Let’s have a war!

[KUTradition]

i’d vote in favor

and with cruz as their prez

[KUTradition]

howsabout we play another round of "Nazis in Ukraine that keep showing up in western media despite western media being so determined to downplay nazis in Ukraine."

in today's edition, let's consider this notorious Russophile and Putin-parroting bad guy Kremlin spam bot:

The Commander-in-Chief of the Ukrainian military!



now, this one's unique for several reasons:

- it's not just some rank-and-file Ukrainian Proud Boy soldier, it's the commander in chief
- it was published not from the AP or Reuters or PBS or NYT or one of those other otherwise-respected western media sources, it came directly from an official Ukrainian twitter account
- it actually got a rebuttal this time! Unlike all the other evidence of nazis in Ukraine that either gets hastily dismissed as fake news, or just ignored altogether; this one merits a response from Newsweek, at least...

https://www.newsweek.com/kim-dotcom-ukr ... to-1750457

now, I can buy the "did not feature a swastika, but rather a swirly motif" theory as quickly as you guys will. Newsweek cites other tweeters who blurred the image for context, mentions the guy openly wears the bracelet all the time regardless, and that it's just an "ancient symbol" that was hijacked by the nazis. Oh, ok.

What Newsweek DOESN'T do, is provide any context for why the bracelet covered in innocuous ancient symbols IS worn so frequently by this dood, or what wearing that or any other of the ancient symbols might signify. It doesn't mention whether wearing jewelry is common for soldiers, or whether soldiers can display symbols while in uniform that go beyond standard dress. It doesn't mention much toward the context of WW2 or German nazis, despite the language in the commander-in-chief's caption:

A fierce struggle continues on our soil, the scale of which the world has not seen since the WW2. We have no right to hand over this war to our children. The enemy must be destroyed here and now. And we can do that.

Maybe they're not obligated to, though.

But, I guess the question I'm leading up to is, when we're supposed to believe the whole "nazis in Ukraine" thing is entirely just Russian propaganda, don't you at least kinda wish Ukrainian officials (and NATO pals by proxy) would take great care to eliminate even the suggestion of nazis in Ukraine? Don't you think at some point somebody would say something like, "hey let's make sure our high-ranking commanders aren't wearing bracelets covered in ancient motifs or anything else that might create any confusion here?"

and, finally, I'm tempted to ask whether Merica should take better care in understanding precisely what sorts of characters we're arming in Ukraine before arming them, but I know you guys see that question as nothing more than antagonistic, and I'm trying to avoid that role any more.

I must have missed your article about how when we arm our own military and police officers that we are "arming Nazis".


https://rollcall.com/2021/02/16/pentago ... -military/

speaking of our own brand of neo-nazis…

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/1 ... care-home/

[ousdahl]

It’d be great if we could do more to address the whole white supremacy problem in our own military, too.

Almost makes you wonder why we don’t…

lemme guess…not in the budget?

[twocoach]

It’d be great if we could do more to address the whole white supremacy problem in our own military, too.

Almost makes you wonder why we don’t…

lemme guess…not in the budget?

It's the same conversation tripping point as the conversation about getting all the asshole racists/abusers out of US police forces. If you kick all the assholes out then there won't be enough normal people left to do the job properly.

[zsn]

I posted in the other thread. This is not a new problem. It’s just that the identity of the victims are now different. Law enforcement has had it share of Klansmen and Nazi-sympathizers in the past.

[KUTradition]

it’s been posted before, buts it’s basically in their “DNA”

…Policing in Colonial America had been very informal, based on a for-profit, privately funded system that employed people part-time. Towns also commonly relied on a “night watch” in which volunteers signed up for a certain day and time, mostly to look out for fellow colonists engaging in prostitution or gambling. (Boston started one in 1636, New York followed in 1658 and Philadelphia created one in 1700.) But that system wasn’t very efficient because the watchmen often slept and drank while on duty, and there were people who were put on watch duty as a form of punishment.

Night-watch officers were supervised by constables, but that wasn’t exactly a highly sought-after job, either. Early policemen “didn’t want to wear badges because these guys had bad reputations to begin with, and they didn’t want to be identified as people that other people didn’t like,” says Potter. When localities tried compulsory service, “if you were rich enough, you paid someone to do it for you — ironically, a criminal or a community thug.”

…

In the South, however, the economics that drove the creation of police forces were centered not on the protection of shipping interests but on the preservation of the slavery system. Some of the primary policing institutions there were the slave patrols tasked with chasing down runaways and preventing slave revolts, Potter says; the first formal slave patrol had been created in the Carolina colonies in 1704. During the Civil War, the military became the primary form of law enforcement in the South, but during Reconstruction, many local sheriffs functioned in a way analogous to the earlier slave patrols, enforcing segregation and the disenfranchisement of freed slaves...

https://time.com/4779112/police-history-origins/

[twocoach]

I posted in the other thread. This is not a new problem. It’s just that the identity of the victims are now different. Law enforcement has had it share of Klansmen and Nazi-sympathizers in the past.

https://naacp.org/find-resources/histor ... y-policing

[ousdahl]

I don’t wanna be too annoying about it, but I’m still tempted to point out this is the kind of stuff you guys were calling me a Russian spambot for posting

[TDub]

nope


it's not.

[ousdahl]

How so?

Is it even worth asking?

[Deleted User 863]

nope


it's not.

[twocoach]

Best of luck to you all; I just have to tap out of this thread forever.

[ousdahl]

39 years to the day.

#StandWithGrenada

[zsn]

The hypocrisy of US foreign policy isn’t a secret. Two examples: the reason we knew Saddam Hussein had WMD is because we gave it to him; we supported a military dictatorship (Pakistan) in a war against a democracy (India).

[ousdahl]

[jhawks99]

Where would you like the Russian tanks to stop? How far West?

[zsn]

“Activists” = Russian propagandists, or their marks.

Cf. George Sylvester Viereck and the America First movement. History is repeating itself.

[ousdahl]

is there evidence this is the work of Russian propagandists?

I'm not saying it's not! Just curious if there's more to it.

My first reaction was more along the lines of, man the anti-war peace movement in this country is so lame. It's pretty much just a couple doods fussing at a niche-popular lawmaker's photo op, and you guys getting annoyed with me.

[jhawks99]

You have been very critical of US policy. I've noticed that you have not offered an alternative.

[ousdahl]

Actually, yes I have. I tried, at least.

Apparently, my suggestions were berated as Russian propaganda, and/or just ignored.

But since you genuinely don’t seem to recall, let’s start, if I may please, by allowing me to ask you the same:

If Putin called you up personally and said “I’ll knock off this whole invasion bullshit if you can get your guys to stop pouring weapons into Ukraine,” would you make that deal, 99?