Energy

[ousdahl]

Perhaps we need a thread dedicated to this issue. It’s a big one.

And I swear I heard on the radio the other day that a big issue with wind and solar is, it’s too cheap. Once the equipment is installed, it’s generating energy at very low cost, pretty much for free.

And if we have low cost energy then how can anyone get rich off it? Let’s jot forget what’s important here.

[zsn]

They said that the break even for my solar system was about 12 years, after tax deductions and credits. The way PG&E has been operating in cahoots with the regulators I think we have recouped our money in less than 10 years, and 14-15 years even if we never got any tax breaks.

[Mjl]

You have a solar system?

[Mjl]

Perhaps we need a thread dedicated to this issue. It’s a big one.

And I swear I heard on the radio the other day that a big issue with wind and solar is, it’s too cheap. Once the equipment is installed, it’s generating energy at very low cost, pretty much for free.

And if we have low cost energy then how can anyone get rich off it? Let’s jot forget what’s important here.

Low cost = greater profit margin.

[zsn]

You have a solar system?

Since 2006. Started with a 2.4 kW system and added on. It’s now 6.2 kW. Actually getting money back each year from PG&E in spite of them moving the goalposts

[Mjl]

Oh, that kind of solar system.

[zsn]

Oh, that kind of solar system.

Oh, you were talking about my other one…. I don’t talk about it much……it’s kind of modest, about five planets, none of them with any rings, just a couple of satellites, no asteroid belt to speak of.

[ousdahl]

do you still call the butt planet some kinky new name or is it still Uranus?

[ousdahl]

You have a solar system?

Since 2006. Started with a 2.4 kW system and added on. It’s now 6.2 kW. Actually getting money back each year from PG&E in spite of them moving the goalposts

In what way are they moving goalposts?

Is this a system that could work in other areas? Or just within a particular galaxy

[zsn]

PG&E is one of the most evil organizations on this planet (and in my solar system). They are the textbook example for why for-profit public utilities is an extremely bad idea, only superseded by for-profit health insurance.

Initially when we got solar generation installed they had two rate tiers available for us. The normal one called E-1 had a flat rate of around 15c/kWh, 24 h/day. For solar generators they offered a Time of Use (TOU) plan where the rates were 34c for peak (noon-6, weekday) and 12c for all other times. This was for May-Oct. Rest of the year the difference was less stark, about 30% between peak and not. This meant that one could rearrange daily activities so that we could really use 3 kWh off-peak for every peak unit generated. If you over produced you got money back at the same rate. Essentially you produce or consume at the TOU rate.

Five years later they did away with this rate, introduced the E-6 rate plan, and had part-peaks. Peak became 1-7 pm, part peak was 10-1, 7-9. This wasn’t too bad. But now they are phasing in a different TOU structure so that they buy low from you and sell high - peak is going to become 4-9 pm! This means you produce at 12c and buy at 42c!! They also keep jacking up the per kW rates.

Now they have introduced minimum charge for producing power, and also capped the excess production payout to 4c/kWh. This cycle is still ok for me but I’m going to switch to flat rate next May. I got an electric tank water heater so that I can take advantage of the TOU electricity and made other plans and these bastards keep changing the rules!

If a battery wall wasn’t so expensive I’d install one and be done with PG&E. Some day

[twocoach]

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/09/uk/nucle ... index.html

It will be interesting to see if they can get this working at a level where it is actually providing power for a community.

[JKLivin]

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/09/uk/nucle ... index.html

It will be interesting to see if they can get this working at a level where it is actually providing power for a community.

If there's no way to make scads of money off of it, the technology will mysteriously disappear into the ether.

[Qusdahl]

Well duh!

If it’s really limitless clean power, then how are we supposed to get rich off it? And at the end of the day, that’s what’s important.

And clean power? So they’re not even creating more jobs to try and mitigate all the collateral damage that comes with sweet sweet fossil fuel energy? Loose loose!

[KUTradition]

haven’t you guys seen Star Trek?

Capt. Kirk is/was prescient