Mahomie

[jfish26]

Maybe Ford's offsides moment will be equivalent to Gordon's triple to the wall moment the year the Royals lost to the Giants. So close yet not quite enough. Maybe KC will now spend the entire offseason obsessed with getting the rest of the way there.

Fix our offensive line. Fix our defense. Fix Berry's foot. Come back and win it all next year. Fingers crossed.

I agree there are a lot of parallels to the 2014 Royals. I think the Reid/pre-title-Self parallels are unavoidable as well.

While we’re here, the other things bouncing around my head this morning:

* I don’t think college OT rules are the right path, but I think both teams have to get the ball. Maybe if one team scores a TD, the other team must go for 2 if they score.

* This one is about the refs: I don’t know how you overturn the Edelman call, but uphold the catch that followed where the ball hit the ground. In my opinion, the video evidence didn’t meet the necessary standard to overturn the punt call, but if what video there was was in fact enough, then there was more than enough to overturn that catch.

* Reid should have challenged the catch on the left sideline toward the end of the first half. As a 3rd and 7 (or so) near midfield, that incompletion would have been a turnover. Losing a first half TO isn’t a big deal, and nor is losing a challenge now that all scoring plays and (actual) turnovers are reviewed automatically.

* Belichick gifted the Chiefs the review late in the 4th where he called a timeout. That play wasn’t going to be reviewed otherwise.

* Hopefully it’s purely a youth/inexperience thing, but Mahomes must grow out of (or otherwise solve) these weird and janky starts. He knows it, Reid knows it.

* I preface this by saying Bob Sutton knows more about football than I do: Bob Sutton fucking sucks and needs to go. Everyone in the world knew what the Patriots were going to do. Then they did it over and over and over. Brady is perhaps on the slope from great to Peyton-in-Denver. It would have been better (in my opinion) to risk getting beat on throws downfield than to just give the Patriots eight yards on demand. It’s like getting bit to death by a duck.

* Also on Sutton: maybe figure out how to capitalize on the Patriots giving Ford so much attention. Come on: consistent double teams there mean consistent opportunities somewhere else.

* Dan Sorensen reminds me of a Kevin Young type. Just a guy you really want around, because he will find his way to the biggest spots.

* I keep seeing laments over the Chiefs not taking a couple more shots at the end of regulation. These are bad takes. The Patriots were basically playing a zone between the ten yard line and the middle of the end zone. The chances of something good happening were hilariously low compared with the odds of something very bad happening. The chances were worse than sending Gordon for the little league homer in 2014 Game 7 (and those chances were not good).

* Nothing is guaranteed blah blah blah. Absent catastrophic injury, the O/U for AFC championship games for Mahomes is something like 6.5. Do the math from there and the O/U for Super Bowl wins is probably 1.5.

* What in the world happened on the roughing the passer penalty? I don’t understand how you can just let calls like that stand.

* Maybe it is just his job, but good for Kelce for staying awesome and aggressive while completely eliminating the unsportsmanlike penalties.

[pdub]

All good points.
Roughing passer most egregious of em all—3rd and 7 from the 30 something instead of 1st and 10 at midfield with 7 mins left.

Not saying the Chiefs would get that last stop there but a much better chance to win. Mahomes was feeling it—we charge down the field and score again with four minutes left and up 11?

[pdub]

And I like the must go for 2 if the other team gets a TD but I don’t see the issue with college rules.

I know it’s a bit odd just lining up at the 25 but it’s exciting and fair for both teams.

[LVCHawk]

I believe Mahomes led a game winning drive in every game they lost this year, last night included. For the national sports talk losers thinking he can't win big games, he put his team in position every game and the defense always allowed the other team back down the field to win the game. The kid didn't have a "bad" game all year, which is incredible.

The only game they stopped someone was Baltimore who couldn't pass.

[pdub]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sporti ... ml1fskjln9

“In the end, the somewhat sudden and quite deathly end, the most valuable player in the NFL had as much to say about whether his team would reach the Super Bowl as the person occupying seat 3 of row 10 in section 302 at Arrowhead Stadium.”

[jfish26]

Another couple for my list:

* The Chiefs need to have a hard conversation with Eric Berry this offseason. They can’t have the roster and gameplan held hostage like this again. No one can question Berry’s resolve or talent, but it’s hard to walk away from this disaster and not have some feelings that Berry is a bit selfish.

* Injuries played a big part of this season for the Chiefs, perhaps none more important than Earl Thomas breaking his dang leg a week before the Chiefs were trading for him.

[LVCHawk]

I read last night Brady is 3-0 in postseason overtime games. All 3 times they won the coin toss and the other team never got the ball. For as good as Brady and the Pats have been over the years, which they are the best over, but for as good as they've been they also have had absurd luck which really sucks for everyone else. Just last night, the muffed punt which someone may not have touched them but it gets overruled, the game ending interception where the moron just happens to line up offsides.

[jfish26]

I read last night Brady is 3-0 in postseason overtime games. All 3 times they won the coin toss and the other team never got the ball. For as good as Brady and the Pats have been over the years, which they are the best over, but for as good as they've been they also have had absurd luck which really sucks for everyone else. Just last night, the muffed punt which someone may not have touched them but it gets overruled, the game ending interception where the moron just happens to line up offsides.

It is certainly the case that no coach or manager in any sport (in my recollection) is more comprehensively prepared to capitalize on luck and opportunity than Belichick is.

[Deleted User 183]

[jfish26]

I don’t like that at all. Feels like Brady is making the moment about himself. There’s an entire offseason for Brady to reach out to Mahomes.

[pdub]

Yup.

[LVCHawk]

He would have pouted or avoided Mahomes if Dee Ford wouldn't have been offsides, which is fine but praising him for being a good sport in a win is stupid.

[CrimsonNBlue]

* This one is about the refs: I don’t know how you overturn the Edelman call, but uphold the catch that followed where the ball hit the ground. In my opinion, the video evidence didn’t meet the necessary standard to overturn the punt call, but if what video there was was in fact enough, then there was more than enough to overturn that catch.

I don't see this one. The catch rules are changed. Hogan never lost control of the ball, hence the play stood.

The muffed punt was much closer and is another example of the imperfections of replay. Certainly wasn't anything there to confirm the call. Then it becomes what do the videos suggest--letting it stand or conclusive evidence to overturn it. The latter would suggest that there would need to be evidence that the ball was never touched. Hence, almost proving a negative. If you asked 100 people to look at that video, I bet you'd get 50 "no he didn't touch it" and 50 "he might have touched it." Gene Steratore showed the videos that he believed proved Edelman didn't touch it. Still, probably a little doubt that it "might" have been touched. What does that mean in terms of the rule standard? I don't know, and I don't think the NFL knows either.

But, what is lost is that the muffed punt did not matter at all. 2 plays after, the chiefs intercepted the ball and 2 plays after that they scored a TD. I just can't say the refs were a big factor in this game, especially when on the same day, they were 100% a factor in the outcome of the other game.

[pdub]

Of course you “can’t”.
Because the Chiefs lost.

[CrimsonNBlue]

* I don’t think college OT rules are the right path, but I think both teams have to get the ball. Maybe if one team scores a TD, the other team must go for 2 if they score.

This is correct. Both the NFL and college rules are bad. Probably should get rid of kickoffs in the NFL and both teams should get the ball. But eliminate the shitty part about college OT: starting at the 25 is asinine and the NFL will absolutely not allow 8 OT possibilities.

* Belichick gifted the Chiefs the review late in the 4th where he called a timeout. That play wasn’t going to be reviewed otherwise.

I'm glad someone else caught this. I was thinking entire time that BB had to be kicking himself. That was a mental error that he usually doesn't make.

* Hopefully it’s purely a youth/inexperience thing, but Mahomes must grow out of (or otherwise solve) these weird and janky starts. He knows it, Reid knows it.

It's just inexperience. Mahomes was bad the first half. Personally cost the Chiefs 10 points. But, the flip side is how awesome he was in crunch time. The Chiefs have a QB that led a drive with 40 seconds left against the flipping patriots to tie the game and go into OT. All losses suck, but this should not be crushing for chiefs fans.

[vmlb]

Rehashing last night:
Reid has never learned that he needed to play defense with his offense.
The drive that started with 3:26 to go in the game, he ran the ball 1 time. Hence the drive was for 1:29.
If he runs the ball 5 times, for 0 yards, in that drive, they win the game. Every play was a pass play except the TD run from the one yard line. Memories of the Colts loss.
I will give him credit for calling a TO when the Pats were going to score. That at least got us into OT.
Pats Oline was better then Chefs. That was the difference in the game. Also Gronk>Kelce. Pats had 48 rushing attempts, Chefs had 12. I wonder why our dline was tired in the OT?

On to the off season. Gonna be fun seeing who gets signed, who gets released, who gets drafted.
Do you sign Hill? Ford? Patty?
Do you release Houston?
Does Berry get offseason surgery? Will he be ready by game 3?
Do they get some LBs in the draft? Joe? Am I just being a homer? Mr. Wise?
Mitch Morris? Resign or let him walk?

[jfish26]

* This one is about the refs: I don’t know how you overturn the Edelman call, but uphold the catch that followed where the ball hit the ground. In my opinion, the video evidence didn’t meet the necessary standard to overturn the punt call, but if what video there was was in fact enough, then there was more than enough to overturn that catch.

I don't see this one. The catch rules are changed. Hogan never lost control of the ball, hence the play stood.

The muffed punt was much closer and is another example of the imperfections of replay. Certainly wasn't anything there to confirm the call. Then it becomes what do the videos suggest--letting it stand or conclusive evidence to overturn it. The latter would suggest that there would need to be evidence that the ball was never touched. Hence, almost proving a negative. If you asked 100 people to look at that video, I bet you'd get 50 "no he didn't touch it" and 50 "he might have touched it." Gene Steratore showed the videos that he believed proved Edelman didn't touch it. Still, probably a little doubt that it "might" have been touched. What does that mean in terms of the rule standard? I don't know, and I don't think the NFL knows either.

But, what is lost is that the muffed punt did not matter at all. 2 plays after, the chiefs intercepted the ball and 2 plays after that they scored a TD. I just can't say the refs were a big factor in this game, especially when on the same day, they were 100% a factor in the outcome of the other game.

I don't think you have to play the "what happened next" game with every call or decision or play. The calls, decisions and plays can exist in a vacuum, for purposes of discussion.

The standard for overturning calls is supposed to be a lot higher than what was applied in the muffed punt case.

[Deleted User 183]

Fish / PDub / LVC - Really?????
It's simply an example of class and respect and you're choosing to find fault with it?
Hopefully one day you'll appreciate it in regards to your QB doing the same.

https://sports.yahoo.com/tom-bradys-mes ... 38899.html

[jfish26]

Rehashing last night:
Reid has never learned that he needed to play defense with his offense.
The drive that started with 3:26 to go in the game, he ran the ball 1 time. Hence the drive was for 1:29.
If he runs the ball 5 times, for 0 yards, in that drive, they win the game. Every play was a pass play except the TD run from the one yard line. Memories of the Colts loss.
I will give him credit for calling a TO when the Pats were going to score. That at least got us into OT.
Pats Oline was better then Chefs. That was the difference in the game. Also Gronk>Kelce. Pats had 48 rushing attempts, Chefs had 12. I wonder why our dline was tired in the OT?

On to the off season. Gonna be fun seeing who gets signed, who gets released, who gets drafted.
Do you sign Hill? Ford? Patty?
Do you release Houston?
Does Berry get offseason surgery? Will he be ready by game 3?
Do they get some LBs in the draft? Joe? Am I just being a homer? Mr. Wise?
Mitch Morris? Resign or let him walk?

I strongly disagree with this. The Chiefs run game, when used as a primary attack and not a complementary option, is awful. I understand that there comes a time when you play defense with your offense, but that's limited to when you're in field goal range and only need a field goal to win (if your running stalls).

In the situation the Chiefs were in, you never ever don't use your best stuff to get a touchdown, whenever it comes.

[CrimsonNBlue]

* This one is about the refs: I don’t know how you overturn the Edelman call, but uphold the catch that followed where the ball hit the ground. In my opinion, the video evidence didn’t meet the necessary standard to overturn the punt call, but if what video there was was in fact enough, then there was more than enough to overturn that catch.

I don't see this one. The catch rules are changed. Hogan never lost control of the ball, hence the play stood.

The muffed punt was much closer and is another example of the imperfections of replay. Certainly wasn't anything there to confirm the call. Then it becomes what do the videos suggest--letting it stand or conclusive evidence to overturn it. The latter would suggest that there would need to be evidence that the ball was never touched. Hence, almost proving a negative. If you asked 100 people to look at that video, I bet you'd get 50 "no he didn't touch it" and 50 "he might have touched it." Gene Steratore showed the videos that he believed proved Edelman didn't touch it. Still, probably a little doubt that it "might" have been touched. What does that mean in terms of the rule standard? I don't know, and I don't think the NFL knows either.

But, what is lost is that the muffed punt did not matter at all. 2 plays after, the chiefs intercepted the ball and 2 plays after that they scored a TD. I just can't say the refs were a big factor in this game, especially when on the same day, they were 100% a factor in the outcome of the other game.

I don't think you have to play the "what happened next" game with every call or decision or play. The calls, decisions and plays can exist in a vacuum, for purposes of discussion.

The standard for overturning calls is supposed to be a lot higher than what was applied in the muffed punt case.

Well, I mean unless I misunderstood your post, you said the game was about the refs. To me, Reid, Suttton, Belichick and Brady had a much bigger effect on the outcome of the game than the stripes. I don't think the Chiefs are getting an apology from the league office like New Orleans did.