Vick

[NDballer13]

He had 4 points during the first 39 minutes on Saturday. His last point at ISU came with 13 minutes left in the first half. Sure, his season totals look nice, but lonestar isn't wrong by saying he hasn't been scoring. You can score 30 points one game, 4 the next, and guess what? You're still "averaging" 17 per game.

Of those 6 games he's averaging 15, how many halves has he had less than 5? That's what he means by scorer not scoring.

[CrimsonNBlue]

Just ready for the era to be over with.

[Deleted User 75]

Are we holding him to the standard that he should be a 20pt+ a night scorer?

Seems a little unrealistic to me.

He's never been consistent like that.

[pdub]

Here's a 7 game stretch of early B12 play from our no. 2 scorer Svi last season:
22, 17, 1, 2, 10, 9, 16

[Deleted User 89]

nobody but illy thought that’s what you were saying. nobody said to bench vick, or grimes, but rather to just mix things up with how and when their minutes are used.

No. Nobody thought he was saying take his minutes to zero... not even illy. But thanks for your help and for your insightful post.

by my definition, benching is not equivalent to being removed from the starting lineup

[Deleted User 75]

nobody but illy thought that’s what you were saying. nobody said to bench vick, or grimes, but rather to just mix things up with how and when their minutes are used.

No. Nobody thought he was saying take his minutes to zero... not even illy. But thanks for your help and for your insightful post.

by my definition, benching is not equivalent to being removed from the starting lineup

Now I'm lost.

[PhDhawk]

He had 4 points during the first 39 minutes on Saturday. His last point at ISU came with 13 minutes left in the first half. Sure, his season totals look nice, but lonestar isn't wrong by saying he hasn't been scoring. You can score 30 points one game, 4 the next, and guess what? You're still "averaging" 17 per game.

Of those 6 games he's averaging 15, how many halves has he had less than 5? That's what he means by scorer not scoring.

He's streaky.

Also, with the possible exception of Sr. Mason, guys have good games and bad games. UK defended him really well, Bilas wanted him to force the issue, I think that's a mistake.

He got taken out of the game, this wasn't an example of him disappearing, which he's done in the past, and it wasn't like he was the turnover machine that he was for a stretch of games earlier this year.

[Deleted User 75]

Here's a 7 game stretch of early B12 play from our no. 2 scorer Svi last season:
22, 17, 1, 2, 10, 9, 16

Shoulda benched him.

[CrimsonNBlue]

I get it illy...you liked Vick's performance in the Kentucky game. I didn't. Yes, Vick has had great 30 point games. That is why I was disappointed in him Saturday. He can do more. I was expecting more. I don't believe you keep doing the same thing and expect different results. Shaking Vick up seems to have worked in the past. I like this team. But if they don't change something, I don't think the result is going to be as good as we all want.

Unfortunately Lonestar, this team is just too much like the 2015 team. Bill just has to go with what he has. In 2015 after Cliff went down, we really needed Brannen's shooting to take us anywhere. That was about as reliable as Vick has been for us. Unless Grimes sees an exorcist, we're going to have to live and die with Vick's inconsistent play.

Considering how good we came into the season, that's not ideal at all. It has not been a good season by any Kansas measurement.

[pdub]

It hasn't.
But Udoka was our 2nd best player and you could argue, at this moment without Dok, DeSousa could be our 3rd or 4th best.

[PhDhawk]

I would have liked to have seen De Sousa on Travis. Wonder how he'd have done.

[ousdahl]

pwhitt 2k!

and phd coming up on a thousand posts!

there's a half donut joke in there somewhere.

[CrimsonNBlue]

I would have liked to have seen De Sousa on Travis. Wonder how he'd have done.

I'm actually not that down about the UK game. It was apparent that we currently just don't have the dogs to go the distance with these big, talented teams. But, I liked the fight I saw out of Dedric and Dotson in that game. Quentin, to an extent, too.

[Deleted User 75]

I would have liked to have seen De Sousa on Travis. Wonder how he'd have done.

I'm actually not that down about the UK game. It was apparent that we currently just don't have the dogs to go the distance with these big, talented teams. But, I liked the fight I saw out of Dedric and Dotson in that game. Quentin, to an extent, too.

Same.

Bad matchup for us. They've got several guys who will probably play in the NBA.

[CrimsonNBlue]

Well, I was going to throw in there that it's certainly disappointing and discouraging to see that we don't have our 2 guys that could throw down with Reid.

And we still led that game early by 10. I won't feed into the narrative that you're trying to sell about this season.

[PhDhawk]

I would have liked to have seen De Sousa on Travis. Wonder how he'd have done.

I'm actually not that down about the UK game. It was apparent that we currently just don't have the dogs to go the distance with these big, talented teams. But, I liked the fight I saw out of Dedric and Dotson in that game. Quentin, to an extent, too.

Same.

Bad matchup for us. They've got several guys who will probably play in the NBA.

You lean on that NBA talent crutch way way too hard.

[Deleted User 75]

I'm actually not that down about the UK game. It was apparent that we currently just don't have the dogs to go the distance with these big, talented teams. But, I liked the fight I saw out of Dedric and Dotson in that game. Quentin, to an extent, too.

Same.

Bad matchup for us. They've got several guys who will probably play in the NBA.

You lean on that NBA talent crutch way way too hard.

Maybe.

But it seems like most national champions have multiple NBA players...

17-18 Nova: Brunson, DiVencenzio, bridges

16-17 UNC: Bradley, Jackson

15-16 Nova: Hart, Arcidiacono, plus most of the 17-18 guys.

14-15 Duke: Cook, Allen, Jones, Winslow, Okafor

13-14 Uconn: Shabazz Napier....this is the only team of the last 11 national champions to have only 1 NBA player on it. And they were an unexpected champion iirc.

12-13 UL: Dieng, Harrell

11-12 UK: Miller, MKG, AD

10-11 Uconn: kemba, lamb, plus Napier from above.

09-10 duke: curry, plumlee, Thomas....plus another 1 or 2 drafted that didn't stick.

08-09 UNC: davis, Ellington, green, Lawson, zeller, and another 1 or 2 who didn't stick (Tyler Hansbrough 1 of those).

07-08 KU: chalmers, rush, arthur. A few who didn't stick. Plus Aldrich, who didn't play much for that KU but did play in the NBA.

[pdub]

KU could have Dedric, Dotson, DeSousa, Grimes, Ochai, McCormack and another couple who didn't stick ( Dok, Vick ).

[pdub]

I agree that this team, as it is without Dok and DeSousa, is similar to the 2015 team.
Let's hope we don't get matched with a 7 seed who should be a 4.

[NDballer13]

Are we holding him to the standard that he should be a 20pt+ a night scorer?

Seems a little unrealistic to me.

He's never been consistent like that.

I wouldn't say we are holding him to a standard of 20pt+ guy, but I think we all know that for this team to be successful he needs to be closer to that guy than not. I don't think saying he can't go 20-25 minutes stretches without scoring is an unrealistic standard to hold your 2nd option to. He took one shot in the first 19 minutes of the second half on Saturday. And that shot was a contested one at the top of the key 12 seconds into the half.

I have never been less surprised when a guy averaging 15 scores 5 as I am with Vick.