Let’s have a war!

[jfish26]

You know, a very good use of scarce human assets within Russia (that are not in a position to gather useful intel) would be to free Navalny and get him to NATO territory.

Capitalize on the growing unrest among Russians and create an offensive Russian government in exile.

[KUTradition]

You know, a very good use of scarce human assets within Russia (that are not in a position to gather useful intel) would be to free Navalny and get him to NATO territory.

Capitalize on the growing unrest among Russians and create an offensive Russian government in exile.

i’ve not seen any mention of him since the beginning of this mess

wouldn’t it be great, though, if this all turned out to be putin digging his own grave and russia seeing a revolution of sorts?

[Qusdahl]

Sorry to anyone who thought I was too obstinate.

There’s some interesting dynamics here, tho.

Apparently, my angle of trying to look at some bigger picture and examine root causes and concede there’s blame to go around, came across as “both sides”-ing the issue to many of you. Is that fair to say?

Now consider my point of view: out here saying “fuck Putin fuck Putin fuck Putin and fuck Trump too” and you guys firing back with YoUrE TakInG PuTiN aNd TrUmP’s SiDe!!!!!

I’d like to continue to discuss, but I also don’t wanna just make it a poop throwing contest.

So maybe it’s better to just sit the rest out til we get back to that ideal of not caring who’s bombing whom around the rest of the world.

Unless, of course, illy’s on Q’s side now, in which case all bets are off, let’s get the popcorn…

[jfish26]

You know, a very good use of scarce human assets within Russia (that are not in a position to gather useful intel) would be to free Navalny and get him to NATO territory.

Capitalize on the growing unrest among Russians and create an offensive Russian government in exile.

i’ve not seen any mention of him since the beginning of this mess

wouldn’t it be great, though, if this all turned out to be putin digging his own grave and russia seeing a revolution of sorts?

His show trial is ongoing.

And I think that (revolution) is exactly what’s going to happen, whether sooner or later. Putin’s failure to quickly decapitate Ukraine’s government (metaphorically or otherwise) and replace it with a puppet regime is having politically devastating consequences (which will only grow as he has to resort to atrocities, and as economic pain at home deepens).

[kubowler99]

Given the current state of the ruble, it will be interesting to see how long the Russian soldiers are willing to fight for quite literally pennies on the dollar, especially if they have families back home that are struggling.

[NewtonHawk11]

Read a text string with a Russian soldier and his mom shortly before he died. Mom kept calling and texting asking (Paraphrasing ahead) "Why are you not answering me, you're father and I are worried about you, are you really in training?" Solider replies back and says, "We are in Ukraine. I don't want to be here. We were told they would welcome us, they are fighting back."

[jfish26]

Given the current state of the ruble, it will be interesting to see how long the Russian soldiers are willing to fight for quite literally pennies on the dollar, especially if they have families back home that are struggling.

Last I saw, the compensation being paid to Russian families of fallen soldiers was worth 50 Euro.

[NewtonHawk11]

Will say this, it does seem like Putin and Russia are trying to go for the end here. Going stronger and harder than they have in the last few days. Going for residential areas, main city squares and more. It's not limited to military facilities anymore.

[MICHHAWK]

kill a commie for mommy

[twocoach]

Will say this, it does seem like Putin and Russia are trying to go for the end here. Going stronger and harder than they have in the last few days. Going for residential areas, main city squares and more. It's not limited to military facilities anymore.

It didn't look like they were limiting themselves to military facilities before this, either.

[NewtonHawk11]

Will say this, it does seem like Putin and Russia are trying to go for the end here. Going stronger and harder than they have in the last few days. Going for residential areas, main city squares and more. It's not limited to military facilities anymore.

It didn't look like they were limiting themselves to military facilities before this, either.

Well, yes somewhat true. The first strikes were at airports and military facilities to try to get air superiority. Didn't really work. Just seems like the last 12-18 hours has been the deadliest of the battle so far.

[jfish26]

Will say this, it does seem like Putin and Russia are trying to go for the end here. Going stronger and harder than they have in the last few days. Going for residential areas, main city squares and more. It's not limited to military facilities anymore.

It didn't look like they were limiting themselves to military facilities before this, either.

Nothing has moved me off of the central thesis that: (1) Russia's first-strike advanced warfare capabilities (knock out comms, establish air superiority, take high priority targets with precision weapons and special forces) were grossly overstated; (2) Russia's equipment is in poor shape, and the logistics operations (which rely on conscripts as opposed to career soldiers) are disorganized and ineffective; and (3) Russia is now left resorting to brute force and indiscriminate means.

I suspect what's going to happen is that Russia is essentially going to lay siege to the cities and, along with shutting out foreign materiel shipments, conduct what is essentially a terror/torture campaign to scare/starve Ukraine into submission.

[jfish26]

Read a text string with a Russian soldier and his mom shortly before he died. Mom kept calling and texting asking (Paraphrasing ahead) "Why are you not answering me, you're father and I are worried about you, are you really in training?" Solider replies back and says, "We are in Ukraine. I don't want to be here. We were told they would welcome us, they are fighting back."

An absolute pro move by Biden would be to (obviously assuming this can be done safely) pipe Zelenskyy into the State of the Union tonight.

[TDub]

Sorry to anyone who thought I was too obstinate.

There’s some interesting dynamics here, tho.

Apparently, my angle of trying to look at some bigger picture and examine root causes and concede there’s blame to go around, came across as “both sides”-ing the issue to many of you. Is that fair to say?

Now consider my point of view: out here saying “fuck Putin fuck Putin fuck Putin and fuck Trump too” and you guys firing back with YoUrE TakInG PuTiN aNd TrUmP’s SiDe!!!!!

I’d like to continue to discuss, but I also don’t wanna just make it a poop throwing contest.

So maybe it’s better to just sit the rest out til we get back to that ideal of not caring who’s bombing whom around the rest of the world.

Unless, of course, illy’s on Q’s side now, in which case all bets are off, let’s get the popcorn…

So...your main point being: Don't believe everything the government tells us to believe?

not being an ass just trying to filter out to a tangible point

[jfish26]

Will say this, it does seem like Putin and Russia are trying to go for the end here. Going stronger and harder than they have in the last few days. Going for residential areas, main city squares and more. It's not limited to military facilities anymore.

It didn't look like they were limiting themselves to military facilities before this, either.

Nothing has moved me off of the central thesis that: (1) Russia's first-strike advanced warfare capabilities (knock out comms, establish air superiority, take high priority targets with precision weapons and special forces) were grossly overstated; (2) Russia's equipment is in poor shape, and the logistics operations (which rely on conscripts as opposed to career soldiers) are disorganized and ineffective; and (3) Russia is now left resorting to brute force and indiscriminate means.

I suspect what's going to happen is that Russia is essentially going to lay siege to the cities and, along with shutting out foreign materiel shipments, conduct what is essentially a terror/torture campaign to scare/starve Ukraine into submission.

And off we go.

[jfish26]

[twocoach]

Will say this, it does seem like Putin and Russia are trying to go for the end here. Going stronger and harder than they have in the last few days. Going for residential areas, main city squares and more. It's not limited to military facilities anymore.

It didn't look like they were limiting themselves to military facilities before this, either.

Nothing has moved me off of the central thesis that: (1) Russia's first-strike advanced warfare capabilities (knock out comms, establish air superiority, take high priority targets with precision weapons and special forces) were grossly overstated; (2) Russia's equipment is in poor shape, and the logistics operations (which rely on conscripts as opposed to career soldiers) are disorganized and ineffective; and (3) Russia is now left resorting to brute force and indiscriminate means.

I suspect what's going to happen is that Russia is essentially going to lay siege to the cities and, along with shutting out foreign materiel shipments, conduct what is essentially a terror/torture campaign to scare/starve Ukraine into submission.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/uk ... 022-02-28/

"Human rights groups and Ukraine's ambassador to the United States on Monday accused Russia of attacking Ukrainians with cluster bombs and vacuum bombs, weapons that have been condemned by a variety of international organizations.

Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch both said that Russian forces appeared to have used widely banned cluster munitions, with Amnesty accusing them of attacking a preschool in northeastern Ukraine while civilians took shelter inside."

[twocoach]

Read a text string with a Russian soldier and his mom shortly before he died. Mom kept calling and texting asking (Paraphrasing ahead) "Why are you not answering me, you're father and I are worried about you, are you really in training?" Solider replies back and says, "We are in Ukraine. I don't want to be here. We were told they would welcome us, they are fighting back."

An absolute pro move by Biden would be to (obviously assuming this can be done safely) pipe Zelenskyy into the State of the Union tonight.

Why? I doubt he needs his speech taking 2nd place to a younger, more charismatic leader who is a worldwide hero right now.

[jfish26]

It didn't look like they were limiting themselves to military facilities before this, either.

Nothing has moved me off of the central thesis that: (1) Russia's first-strike advanced warfare capabilities (knock out comms, establish air superiority, take high priority targets with precision weapons and special forces) were grossly overstated; (2) Russia's equipment is in poor shape, and the logistics operations (which rely on conscripts as opposed to career soldiers) are disorganized and ineffective; and (3) Russia is now left resorting to brute force and indiscriminate means.

I suspect what's going to happen is that Russia is essentially going to lay siege to the cities and, along with shutting out foreign materiel shipments, conduct what is essentially a terror/torture campaign to scare/starve Ukraine into submission.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/uk ... 022-02-28/

"Human rights groups and Ukraine's ambassador to the United States on Monday accused Russia of attacking Ukrainians with cluster bombs and vacuum bombs, weapons that have been condemned by a variety of international organizations.

Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch both said that Russian forces appeared to have used widely banned cluster munitions, with Amnesty accusing them of attacking a preschool in northeastern Ukraine while civilians took shelter inside."

There is verified video of the use of what are clearly cluster munitions in civilian areas. I have seen one video purporting to show a thermobaric explosion, but I am not sure it's been verified.

[MICHHAWK]

other than an attempt to distract the American people. no reason to have the ukraine dude at the sotu.