Would you be on the Jury?

[Deleted User 89]

Regarding your last sentence, i'm fairly certain no one is saying "He/She deserved it. #JUSTIFIED!"

now who needs to go back and read some previous posts?

[pdub]

I must have missed the post where someone said 'she deserved it'.
If you find that, i'll admit my statement was wrong.

[Deleted User 89]

i believe gutter posted something to that regard...but again, it isn’t worth it to me to try and find it

(i was more ribbing you than anything)

[CrimsonNBlue]

I do have one suggestion: the way and things the US teaches history, literature, etc. in public schools is outrageously biased.

You mean that the earth isn't only 6,000 years old?

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/20 ... eationism/

I have to wonder if it's not that universities are these liberal safe havens but that it's the public K-12 school curriculum that is nationalist, far-right, and Christian.

[Deleted User 89]

some of you are doing a great trump impression

https://thehill.com/changing-america/re ... cist-rants

[pdub]

I have to wonder if it's not that universities are these liberal safe havens but that it's the public K-12 school curriculum that is nationalist, far-right, and Christian.

Oh boy.

[Deleted User 89]

I do have one suggestion: the way and things the US teaches history, literature, etc. in public schools is outrageously biased.

You mean that the earth isn't only 6,000 years old?

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/20 ... eationism/

I have to wonder if it's not that universities are these liberal safe havens but that it's the public K-12 school curriculum that is nationalist, far-right, and Christian.

a lot of truth here

i’ve ranted about this before, but when there isn’t a national (federal or independent) body that is closing the curricula, you’ve got states (and their legislatures) chooses what gets taught

anecdotally, i thought it shameful that a black man growing up in tulsa didn’t even learn about the tulsa riots until he left oklahoma for college

as it stands now, the system is ripe for abuse and whitewashing of history

[Cascadia]

I have to wonder if it's not that universities are these liberal safe havens but that it's the public K-12 school curriculum that is nationalist, far-right, and Christian.

Probably both true to some extent. Our public education system (while some of the best in the world) is a joke in many ways. If I could change one thing in particular it would be how we teach history and our place in the world. Really need to stop the "America is the Best!" storyline. We live in a great country, but their are a lot of other great countries and cultures out there. We don't need to think of ourselves as being #1.

[Deleted User 89]

Fiji

[MICHHAWK]

The United States is the greatest country on earth. By a wide margin.

[CrimsonNBlue]

You mean that the earth isn't only 6,000 years old?

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/20 ... eationism/

I have to wonder if it's not that universities are these liberal safe havens but that it's the public K-12 school curriculum that is nationalist, far-right, and Christian.

a lot of truth here

i’ve ranted about this before, but when there isn’t a national (federal or independent) body that is closing the curricula, you’ve got states (and their legislatures) chooses what gets taught

anecdotally, i thought it shameful that a black man growing up in tulsa didn’t even learn about the tulsa riots until he left oklahoma for college

as it stands now, the system is ripe for abuse and whitewashing of history

It obviously shapes people's views on history, but also shapes what they value. Museums are filled with priceless items that are influenced by and largely exist because of and on the back of colonialism.

Thinking out loud here, and obviously it's not thee answer, but makes me wonder. Draw a line from valuing items and ideas to people.

[CrimsonNBlue]

I have to wonder if it's not that universities are these liberal safe havens but that it's the public K-12 school curriculum that is nationalist, far-right, and Christian.

Probably both true to some extent. Our public education system (while some of the best in the world) is a joke in many ways. If I could change one thing in particular it would be how we teach history and our place in the world. Really need to stop the "America is the Best!" storyline. We live in a great country, but their are a lot of other great countries and cultures out there. We don't need to think of ourselves as being #1.

Thinking of things forever ingrained in my memory from school:

"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

"In August 1492, Columbus sailed the ocean blue. October 12th they sighted land, And set their feet upon new sand."


If some Americans heard about equivalent things forced in Chinese schools, particularly where they are "assimilating" Uighurs, they'd go nuts.

[Deleted User 89]

i have no problem with teaching the idea that the US is one of the most successful and exceptional countries in the history of mankind

but, that doesn’t mean we are beyond reproach (nobody is). and it’s only by learning about the tainted parts of our history that we can even begin to reconcile with it and strive to be better

[Cascadia]

The United States is the greatest country on earth. By a wide margin.

Right on que. Perfect example

Buch MICH knows this cause left Michigan one time for an extended weekend trip to Cleveland.

[twocoach]

Some of you guys seem awful determined to completely dehumanize this chick. She was a fucking foster child! She was scared for her life, so much so she called the cops cuz she thought they were there to protect her, and yet you can only seem to see her as some kinda lawless gang banging monster. (Any word on whether she had weed in her system too??)

Let’s instead have a moment of humanity: her name was Ma'Khia Bryant. She was a 16yo in foster care who was so scared for her life that she called the cops. She was obviously panicked, and perhaps she thought the knife was her best chance at survival. Who knows? It’s not like we can ask her now.

I don’t want to condone that she screwed up. But let’s also not condone that she was afforded zero anything either.

Think back when you were 16. Did you do anything stupid? Maybe even threatening? And yet, you didn’t get mowed down in your own front yard because of it.

I also struggle to paint the one guy who DID kill anyone as some kinda life saver, but I understand the decision he made in that instant, and why it’s within the law. But to that community, who just lost another of their own, do you think they feel like justifying it on the cop’s behalf?

Perhaps the biggest tragedy of all is just how dividing this is. One side thinks the other is a bunch of monsters. And they’re not wrong! But it’s all just so dehumanizing.

You can't just sit here and make up some random story and then be pissed that people don't feel sad about your made up story. You have no idea if she was scared for her life. The argument was over cleaning up the house:

"It was over keeping the house clean," Moore told CNN. "The older one told them to clean up the house because 'Mom doesn't like the house dirty.'"

https://www.foxnews.com/us/makhia-bryan ... d-911-call

You have no idea if she was panicked or not when (or if) she made the call to 911. But since it fits your narrative, it is "obvious". You failed to mention that the police had just shown up to the house when Bryant came out of the house and then attacked a girl who was out in her driveway.

"Surveillance video of the ensuing altercation shows four people standing in front of that home. As Columbus police officer Nicholas Reardon is pulling up to the house, Bryant and two other people appear to come out of the front door.

Seconds later, Bryant lunges with an apparent knife at one woman, 20, who had been standing in the driveway of the home, forcing her to the ground. A man, 43, started kicking the woman as she tried to get up.

Bryant then turned to another woman, 22, with the knife, at which point Reardon discharged four shots from his firearm, fatally striking Bryant. "

The actual facts of the situation seem to not support anything from your made up story.

[CrimsonNBlue]

i have no problem with teaching the idea that the US is one of the most successful and exceptional countries in the history of mankind

but, that doesn’t mean we are beyond reproach (nobody is). and it’s only by learning about the tainted parts of our history that we can even begin to reconcile with it and strive to be better

Beyond the "tainted," is just giving credit where credit is due. On one hand the US wants to celebrate and tout to its students and everyone else that it is the best and biggest melting pot in the world (and it's true!). But, on the other, only a select few are responsible and celebrated for its success?

We have Columbus Day and winter break is often referred to as Christmas break. Christmas programs and no school on Good Friday. But if that weird brown person is gone for Eid al-Fatr: they're absent for a religious holiday.

[jfish26]

I have to wonder if it's not that universities are these liberal safe havens but that it's the public K-12 school curriculum that is nationalist, far-right, and Christian.

Probably both true to some extent. Our public education system (while some of the best in the world) is a joke in many ways. If I could change one thing in particular it would be how we teach history and our place in the world. Really need to stop the "America is the Best!" storyline. We live in a great country, but their are a lot of other great countries and cultures out there. We don't need to think of ourselves as being #1.

Thinking of things forever ingrained in my memory from school:

"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

"In August 1492, Columbus sailed the ocean blue. October 12th they sighted land, And set their feet upon new sand."


If some Americans heard about equivalent things forced in Chinese schools, particularly where they are "assimilating" Uighurs, they'd go nuts.

I have not heard this a single time.

[pdub]

I don't have an issue with the pledge of allegiance.
You can be proud of your country. It's OK to teach your kids to be proud of your country.

You can also criticize things about your country.
I don't buy that the pledge of allegiance is all of a sudden part of a problematic nationalist movement.

[twocoach]

Public Service Announcement:

Turns out our information this morning continues to be a little incorrect. Regarding the white kid with the knife that we took to Burger King. Well, apparently he didn't have a knife, he actually killed 9 people. Odd because he seems like a good kid, think he just had a bad day.

Also, still a couple unclaimed Caramel Frappe's in the break room.

Yep. This is the biggest real issue. More or less the same laws everywhere, but (some) cops see a certain amount of people as part of them, and then everyone else as something else. Even something less. Clear back in the 80's, but look up what the Judge said about the white guys that killed Vincent Chin.

It is just statistically true that police stops with white people and minorities turn out different. People are fed up.

Exactly, and I think that's ultimately what ousdahl is trying to discuss. But, every time we have a new incident, we have to first determine if the cop was "justified". Because if there is a slimmer of justification then the dead person deserved it.

There's a big gap between "justified" and "deserved". I don't think anyone "deserves" to die, even kiddie abusers and rapists. But the police have a job to do, which is to serve and protect. I would consider it negligence of an officer to not take action to stop Bryant based on the information that this officer apparently had and witnessed. I think the officer's actions were justified but again, I don't think anyone "deserves" to die.

Would I like there to be a nationwide movement to more aggressively pursue non-lethal options and training methods to increase the likelihood that this does not end with anyone's death? Absolutely yes.

[pdub]

I also think it's OK that a winter break can be referred to as a Christmas break.
93% of Americans celebrate Christmas.
I don't think it has anything to do with police officers being trigger happy.