Joel Embiid

[Deleted User 75]

Ya gutter is right.

Embiids usage % is nearly identical with or without Butler on the floor.

Not to mention, all indications are that Embiid and Simmons love Butler as a teammate.

[PhDhawk]

Sigh. Jimmy was that no-pass guard you play with at the gym.

He sure comes across very strongly as one of the worst teammates you'll ever see.

I said that last season, Illy and Gutter damn near had a shit hemorrhages.

right on cue

[jfish26]

He sure comes across very strongly as one of the worst teammates you'll ever see.

I said that last season, Illy and Gutter damn near had a shit hemorrhages.

I have "shit hemorrhages" when people don't have a fucking clue what they are talking about.

A. Hardly a "no pass guard".
B. Hardy one of the worst teammates you'll ever see".

He blew up a core that, save perhaps the Durant/Westbrook/Harden group, should have been about as perfect a core as a small-market team could imagine.

[Deleted User 75]

He didn't blow anything up. He just didn't like being in Minnesota and playing with KAT and Wiggins.

Meanwhile rumors are continuing to fly that Minnesota is willing to trade Wiggins for the right package....Minnesota management and coaching staff aren't on same page. I don't blame anyone for not wanting to be stuck there long term.

[CrimsonNBlue]

He didn't blow anything up. He just didn't like being in Minnesota

um . . .

[jfish26]

He didn't blow anything up. He just didn't like being in Minnesota and playing with KAT and Wiggins.

Meanwhile rumors are continuing to fly that Minnesota is willing to trade Wiggins for the right package....Minnesota management and coaching staff aren't on same page. I don't blame anyone for not wanting to be stuck there long term.

But I guess that's my point: Butler didn't make it work. For whatever reason, he chose to force a trade. That's not something a great teammate or leader would do. His case isn't helped by his apparent desired destinations including trash heaps like Brooklyn.

For as much as he wants you to think otherwise, Butler really does seem to be a me-first guy, not a team-first guy.

[CrimsonNBlue]

Butler's best year (3rd team NBA iirc) was on a horrible Chicago team.

[CrimsonNBlue]

A guy holds out from all team activities.

Shows up unannounced for one single preseason practice to excoriate and try to embarrass his starting teammates with a particular focus on the team's biggest star (KAT). Later reports state that the other starters, especially Wiggs, held their own in the "look-at-me" scrimmage. Doesn't show up to another practice and demands a trade.

Great teammate.

[Deleted User 183]

I said that last season, Illy and Gutter damn near had a shit hemorrhages.

I have "shit hemorrhages" when people don't have a fucking clue what they are talking about.

A. Hardly a "no pass guard".
B. Hardy one of the worst teammates you'll ever see".

He blew up a core that, save perhaps the Durant/Westbrook/Harden group, should have been about as perfect a core as a small-market team could imagine.

You want to blame someone for blowing up a core that "should have been about as perfect a core as a small-market team could imagine"?
OK, then how about you blame Thibs and/or Layden and/or Taylor? How about you blame Wiggins and/or you blame KAT too?
Instead you choose to single out and blame the guy who actually gave a fuck, busted his ass every game and in the off season, was an all-star, and then finally had enough and told his owner, GM, coach, and lazy (more talented than he is) teammates to go fuck themselves.
Blame him all you want. I choose to say good for him.

[Cascadia]

Classic gutter

[jfish26]

I have "shit hemorrhages" when people don't have a fucking clue what they are talking about.

A. Hardly a "no pass guard".
B. Hardy one of the worst teammates you'll ever see".

He blew up a core that, save perhaps the Durant/Westbrook/Harden group, should have been about as perfect a core as a small-market team could imagine.

Like I said, I have "shit hemorrhages" when people don't have a fucking clue what they are talking about.

You want to blame someone for blowing up a core that "should have been about as perfect a core as a small-market team could imagine"?
OK, then how about you blame Thibs and/or Layden and/or Taylor? How about you blame Wiggins and/or you blame KAT too?
Instead you choose to single out and blame the guy who actually gave a fuck, busted his ass every game and in the off season, was an all-star, and then finally had enough and told his lazy (more talented than he is) teammates to go fuck themselves.
Blame him all you want. I choose to say good for him.

These two things can both be true:

1. It's not Butler's fault it didn't work in Minnesota; and

2. The reputation Butler wants to have is that of a guy who would have made it work.

I'm not saying what Butler did is unreasonable or illogical; it makes perfect sense. But it's astonishing to me that people still want to back him as if he's a great teammate or leader when he's obviously not.

Same thing with Kawhi - it's astonishing to me that he doesn't get more shit for pouting his way to sitting out a season (and getting paid to do so).

[PhDhawk]

Instead you choose to single out and blame the guy who actually gave a fuck, busted his ass every game and in the off season, was an all-star, and then finally had enough and told his lazy (more talented than he is) teammates to go fuck themselves.
Blame him all you want. I choose to say good for him.

This is the biggest crock of shit.

He's the loudest guy, who postures the most, and who was the first one to throw a fit, and take his ball and go home.

I don't get the Butler love. I guess it's an example of a squeaky wheel getting the grease, only in this case the grease is admiration from fans who think the wheel being squeaky means the wheel is passionate instead of being a hot-headed diva who can't handle not getting his way.

Nothing says busting his ass every game more than not playing in back to backs.

Nothing says busting your ass in the offseason more than not participating.

[Cascadia]

It’s pretty simple.

Butler played for Chicago, so gutter loves him.

Butler clashed with former KU players, so Illy loves him.

[Deleted User 75]

He didn't blow anything up. He just didn't like being in Minnesota and playing with KAT and Wiggins.

Meanwhile rumors are continuing to fly that Minnesota is willing to trade Wiggins for the right package....Minnesota management and coaching staff aren't on same page. I don't blame anyone for not wanting to be stuck there long term.

But I guess that's my point: Butler didn't make it work. For whatever reason, he chose to force a trade. That's not something a great teammate or leader would do. His case isn't helped by his apparent desired destinations including trash heaps like Brooklyn.

For as much as he wants you to think otherwise, Butler really does seem to be a me-first guy, not a team-first guy.

Ya. He definitely deserves heat for how he handled the Minnesota situation...I think all of then are me first to an extent. It also doesn't help that in today's environment players are so quick to request a trade (or transfer schools in college) the minute things get tough.

Butler was NOT a good teammate in Minnesota...but I don't think that means he won't be a good teammate in Philly. Simmons and Embiid are hard workers and have a lot of respect from the elite players around the league such as LeBron. That wasn't the case with KAT and Wiggins.

Minnesota should have known they'd never keep butler happy long term. It was their own fault for trading away good assets for a short term Butler rental.

Philly has the pieces in place for that to be a strong core for a lot of years. It just takes more than a few weeks for everyone to adjust and build chemistry. They will get it figured out. The pieces fit pretty well. Embiid is in MVP convo. They need to stay patient and trust the process.

[Deleted User 75]

It’s pretty simple.

Butler clashed with former KU players, so Illy loves him.

I don't love butler.

He was a terrible teammate in Minnesota, but I don't think that's the case at all in Philly.

[jfish26]

It’s pretty simple.

Butler clashed with former KU players, so Illy loves him.

I don't love butler.

He was a terrible teammate in Minnesota, but I don't think that's the case at all in Philly.

We will see. I love Jo of course, but it's not hard to see his shit rubbing an old-school guy the wrong way.

[PhDhawk]

It’s pretty simple.

Butler clashed with former KU players, so Illy loves him.

I don't love butler.

I just love to argue anything and everything.

[Deleted User 75]

It’s pretty simple.

Butler clashed with former KU players, so Illy loves him.

I don't love butler.

He was a terrible teammate in Minnesota, but I don't think that's the case at all in Philly.

We will see. I love Jo of course, but it's not hard to see his shit rubbing an old-school guy the wrong way.

There's no doubt about that. I just think he's so good that Butler will deal with it.

And let's remember it's Jo making these comments to the media that can be taken the wrong way....Butler hasn't responded negatively or controversially at all.

I personally don't think Jo's comments are as serious as some may think. I just think he talks a lot, speaks his mind, and complains/gets frustrated after tough losses. He's young and this is all new to him. All things considered he's doing a wonderful job handling the spotlight.

[Deleted User 75]

It’s pretty simple.

Butler clashed with former KU players, so Illy loves him.

I don't love butler.

I just love to argue anything and everything.

Closer to reality than me loving him because he didn't want to play with Wiggins.

[Deleted User 183]

Instead you choose to single out and blame the guy who actually gave a fuck, busted his ass every game and in the off season, was an all-star, and then finally had enough and told his lazy (more talented than he is) teammates to go fuck themselves.
Blame him all you want. I choose to say good for him.

This is the biggest crock of shit.

He's the loudest guy, who postures the most, and who was the first one to throw a fit, and take his ball and go home.

I don't get the Butler love. I guess it's an example of a squeaky wheel getting the grease, only in this case the grease is admiration from fans who think the wheel being squeaky means the wheel is passionate instead of being a hot-headed diva who can't handle not getting his way.

Nothing says busting his ass every game more than not playing in back to backs.

Nothing says busting your ass in the offseason more than not participating.

You're right - Like I said, he "threw a fit" because he had enough and then said I want the fuck out.
I'll give you that he finally "quit" on his teammates and that in itself is/was a shitty thing to do but if I am going to fault Butler for that I guess I will go ahead and continue fault LeBron for what he did to his Cleveland teammates (twice) and his Miami teammates.

Can't Butler (and anyone else) be both passionate and a "hot head diva?" Plenty of "hot head divas" are the reason/s why teams are successful.
I agree taking games off was not cool but....Yes, he did bust his ass every game he played.
Something his two stellar teammates didn't do. He wanted out so either he or his agent decided he should take games off to make a point to everyone from ownership to the guy who picks up his jock in the locker room. Bad decision. I agree with you there but I'm not Jimmy Butler nor am I a part of the TWolves management - so I'll leave it up to them to figure out why he did what ehe did and why he was allowed to do what he did.
As far as your saying he didn't participate in the offseason, what wasn't he participating in during the off season/s that he was supposed to be doing and was cleared to do?