who ya got?

[jfish26]

After re-watching a few parts of the debate again, I think Biden won simply because he did not look as bad as Trump. The expectations we so low that all people really hoped for was a Biden that could speak and not lose his train of thought. Trump did say some good things that were very accurate, but his demeanor turned a lot of people off. He was right on about law enforcement and the riots. He made some dumb mistakes when he would not address his taxes head on. He should have just said "yeah, I paid $750 because of my depreciating real estate, etc..." Instead, he dodges it. Biden also wouldn't answer questions about the supreme court, new green deal, etc. But all in all, Biden did come off a little better, simply because Trump looked too aggressive. The moderator also did a poor job. They need a mute button on the mic, for sure.

But does this really change anything? I doubt it. I still think Trump is going to win, simply because there just isn't any enthusiasm for Biden. Michael Moore recently said, "there's a lot of enthusiasm for Trump". Either way, we lose, but Biden's tax proposals would turn this severe recession into a severe depression.

Not sure what you base your "there just isn't any enthusiasm for Biden" comment on. The enthusiasm to remove this piece of shit Trump from office is "enthusiasm for Biden". I think we're going to see huge volumes of voting this year.

I agree with this. There might not be a lot of enthusiasm around Biden himself, but there's a metric fuckton of enthusiasm around ridding ourselves of Trump and Trumpism. See fundraising spikes of late.

[ousdahl]

No, they wouldn’t.

A conservative talking point since forever has been that the lib candidate will arbitrarily raise taxes, cuz that’s just what libs do.

If there is any rhyme or reason to libs raising taxes, it’s to wreck the economy, and to spite the working man.

[jfish26]

No, they wouldn’t.

A conservative talking point since forever has been that the lib candidate will arbitrarily raise taxes, cuz that’s just what libs do.

If there is any rhyme or reason to libs raising taxes, it’s to wreck the economy, and to spite the working man.

It's absurd. The rich are paying historically low tax levels. Raising taxes at higher income levels - or better yet, simply adding more and higher tax brackets - is eminently reasonable and justifiable.

[ousdahl]

meanwhile, the gummint is coincidentally broke.

I’m hoping we get a dem in office, just so the fiscal hawks might fly again.

[twocoach]

No, they wouldn’t.

A conservative talking point since forever has been that the lib candidate will arbitrarily raise taxes, cuz that’s just what libs do.

If there is any rhyme or reason to libs raising taxes, it’s to wreck the economy, and to spite the working man.

It's absurd. The rich are paying historically low tax levels. Raising taxes at higher income levels - or better yet, simply adding more and higher tax brackets - is eminently reasonable and justifiable.

This. Making corporations and the ultra wealthy pay more (or in many cases SOME) taxes isn't going to cause a severe depression.

Corporations act like them providing jobs is such a nice thing for them to do that they should be virtually exempt from paying any taxes. That's absurd. That model isn't working.

[ousdahl]

It’s kind of surprising the Merican populist movement doesn’t speak up against it more.

We could have a balanced budget and lower taxes for the middle class, except that the lobster types are too busy boogeymanning other demographics...

[twocoach]

It’s kind of surprising the Merican populist movement doesn’t speak up against it more.

We could have a balanced budget and lower taxes for the middle class, except that the lobster types are too busy boogeymanning other demographics...

Biden's tax change does need to be incorporated with some sort of mechanism designed to keep US companies from simply bailing and moving overseas. I can't imagine that we can't come up with some sort of offsetting benefit to keep them here. It sounds like Biden wants to ensure that everything the US Govt purchases comes from US companies, which is a start but they'll still need to come up with something to keep those companies at home.

[Walrus]

No, they wouldn’t.

You don't mind paying 60-70% of your money to the governments?

But also, this would be proposed at the worst possible time in history. This is definitely not the time to raise taxes. It's the best possible time to reduce government that we don't need.

[ousdahl]

Lobster, would you agree to a raise in taxes if it was just on the 1 percenters and corporations who are both so currently rich with cash; and who, in so many instances, have otherwise successfully avoided paying?

[jfish26]

No, they wouldn’t.

You don't mind paying 60-70% of your money to the governments?

But also, this would be proposed at the worst possible time in history. This is definitely not the time to raise taxes. It's the best possible time to reduce government that we don't need.

I'm not sure that's exactly what I'd take from 2020.

I don't think anyone serious is saying that anyone should pay an effective tax rate of 70%.

[twocoach]

No, they wouldn’t.

You don't mind paying 60-70% of your money to the governments?

But also, this would be proposed at the worst possible time in history. This is definitely not the time to raise taxes. It's the best possible time to reduce government that we don't need.

Where do you get your 60-70% number? I do not believe that those numbers reflect what Biden's plan is.

And I don't mind paying taxes. I live here; I benefit from the services here and elsewhere in the country. I believe that I should pay for the benefits provided to me and help to invest in my local, state and national communities.

[Deleted User 318]

YouTube.

[Walrus]

"Not only will JoeBiden tax capital gains as ordinary income at 39.6%, but he also supports subjecting capital gains to the Social Security tax and eliminating the cap. That would raise the rate from 23.8% to 54.9%, a 130% increase. Huge incentive to sell stocks before year end."

[Deleted User 318]

I was curious, so looked up AP reporting on Biden's current plan. Basically pushes 37% to 39.6% on $400,001 and above.

https://apnews.com/article/archive-joe- ... 76455b7305

[Deleted User 318]

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/presid ... hones/#app

Debates commission plans to cut off mics if Trump or Biden break rules

Washington — The commission that oversees the general election presidential debates said Wednesday it will be making changes to the format of the remaining two debates. One key change it plans to implement: Cutting off the microphones of President Trump and Joe Biden if they break the rules, according to a source familiar with the commission's deliberations. The plans have not been finalized and the commission is still considering how it would carry out the plan.

The Commission on Presidential Debates is responding to Tuesday's face-off between President Trump and former Vice President Joe Biden, the Democratic presidential nominee, which was marred by frequent interruptions by the president and mud-slinging.

[PhDhawk]

Biden's plan still doesn't target the super wealthy. Jeff Bezos' taxable income is something like $80,000 and he's the wealthiest guy on the planet.

I'm fine with having another tax bracket that starts at >$400,000 for individual income, but let's not pretend like this is a tax increase on the super-wealthy, it's a tax increase on the kinda rich. And, as we've talked about, there's a HUGE difference.

[jfish26]

Biden's plan still doesn't target the super wealthy. Jeff Bezos' taxable income is something like $80,000 and he's the wealthiest guy on the planet.

I'm fine with having another tax bracket that starts at >$400,000 for individual income, but let's not pretend like this is a tax increase on the super-wealthy, it's a tax increase on the kinda rich. And, as we've talked about, there's a HUGE difference.

Reasonably taxing the super-wealthy is a hard thing to promote when running for president.

[sdoyel]

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/presid ... hones/#app

Debates commission plans to cut off mics if Trump or Biden break rules

Washington — The commission that oversees the general election presidential debates said Wednesday it will be making changes to the format of the remaining two debates. One key change it plans to implement: Cutting off the microphones of President Trump and Joe Biden if they break the rules, according to a source familiar with the commission's deliberations. The plans have not been finalized and the commission is still considering how it would carry out the plan.

The Commission on Presidential Debates is responding to Tuesday's face-off between President Trump and former Vice President Joe Biden, the Democratic presidential nominee, which was marred by frequent interruptions by the president and mud-slinging.

Does this help or hurt Trump?

[Deleted User 318]

I think it hurts. I don't think Trump looked as bad as everyone else when he acted like a child. I said previously, give each candidate 2 minutes with closed mics, then open both up for 90 seconds, let them scream at each other, then cut off after 90 seconds, and move on.

If you give Biden and Trump equal time to pitch, Biden wins easily. He's better staying on-topic, and Trump has nothing to say but to attack Biden. People don't want that. Then you get the Trump talking over everyone afterwards.

[Deleted User 318]

Hmmmm, I wonder if Trump is sowing the seeds for backing out....