recovery.
That fateful Patriots Day, I served as director of operations and policy advisor in the Office of Lt. Gov. Tim Murray. This role offered me a unique perspective of the days that followed. I was continuously in a behind-the-scenes position with not only Murray, but also Gov. Patrick, Mayor Tom Menino, and many others who reacted, led, reassured, and exemplified what being Boston Strong was all about.
Within an hour of the back-to-back blasts, I was in the State Emergency Operations Center located at the Mass. Emergency Management Agency (MEMA) bunker in Framingham with Murray and dozens of public safety officials. It turned out that I was the only member of his staff able to make it to the bunker on short notice. Murray’s Chief of Staff, Katie Joyce, of Natick, was at Massachusetts General Hospital having just given birth to a baby boy; both the deputy chief of staff and communications director ran the Marathon and were out of contact.
New information was coming in by the minute. Murray was in regular contact with Patrick and MEMA Director Kurt Schwartz. We watched as President Obama addressed the nation.
After our first hour in the bunker, Murray asked me to coordinate with his security detail for travel to Boston to join the governor. That’s when we were told “No,” for security reasons. You never expect to hear that. I remember pausing and saying, “OK, that makes sense.” We stayed in the bunker five more hours that evening. It was a maddening few hours with cell service so spotty. Finally around 6 p.m. we learned the three members of Patrick’s and Murray’s staff who ran the marathon were OK.
In the days that followed, I observed leadership in action. People were scared. Leaders led and continuously worked with the media to get information out as it became known.
I saw the kind of complex coordination one would hope to occur among countless local, state, and federal entities in a time of crisis. I witnessed first-hand as Gov. Patrick’s steady leadership guided a commonwealth gripped by fear. Patrick inspired selfless collaboration, not only when the cameras were on, but also and most especially when they were switched off. I observed the mood improve anytime Menino arrived and how he instantly captured a room’s attention as everyone seemed constantly in awe of his presence.
I found myself initially numbed by the whole situation, but then pushed my emotions aside to support the task at hand. There was no time for me to feel or grieve. There was no pause. There was only time to give leaders the right information at the right time for them to act.
Patrick and Murray visited multiple hospitals to meet with the survivors and their families, and to thank first responders, nurses, doctors and surgeons. It was clear some survivors would soon be released, but some were critical. There were only a few of what I would call “positive feeling moments” during these days. Some came during these visits. Even in the darkest moments, I saw survivors lifted up. Patrick and his team of visitors succeeded in making some smile, even for a moment.
While at Mass General visiting survivors and meeting with staff, I had an idea. I wasn’t sure if it was appropriate to divert Patrick and Murray to the maternity ward, yet a key member of their senior staff, Joyce, had just given birth and was only an elevator ride away. I raised the idea, we got on the elevator, and thankfully it worked out. It was one of those moments where Patrick and Murray could pause from a non-stop day, celebrate a new birth, and reset for what followed.
While this was all happening, the identities of the bombers were still unknown. Rumors were flying. A breaking news email came to my cell indicating a suspect was in custody, but this was quickly deemed untrue. There was fear Boston might be the first of subsequent attacks in major cities across the country. We didn’t yet know it was the lone attack.
There was much talk about the ongoing analysis of the available videos near the finish line. There was a lot of pacing and constantly checking phones while we waited for news. I remember a lot of phantom phone vibrations on my leg as I hoped and thought news was coming in. There were discussions about a survivor who told a doctor he could identify someone who dropped a bag right before a bomb went off. Someone said a sketch artist would be sent there when he was awake.
We kept waiting and waiting for something actionable.
Not a moment was wasted while we anxiously awaited more updates. Patrick, Murray, and Chief of Staff Brendan Ryan focused on efforts to create the One Fund Boston, the sole official charity to support those impacted by the Boston Marathon Bombing. They discussed the need to quickly create one official charity for the deceased and wounded survivors. I remember Murray stating that lives will never be the same, resources will be needed immediately and in the future, and the state and city must move rapidly. The governor and Brendan somehow found the time to team up with Menino and create the One Fund Boston.
I remember nobody else was around between updates. Staff were giving Patrick and Murray space. It was quiet in the governor’s office while they went through pictures of the suspects law enforcement provided to them. Discussions occurred over the next few hours about if and when to release photos. More camera angles were being sought to get better images. There was concern from law enforcement that one of the bombers may have been wearing a wig or had a fake nose. Initial reports were that they were 6 feet tall and in their 20s.
In the days that followed, Boston saw a Presidential visit for a memorial service, funerals, and that Friday in Watertown we will never forget.
I saw elected officials doing what they were elected to do. I witnessed law enforcement, military personnel, nurses, doctors and citizens all step up in their own way during this crisis. I saw Big Papi show Boston the healing touch sports can have on our emotions.
In the months ahead there was finally time to grieve. There was time to reflect. There was time to remember those lost.
Weeks after the bombing, Patrick and Murray released a joint statement. “The people of Massachusetts demonstrated tremendous resolve after the Boston Marathon and the days that followed. The strength and determination displayed by the dedicated first responders, medical personnel and by-standers showed the nation exactly what it means to be Boston Strong. The families of those affected will have our continued support as they work to recover. Events of mass violence, such as the Marathon bombings, can trigger overwhelming feelings of anxiety, anger and fear, even if you were not physically present. These feelings are completely normal and you may experience them weeks and months beyond the event.”
Years later those feelings are still here. And they are back in new and different ways as we all deal with the detrimental impact of COVID-19 on the 7th anniversary of that Patriots’ Day. Yet just like in the months following the bombing, I’m encouraged by the memories of people stepping up then, and those stepping up now in similar fashion. Leaders leading. Those on the front lines keeping essential services open while risking their own health. Healthcare professionals doing more than you can imagine. Donors supporting those in need. And the runners continue to train for the next Marathon. What a sight and tribute that will be when they can all be back together again.
