F the NCAA

[pdub]

"If the Salty Iguana wants to pay Jalen Wilson $10k to promote their Taco Tuesday specials"

This isn't what is happening.
Nigel Pack just got 800,000 dollars.
Nigel Pack.

Among your many blind spots on this issue, the weirdest ones are when the things you use as "evidence" of one thing, are obviously evidence of something else entirely.

The fact that Pack got $800,000...is evidence that someone with $800,000 to spend decided it's worth giving him $800,000. At the end of the day, that's how literally everything about how economic liberalism works. I'd guess it's how the livelihood of nearly every person who ever reads this works.

It's really not any more complicated than that, hurt feelings aside.

TLDR

[NDballer13]

viewtopic.php?p=113835#p113835

"I'm not an expert in business.
Find a medium where shoe companies can help fund the programs but not to the tune of 15 million dollars a year.
I don't have the solve - just like it would difficult to solve how to pay college players through the schools - I just know I lean more towards college being an amateur sport ( less money in basketball rather than more )."

"If you don't value the things that college basketball provides, which at its heart should be an education ( regardless of what it is now and that's a big part of what I'm arguing - so i'm not going "miss you" with the "nonsense" ) in basketball and in whatever you decide to become, then the argument is moot.

Getting to go to school completely free, no cost to anyone in your family, is very valuable."

"I go to a hole in the wall local pub ( or used to pre-covid ) because I like the people.
If the local pub gets a new more expensive menu, a big loud digital jukebox, installs a dance floor and a bunch of new clientele come in who I don't vibe with, i'll find a different pub.

Some people who love that pub won't care if the pub has changed - it's still the pub in name for them - and that's fine too.

And the pub ain't perfect. There are things i'd change. But i'd rather it not have the big loud digital jukebox."

An education is still provided though. That didn't change.

Your example about the pub is also flawed too. Has watching a game on TV or in AFH changed from pre-NIL to the current experience? I certainly haven't noticed any change. Fans are the same. Cameras are the same. In game sights and sounds are the same.

"Some people who love that pub won't care if the pub has changed - it's still the pub in name for them - and that's fine too."

But the pub hasn't changed. The only thing that's changed is the bartenders are now getting paid more than you think they are worth.

[pdub]

"Some people who love that pub won't care if the pub has changed - it's still the pub in name for them - and that's fine too."

When KU moves from the B12 to the North32, that would be a change I wouldn't like. Some people will. That's fine.

When I see a couple Duke players on national TV commercials, that would be a change I wouldn't like. Some people will. That's fine.

When smaller schools are eliminated from playing in the NCAA tournament, or the tournament is eliminated all together, that would be a change I wouldn't like. Some people will. That's fine.

When student athletes don't have to attend class, that would be a change I wouldn't like. Some people will. That's fine.

If you took away the salary cap in the NFL, and made it like baseball, that would be a change I wouldn't like. Some people will. That's fine.

[NDballer13]

"How has the pub, or the experience of visiting the pub, changed?"

[ousdahl]

man, the satellite shack just keeps going further downhill. Are we even allowed to puff with Hawklin in the women's room any more?

for real though, for that pub analogy to work, one would have to include something along the lines of, how actually there was a big loud digital juke box there all along, but certain proprietors and/or patrons just liked to keep it hidden in the back room so they could pretend it wasn't really there.

and again, with all the examples of socioeconomic clusterfucks and the overmonetization of everything, Qusdahl just struggles to understand how the only such issue one gets outraged about is college sports.

[pdub]

viewtopic.php?p=280075#p280075

[jfish26]

Are these kids not attending class or being involved in the University? Those things haven't changed at all.

Wait for it.

One of the weirdest hangups people have over the "going to class" thing is the bizarre expectation that athletes' KU experiences are supposed to be exactly like theirs. And it's especially icky when olds (like most of us) do it.

It is time - it is beyond time - for athletes' educational experience and plans to be much MORE like those of other students. Meaning, other than some core classes, athletes should be spending the bulk of their learning time doing things that are specific to their anticipated career path.

Guys like Sasha, god bless 'em and mazel tov. But by and large, we absolutely should not expect, or even want, athletes to have to pursue majors that are fig leaves.

If you want the education to be real - if you want it to make a difference in the athletes' lives and prepare them for a career in athletics (should that be their goal) - then you should encourage and welcome athletes having college experiences that look fundamentally different from the experience of a student who truly chooses a Communications or African American Studies major.

[pdub]

I'm not saying, exactly right now, that the pub is ruined.
But it's starting to, quickly - you can see the signs.

I'm not at the moment going to completely just stop going to the pub.
I just won't go to the pub as often.

And then once the local pub gets a new more expensive menu, a big loud digital jukebox, installs a dance floor and a bunch of new clientele come in who I don't vibe with, i'll find a different pub.

[pdub]

Are these kids not attending class or being involved in the University? Those things haven't changed at all.

Wait for it.

One of the weirdest hangups people have over the "going to class" thing is the bizarre expectation that athletes' KU experiences are supposed to be exactly like theirs. And it's especially icky when olds (like most of us) do it.

It is time - it is beyond time - for athletes' educational experience and plans to be much MORE like those of other students. Meaning, other than some core classes, athletes should be spending the bulk of their learning time doing things that are specific to their anticipated career path.

Guys like Sasha, god bless 'em and mazel tov. But by and large, we absolutely should not expect, or even want, athletes to have to pursue majors that are fig leaves.

If you want the education to be real - if you want it to make a difference in the athletes' lives and prepare them for a career in athletics (should that be their goal) - then you should encourage and welcome athletes having college experiences that look fundamentally different from the experience of a student who truly chooses a Communications or African American Studies major.

TLDR
Just assume that from here on out.
I can't foe you bc I have to make sure you aren't gif bombing.

[ousdahl]

[jfish26]

"If the Salty Iguana wants to pay Jalen Wilson $10k to promote their Taco Tuesday specials"

This isn't what is happening.
Nigel Pack just got 800,000 dollars.
Nigel Pack.

Among your many blind spots on this issue, the weirdest ones are when the things you use as "evidence" of one thing, are obviously evidence of something else entirely.

The fact that Pack got $800,000...is evidence that someone with $800,000 to spend decided it's worth giving him $800,000. At the end of the day, that's how literally everything about how economic liberalism works. I'd guess it's how the livelihood of nearly every person who ever reads this works.

It's really not any more complicated than that, hurt feelings aside.

TLDR

89 words. Is the L for logical?

[jfish26]

Wait for it.

One of the weirdest hangups people have over the "going to class" thing is the bizarre expectation that athletes' KU experiences are supposed to be exactly like theirs. And it's especially icky when olds (like most of us) do it.

It is time - it is beyond time - for athletes' educational experience and plans to be much MORE like those of other students. Meaning, other than some core classes, athletes should be spending the bulk of their learning time doing things that are specific to their anticipated career path.

Guys like Sasha, god bless 'em and mazel tov. But by and large, we absolutely should not expect, or even want, athletes to have to pursue majors that are fig leaves.

If you want the education to be real - if you want it to make a difference in the athletes' lives and prepare them for a career in athletics (should that be their goal) - then you should encourage and welcome athletes having college experiences that look fundamentally different from the experience of a student who truly chooses a Communications or African American Studies major.

TLDR
Just assume that from here on out.
I can't foe you bc I have to make sure you aren't gif bombing.

LOL. Very Trumpy - accusing others of things you yourself do.

I've not gif bombed a single time in my board existence (this one or any other).

You have an active gif bomb on my account here, and have now for months.

Soft.

[NDballer13]

I'm not saying, exactly right now, that the pub is ruined.
But it's starting to, quickly - you can see the signs.

I'm not at the moment going to completely just stop going to the pub.
I just won't go to the pub as often.

And then once the local pub gets a new more expensive menu, a big loud digital jukebox, installs a dance floor and a bunch of new clientele come in who I don't vibe with, i'll find a different pub.

OK, so you're mad over things that MIGHT change. Now we're getting somewhere. At least now you acknowledge NIL didn't, in any way, shape, or form change the on court/field product. Which is the heart of the issue being discussed. But that's not gonna stop you from saying how much you hate it.

[pdub]

I'm not saying, exactly right now, that the pub is ruined.
But it's starting to, quickly - you can see the signs.

I'm not at the moment going to completely just stop going to the pub.
I just won't go to the pub as often.

And then once the local pub gets a new more expensive menu, a big loud digital jukebox, installs a dance floor and a bunch of new clientele come in who I don't vibe with, i'll find a different pub.

OK, so you're mad over things that MIGHT change. Now we're getting somewhere. At least now you acknowledge NIL didn't, in any way, shape, or form change the on court/field product. Which is the heart of the issue being discussed. But that's not gonna stop you from saying how much you hate it.

Nigel Pack is playing for Miami because of 800k paid to him.
The product is changing ( the balance of basketball ).

Refer to the "it was happening all along" post I gave to Ousdahl if that's your follow up.

[jfish26]

I'm not saying, exactly right now, that the pub is ruined.
But it's starting to, quickly - you can see the signs.

I'm not at the moment going to completely just stop going to the pub.
I just won't go to the pub as often.

And then once the local pub gets a new more expensive menu, a big loud digital jukebox, installs a dance floor and a bunch of new clientele come in who I don't vibe with, i'll find a different pub.

OK, so you're mad over things that MIGHT change. Now we're getting somewhere. At least now you acknowledge NIL didn't, in any way, shape, or form change the on court/field product. Which is the heart of the issue being discussed. But that's not gonna stop you from saying how much you hate it.

At bottom, it's a feeling in desperate search of support. Not the approach one would learn in any serious college class. Not the approach one would learn in any serious middle school class.

[twocoach]

I'm not saying, exactly right now, that the pub is ruined.
But it's starting to, quickly - you can see the signs.

I'm not at the moment going to completely just stop going to the pub.
I just won't go to the pub as often.

And then once the local pub gets a new more expensive menu, a big loud digital jukebox, installs a dance floor and a bunch of new clientele come in who I don't vibe with, i'll find a different pub.

OK, so you're mad over things that MIGHT change. Now we're getting somewhere. At least now you acknowledge NIL didn't, in any way, shape, or form change the on court/field product. Which is the heart of the issue being discussed. But that's not gonna stop you from saying how much you hate it.

Nigel Pack is playing for Miami because of 800k paid to him.
The product is changing ( the balance of basketball ).

Refer to the "it was happening all along" post I gave to Ousdahl if that's your follow up.

Who is to say that he wouldn't have changed schools for some other reason? Guys have been transferring at a dramatic rate for several years now. I don't care if the reasoning for the change was "my weirdo coach retired" or "some weirdo offered me a bunch of money". There were hundreds LESS transfers this season compared to last season so it looks like NIL has at least in part been responsible for less turnover in the sport, which is a good thing if you have a problem with things not being "like they used to be back in the day".

[NDballer13]

I'm not saying, exactly right now, that the pub is ruined.
But it's starting to, quickly - you can see the signs.

I'm not at the moment going to completely just stop going to the pub.
I just won't go to the pub as often.

And then once the local pub gets a new more expensive menu, a big loud digital jukebox, installs a dance floor and a bunch of new clientele come in who I don't vibe with, i'll find a different pub.

OK, so you're mad over things that MIGHT change. Now we're getting somewhere. At least now you acknowledge NIL didn't, in any way, shape, or form change the on court/field product. Which is the heart of the issue being discussed. But that's not gonna stop you from saying how much you hate it.

Nigel Pack is playing for Miami because of 800k paid to him.
The product is changing ( the balance of basketball ).

Refer to the "it was happening all along" post I gave to Ousdahl if that's your follow up.

You keep using him as an example. I have a hard time agreeing with that. Nigel Pack leaving K-State for Miami, even if his reason for going is $800k, is more of a transfer portal issue than it is NIL issue.

I'm with you if you want to talk about not liking having to re-recruit kids every year, but that's completely different from NIL. Transfer portal was already established before NIL was in play.

[jfish26]

OK, so you're mad over things that MIGHT change. Now we're getting somewhere. At least now you acknowledge NIL didn't, in any way, shape, or form change the on court/field product. Which is the heart of the issue being discussed. But that's not gonna stop you from saying how much you hate it.

Nigel Pack is playing for Miami because of 800k paid to him.
The product is changing ( the balance of basketball ).

Refer to the "it was happening all along" post I gave to Ousdahl if that's your follow up.

You keep using him as an example. I have a hard time agreeing with that. Nigel Pack leaving K-State for Miami, even if his reason for going is $800k, is more of a transfer portal issue than it is NIL issue.

I'm with you if you want to talk about not liking having to re-recruit kids every year, but that's completely different from NIL. Transfer portal was already established before NIL was in play.

That's exactly right.

And anyone paying attention has known, for years, that the compensation dam was going to break. The NCAA - meaning, TO BE CLEAR, the member schools as a group - has no one to blame but itself for the upheaval and chaos that inevitably resulted from NIL and the transfer portal happening at the same time.

[hoopla]

Are these kids not attending class or being involved in the University? Those things haven't changed at all.

Wait for it.

One of the weirdest hangups people have over the "going to class" thing is the bizarre expectation that athletes' KU experiences are supposed to be exactly like theirs. And it's especially icky when olds (like most of us) do it.

It is time - it is beyond time - for athletes' educational experience and plans to be much MORE like those of other students. Meaning, other than some core classes, athletes should be spending the bulk of their learning time doing things that are specific to their anticipated career path.

Guys like Sasha, god bless 'em and mazel tov. But by and large, we absolutely should not expect, or even want, athletes to have to pursue majors that are fig leaves.

If you want the education to be real - if you want it to make a difference in the athletes' lives and prepare them for a career in athletics (should that be their goal) - then you should encourage and welcome athletes having college experiences that look fundamentally different from the experience of a student who truly chooses a Communications or African American Studies major.

i can't keep up with some of you, but this is a great post. the truth is that these "athletes" are not students and the only reason that concept persists is branding. when manchester united signs an 8 year old to play in its youth setup, everyone understands what is going on, and that kid gets trained to be a professional footballer. but here we're still talking about it like these guys are students, and its all because they only get to be professionals due to their affiliation with a built-in customer base without which the money would dry up.

[Deleted User 863]

for reference, look at the history of KU’s Natural History museum, when it was built and where the funding came from. you’d be out of your mind to think that such a thing would be possible today

I remember going to KUs National History Museum as a young kid and thinking that was such a cool thing to have!