George Floyd and the Ensuing Protests

[Deleted User 289]

I just took about an hour long walk. Chicago moved to "Phase 3" today. Part of Phase 3 is the re-opening of stores - with safety measures in place. I would estimate 90%-95% of the stores within a 6 block radius of me remained closed - and boarded up due to destruction and prevention.
I spoke with two different pairs of cops on Michigan Avenue. Very interesting in that the first two were/are African American women and the second two were/are Caucasian men - and they couldn't have been more different in appearance and attitudes.
I approached both sets by saying the same thing, "I want to thank you both and let you know I appreciate you".
The women were as friendly as can be. Smiling, pleasant, and when I told them I was on Michigan Avenue on Saturday (chaos) and Sunday (calmness) they started asking ME about the "rioting" on Michigan Avenue on Saturday. They had no idea how badly damaged and looted the stores were (they are all boarded up right now). What I found shocking was when I asked them if any other officers they work with had spoken to them about what transpired on Michigan Avenue on Saturday they said - no. WTF? Really?
I then walked a block north and asked the two male officers what their take was on why they felt the "looters" had such bravado when there was such a strong police presence. Neither said a single word in response. Cold to the point of my feeling they were being rude. I said, "I'm not being critical, I lack the understanding of why people have such a blatant disregard and lack of respect for you and the law". Then when one was maybe going to speak - I suppose I (rudely?) interrupted him and I said/asked, "Do you feel it's because they knew you weren't going to shoot them and even though there were hundreds of law enforcement personnel they knew it was a numbers game in their favor"? I added, "You couldn't stop every person at every store and they knew it".
Again, not a single word response from either of them. I thought to myself - fuck it. I told them I hope they have a good and safe day and I walked away.
I walked about 4 blocks south and two blocks east and noticed they re-opened the Whole Foods for the first time since Saturday. Store windows completely boarded up except for the back door entrance (hey now). A line of about 20 people were waiting to enter the store. News/media (cameraman and reporter) interviewing people. Mandatory wearing of masks, 6 feet "social distancing", while standing in line. Someone midway in the line told me they had been waiting about 20 minutes.
Came away from my hour walk (in which my purpose setting out was to clear my head) feeling more depressed. Basically observed the aftermath of a war zone with the addition of Coronavirus fears still abundant. It's horrible.
Heck, I say that being well aware I am one of the fortunate people. I can't even imagine what many others are going through in this country. Very sad.

[twocoach]

Again, it’s gross. America is gross right now.

Agree with PhD’s worries.

Agree sweeping inherit changes need to be made to mentality of police forces nationwide (southern, northern, and other).

Sickened when reading about how trios is latest distraction to control.

Tribalism has led to cynicism which is leading us down a potential rabbit hole of people that can influence change in some real capacity don’t start meeting somewhere off of each other’s own mountain top.

Good luck changing the mentality of people who are looking for a means to bully and dominate. It's about as likely as changing someone's opinion on abortion.

Better procedures, better training, etter monitoring equipment such as cameras (that are required to stay on at all points in an officer's shift), better accountability and better transparency will help make it harder for those folks to get away with brutality but it won't change their mentality.

[PhDhawk]

Good. Then I hope that something gets accomplished out of these protests. With the state of this nation, I have my doubts if enough people want to see changes.

The rioting and the looting certainly doesn't help that cause at all.

Folks who allow themselves to be distracted by HOW 0.1% of the protesters are protesting are just looking for an excuse to ignore WHY 99.9% of the protesters are protesting.

The Pope disagrees with you. I'll go with his take over yours.

“Dear brothers and sisters in the United States, I have witnessed with great concern the disturbing social unrest in your nation in these past days, following the tragic death of Mr. George Floyd,” the pope said.

Francis urged to not "tolerate or turn a blind eye to racism and exclusion in any form and yet claim to defend the sacredness of every human life.”

“At the same time, we have to recognize that the violence of recent nights is self-destructive and self-defeating,” he said. “Nothing is gained by violence and so much is lost.”

[twocoach]

and I don't want to condone rioting and looting in itself, but I'm cautiously optimistic it could be a net positive change in the macro.

I mean, protests are happening in all 50 states.

when was the last time all 50 states did something together?

Gandhi said, “A Nation's Greatness Is Measured By How It Treats Its Weakest Members”. I'd argue we aren't doing so great right now.

That is why hundreds of thousands of people chose to put themselves at risk of COVID-19 to protest the atrocities of the police brutality against our African American community members.

[twocoach]

The rioting and the looting certainly doesn't help that cause at all.

Folks who allow themselves to be distracted by HOW 0.1% of the protesters are protesting are just looking for an excuse to ignore WHY 99.9% of the protesters are protesting.

The Pope disagrees with you. I'll go with his take over yours.

“Dear brothers and sisters in the United States, I have witnessed with great concern the disturbing social unrest in your nation in these past days, following the tragic death of Mr. George Floyd,” the pope said.

Francis urged to not "tolerate or turn a blind eye to racism and exclusion in any form and yet claim to defend the sacredness of every human life.”

“At the same time, we have to recognize that the violence of recent nights is self-destructive and self-defeating,” he said. “Nothing is gained by violence and so much is lost.”

I didn't say to ignore it or to treat it as "it happens, whadya gonna do". But in this day and age of the 5 second attention span American, folks are easily distracted from the bigger problem by this comparatively less important issue. It becomes a justification to some to not do anything.

Obviously it is a problem, especially since it only makes it harder for a community to thrive and ruins the hard work of that community. But we have seen numerous cases where the spark that lit the fuse to move a protest from peaceful to a riot with looting have come from outside forces looking to harm the message of the protest or to simply capitalize on the situation for personal, criminal gains.

[PhDhawk]

and I don't want to condone rioting and looting in itself, but I'm cautiously optimistic it could be a net positive change in the macro.

I mean, protests are happening in all 50 states.

when was the last time all 50 states did something together?

Gandhi said, “A Nation's Greatness Is Measured By How It Treats Its Weakest Members”. I'd argue we aren't doing so great right now.

That is why hundreds of thousands of people chose to put themselves at risk of COVID-19 to protest the atrocities of the police brutality against our African American community members.

Again, and as was stated at every turn during the pandemic, it's not the risk to one's self that is the issue. It's the subsequent risk to other people.

If you told me that all those protestors were going to quarentine themselves for two weeks following the protests, I'd agree with your post. I haven't seen anywhere that that will be the case.

[HouseDivided]

and I don't want to condone rioting and looting in itself, but I'm cautiously optimistic it could be a net positive change in the macro.

I mean, protests are happening in all 50 states.

when was the last time all 50 states did something together?

Gandhi said, “A Nation's Greatness Is Measured By How It Treats Its Weakest Members”. I'd argue we aren't doing so great right now.

That is why hundreds of thousands of people chose to put themselves at risk of COVID-19 to protest the atrocities of the police brutality against our African American community members.

I guarantee that none of them felt like they were putting themselves at risk. They were taking advantage of an opportunity to throw a monumental temper tantrum with impunity. Stupidity abounds.

[twocoach]

Gandhi said, “A Nation's Greatness Is Measured By How It Treats Its Weakest Members”. I'd argue we aren't doing so great right now.

That is why hundreds of thousands of people chose to put themselves at risk of COVID-19 to protest the atrocities of the police brutality against our African American community members.

Again, and as was stated at every turn during the pandemic, it's not the risk to one's self that is the issue. It's the subsequent risk to other people.

If you told me that all those protestors were going to quarentine themselves for two weeks following the protests, I'd agree with your post. I haven't seen anywhere that that will be the case.

Agreed. There's never a good time to protest the murder of a civilian by a police officer but this couldn't have happened at a worse time with the pandemic going on.

On the other hand, I guess we'll get a good test of whether or not the lockdown was as necessary as stated.

[twocoach]

Gandhi said, “A Nation's Greatness Is Measured By How It Treats Its Weakest Members”. I'd argue we aren't doing so great right now.

That is why hundreds of thousands of people chose to put themselves at risk of COVID-19 to protest the atrocities of the police brutality against our African American community members.

I guarantee that none of them felt like they were putting themselves at risk. They were taking advantage of an opportunity to throw a monumental temper tantrum with impunity. Stupidity abounds.

As proven here.

[HouseDivided]

That is why hundreds of thousands of people chose to put themselves at risk of COVID-19 to protest the atrocities of the police brutality against our African American community members.

I guarantee that none of them felt like they were putting themselves at risk. They were taking advantage of an opportunity to throw a monumental temper tantrum with impunity. Stupidity abounds.

As proven here.

Don’t be so modest. You’ve been proving it over and over again the past few days.

[seahawk]

I think he makes a good point in that it's important to understand WHY that's happening. Empathy is a big part of the path forward.

But, I agree with you in that what Noah is missing, is that he thinks NOT looting Target won't get anything done. I think that what made the acts of people like Gandhi, MLK, Nelson Mandella, Jackie Robinson, etc. so inspirational and so great and so lasting was that they stood up to injustice without letting their anger turn destructive. They didn't stoop to the level of the people that they were fighting against.

Martin Luther King worked peacefully for civil rights for more than a decade.

The Civil Rights Act of 1968 didn't get signed until after King was assassinated and the ensuing riots all over America.

So what "accomplished" more, the decade+ of peaceful protests or the seven weeks of riots?

The peaceful protests did more and have a lasting legacy.

The civil rights act of 1964 was much broader and happened during King's lifetime, same with the voting rights act in 1965. The 1968 civil rights act was introduced and passed by the house in 1967. It was held up in the Senate until after MLK's assassination.

So, I'd say the peaceful protests "accomplished" more.

That's just not historically true. There was violence and there were demonstrations all along the way in the 1960s. Politicians pay attention and change laws when it looks like the country will be torn apart. That was true about Bleeding Kansas in the 1850s, when the political leaders of the day knew that you couldn't push the railroads further west and open new towns where goods could be sold and new farms needed equipment if people were all the time riding in and burning them down.

It may be difficult for some who are younger to understand what a Presidential Assassination meant, but it's VIOLENCE on a scale that's difficult to even comprehend. The Civil Rights Act of 1964 was stalled until the death of a president.

I'm not advocating or excusing violence, just suggesting that we look accurately at the past.

[Deleted User 289]

Gandhi said, “A Nation's Greatness Is Measured By How It Treats Its Weakest Members”. I'd argue we aren't doing so great right now.

That is why hundreds of thousands of people chose to put themselves at risk of COVID-19 to protest the atrocities of the police brutality against our African American community members.

I guarantee that none of them felt like they were putting themselves at risk. They were taking advantage of an opportunity to throw a monumental temper tantrum with impunity. Stupidity abounds.

* EDIT
Nevermind. Why do I even try?

[twocoach]

Martin Luther King worked peacefully for civil rights for more than a decade.

The Civil Rights Act of 1968 didn't get signed until after King was assassinated and the ensuing riots all over America.

So what "accomplished" more, the decade+ of peaceful protests or the seven weeks of riots?

The peaceful protests did more and have a lasting legacy.

The civil rights act of 1964 was much broader and happened during King's lifetime, same with the voting rights act in 1965. The 1968 civil rights act was introduced and passed by the house in 1967. It was held up in the Senate until after MLK's assassination.

So, I'd say the peaceful protests "accomplished" more.

That's just not historically true. There was violence and there were demonstrations all along the way in the 1960s. Politicians pay attention and change laws when it looks like the country will be torn apart. That was true about Bleeding Kansas in the 1850s, when the political leaders of the day knew that you couldn't push the railroads further west and open new towns where goods could be sold and new farms needed equipment if people were all the time riding in and burning them down.

It may be difficult for some who are younger to understand what a Presidential Assassination meant, but it's VIOLENCE on a scale that's difficult to even comprehend. The Civil Rights Act of 1964 was stalled until the death of a president.

I'm not advocating or excusing violence, just suggesting that we look accurately at the past.

It can be both "true" and "not the entire picture". Protests alone rarely get anywhere. Violence alone rarely gets anywhere. We can debate which had more impact until the end of time and there would be no way for either side to be declared a "winner" of the debate.

As more protesters look to more aggressively police those within their own ranks, we will hopefully see some real change come from this movement.

I hope that my grandchildren can ask me what it was like to live in an era where the police treated some different than others because they can't imagine it themselves. If this past week turns into the drive towards that then maybe something good can be said of 2020.

[PhDhawk]

At least one good thing has come out of this tragedy and that is the televising of the Minneapolis sign language interpreter.

[Deleted User 289]

At least one good thing has come out of this tragedy and that is the televising of the Minneapolis sign language interpreter.

I've been fascinated with/by watching the local ASL reps during the Coronavirus pressers.

Semi related - 2:15 mark on.

[TDub]

Good. Then I hope that something gets accomplished out of these protests. With the state of this nation, I have my doubts if enough people want to see changes.

The rioting and the looting certainly doesn't help that cause at all.

Folks who allow themselves to be distracted by HOW 0.1% of the protesters are protesting are just looking for an excuse to ignore WHY 99.9% of the protesters are protesting.

You were calling for people with ARs to join the protest and stand up. Stfu

[HouseDivided]

That is why hundreds of thousands of people chose to put themselves at risk of COVID-19 to protest the atrocities of the police brutality against our African American community members.

I guarantee that none of them felt like they were putting themselves at risk. They were taking advantage of an opportunity to throw a monumental temper tantrum with impunity. Stupidity abounds.

* EDIT
Nevermind. Why do I even try?

Let me guess: It'sTrump'sfault!RacismandTrumpandbadbadbad!

[defixione]

I guarantee that none of them felt like they were putting themselves at risk. They were taking advantage of an opportunity to throw a monumental temper tantrum with impunity. Stupidity abounds.

So this, then, would also apply to the thousands of armed protesters that showed up nationwide to protest the economic shutdown.

[HouseDivided]

I guarantee that none of them felt like they were putting themselves at risk. They were taking advantage of an opportunity to throw a monumental temper tantrum with impunity. Stupidity abounds.

So this, then, would also apply to the thousands of armed protesters that showed up nationwide to protest the economic shutdown.

Of course. I said I understood WHY they were upset, just as I understand why (some) of those who are protesting now are upset - not the ones being paid by ANTIFA. But, in both cases, it accomplishes nothing other than to move the country closer to being locked down under martial law. The answer lies in simply refusing to play the game.

[Deleted User 289]

I guarantee that none of them felt like they were putting themselves at risk. They were taking advantage of an opportunity to throw a monumental temper tantrum with impunity. Stupidity abounds.

* EDIT
Nevermind. Why do I even try?

Let me guess: It'sTrump'sfault!RacismandTrumpandbadbadbad!

Bad guess!
But you are right about my often posting racism and Trump are bad.
You've made it known several times in regards to how you feel about my expressing my disgust for Trump.
Now you have an issue with my feeling and/or expressing racism is bad too? REALLY?

Here, let me appease you and share with you (and everyone else) exactly what I posted in response to what you had posted.

This was YOUR post.
"I guarantee that none of them felt like they were putting themselves at risk. They were taking advantage of an opportunity to throw a monumental temper tantrum with impunity. Stupidity abounds.


This was my response -
Were you out there on Michigan Avenue when the angry Black women was getting in the faces of the cops and yelling fuck you at them and the elderly white woman with ZERO fear walked up to her and started yelling at her to put on a mask?
We're you out there on Lake Shore Drive marching with the protesters in which 75% or more were wearing masks - and actually "social distancing"?
Then maybe you should shut the fuck up and stop pretending you know what others "felt like".
Yes, I'll give you that plenty of people didn't give a fuck about "putting themselves (and others) at risk" - but plenty did.
As far as your calling what they did "a monumental temper tantrum", you're God damn right for many it was "a monumental temper tantrum" and who the fuck are you to tell them that they shouldn't be pissed off?