Rupp Rafters Meltdown

[ousdahl]

lol illy just compared Shaedon Sharpe to TGIF lol

[Deleted User 863]

lol illy just compared Shaedon Sharpe to TGIF lol

No, I didn't.

[ousdahl]

sigh.

[MICHHAWK]

i don't think cal is going to tuck and run just because the internet lunatics are restless.

[Deleted User 863]

sigh.

Can't win with guys like CB and DH playing big minutes.

Sound familiar?


#mustplaytheunknown!

[ousdahl]

actually, no, it doesn't sound that familiar.

We haven't bickered about that in a long time.

in fact, it's been ever so slightly more chill around here for the last couple weeks, pretty much ever since another poster in the conspiracy thread casually called out "the boring and tiring fights that a few posters constantly have with ousdahl on every board."

It was almost like we collectively gained some moment of awareness!

but go figure, for illy, it was just a matter of time.

can we please just chill?

[Deleted User 863]

Sigh.

[twocoach]

well, Cal's contingency plan for Shaedon Sharpe deciding not to play has always been less "build and develop a roster top to bottom from year to year" and more "just throw more Shaedon Sharpe types at the wall and hope they'll stick"

or something. right?

so maybe the question is, why is Cal struggling? Why are UK fans giving him the hot seat treatment? why doesn't he have the luster he did, and getting the classes he got, like a few years back?

what correlation is there between the legitimizing of NIL and Cal just not getting the "twenty-six of the top 25 recruits that all go on to be first round picks" sort of talent that he needs for success? Or is there not a correlation? or is he still getting that sorta talent but something else has changed yet?

Cal is still getting good recruits. He just hasn't updated the plays he is running, which is making it a lot easier for opposing coaches to scheme against him and prevent shooters from getting good looks. His offense is stagnant and relies on offensive putbacks. He runs sets with multiple bigs put doesn't balance them with shooters. His offense is just a mess this season.

Teams are figuring out how to counter his offense faster than he can adjust to their counter.

[twocoach]

what correlation is there between the legitimizing of NIL and Cal just not getting the "twenty-six of the top 25 recruits that all go on to be first round picks" sort of talent that he needs for success? Or is there not a correlation?

There's not a correlation. His recruiting classes started taking a "dip" way before NIL when K took hold of USA basketball and Nike.

Roster management is more important now, partly because of NIL but the other change that never gets mentioned, and I believe is something that Cal is still getting used to, is the transfer rule changes. 4 of Kentucky's 5 starters began their career elsewhere. One of the reasons for that is Kentucky is also losing players to the portal in addition to the draft now. That's not sustainable. You fill in a hole here and there with transfers, but it seems to be better to recruit and develop HS players to be your core.

They need an identity. Their defense is bad right now and their offense is not much better. You can't run dribble-drive to a top level if you don't have guard talent like John Wall and Derrick Rose.

UK fans also need to calm down a little. They should be good this year, so that's unacceptable. But they had good teams in 2016, 2017, 2019, 2020, and 2022.

"His recruiting classes started taking a "dip" way before NIL when K took hold of USA basketball and Nike."

This makes zero sense. Coach K was made head coach of the USA national team back in 2005 and coached the Olympics in 08, 12 and 16. Cal didn't even start at UK until 2009.

His basketball class rankings on 24/7 since then (their site only goes back to 2011):

2011: 1
2012: 1
2013: 1
2014: 2
2015: 1
2016: 2
2017: 2
2018: 2
2019: 2
2020: 1
2021: 2
2022: 5

[CrimsonNBlue]

This makes zero sense. Coach K was made head coach of the USA national team back in 2005 and coached the Olympics in 08, 12 and 16. Cal didn't even start at UK until 2009.

It was much later than 2005 when he was given another role and he started overseeing all USAB operations giving him unfettered, and unlimited access to every player in the U18 pool. Cal (and I) bitched about it a ton and no one paid attention. K was pulling in outrageous classes and started beating Cal at his own game.

[KUTradition]

i don’t recall when exactly it was, but i do recall Cal bitching about K’s leverage

[twocoach]

on 24/7

This makes zero sense. Coach K was made head coach of the USA national team back in 2005 and coached the Olympics in 08, 12 and 16. Cal didn't even start at UK until 2009.

It was much later than 2005 when he was given another role and he started overseeing all USAB operations giving him unfettered, and unlimited access to every player in the U18 pool. Cal (and I) bitched about it a ton and no one paid attention. K was pulling in outrageous classes and started beating Cal at his own game.

That article highlighting Cal's alleged "complaints" was in 2014.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-baske ... omplained/

Duke's recruiting classes on 24/7 prior to that:
2011: 2nd
2012: 41st
2013: 9th
2014: 1st

Cal's whining seems more "there's a microphone in front of my face and I like to talk" than anything relevant. There was no outrageous class leading up to Cal's complaints from what I can see. Cal landed Karl Anthony Towns, Devin Booker, Tyler Ulis and Tres Lyles in that 2014 class that finishes 2nd to Duke's class of Jahlil Okafor, Justice Winslow, Grayson Allen and Tyus Jones by a microscopic amount.

[hoopla]

what correlation is there between the legitimizing of NIL and Cal just not getting the "twenty-six of the top 25 recruits that all go on to be first round picks" sort of talent that he needs for success? Or is there not a correlation?

There's not a correlation. His recruiting classes started taking a "dip" way before NIL when K took hold of USA basketball and Nike.

Roster management is more important now, partly because of NIL but the other change that never gets mentioned, and I believe is something that Cal is still getting used to, is the transfer rule changes. 4 of Kentucky's 5 starters began their career elsewhere. One of the reasons for that is Kentucky is also losing players to the portal in addition to the draft now. That's not sustainable. You fill in a hole here and there with transfers, but it seems to be better to recruit and develop HS players to be your core.

They need an identity. Their defense is bad right now and their offense is not much better. You can't run dribble-drive to a top level if you don't have guard talent like John Wall and Derrick Rose.

UK fans also need to calm down a little. They should be good this year, so that's unacceptable. But they had good teams in 2016, 2017, 2019, 2020, and 2022.

"His recruiting classes started taking a "dip" way before NIL when K took hold of USA basketball and Nike."

This makes zero sense. Coach K was made head coach of the USA national team back in 2005 and coached the Olympics in 08, 12 and 16. Cal didn't even start at UK until 2009.

His basketball class rankings on 24/7 since then (their site only goes back to 2011):

2011: 1
2012: 1
2013: 1
2014: 2
2015: 1
2016: 2
2017: 2
2018: 2
2019: 2
2020: 1
2021: 2
2022: 5

there is UK fans' exhibit A for the Cal-hate. you gotta do much better with that much talent for that long. should also serve as a cautionary tale for TX, but i'd love for him to go to Austin when they join SEC and get beat down by KY under a competent coach twice a year.

alternately, KY hires the guy that sucks and that's a poopshow too. its just fun to watch the soap operas, these cliffhangers leave me guessing...

[twocoach]

There's not a correlation. His recruiting classes started taking a "dip" way before NIL when K took hold of USA basketball and Nike.

Roster management is more important now, partly because of NIL but the other change that never gets mentioned, and I believe is something that Cal is still getting used to, is the transfer rule changes. 4 of Kentucky's 5 starters began their career elsewhere. One of the reasons for that is Kentucky is also losing players to the portal in addition to the draft now. That's not sustainable. You fill in a hole here and there with transfers, but it seems to be better to recruit and develop HS players to be your core.

They need an identity. Their defense is bad right now and their offense is not much better. You can't run dribble-drive to a top level if you don't have guard talent like John Wall and Derrick Rose.

UK fans also need to calm down a little. They should be good this year, so that's unacceptable. But they had good teams in 2016, 2017, 2019, 2020, and 2022.

"His recruiting classes started taking a "dip" way before NIL when K took hold of USA basketball and Nike."

This makes zero sense. Coach K was made head coach of the USA national team back in 2005 and coached the Olympics in 08, 12 and 16. Cal didn't even start at UK until 2009.

His basketball class rankings on 24/7 since then (their site only goes back to 2011):

2011: 1
2012: 1
2013: 1
2014: 2
2015: 1
2016: 2
2017: 2
2018: 2
2019: 2
2020: 1
2021: 2
2022: 5

there is UK fans' exhibit A for the Cal-hate. you gotta do much better with that much talent for that long. should also serve as a cautionary tale for TX, but i'd love for him to go to Austin when they join SEC and get beat down by KY under a competent coach twice a year.

alternately, KY hires the guy that sucks and that's a poopshow too. its just fun to watch the soap operas, these cliffhangers leave me guessing...

Maybe it should be a warning for what happens when your roster is so top heavy full of elite recruits who only stay one season and isn't balanced with lower tier guys who stay longer instead of "we should have won more!"

[twocoach]

Duke's recruiting classes didn't become consistently excellent until after Coach K stepped down from USA basketball after the 2016 Olympics. Then it fizzled (relatively) the last few years prior to his retirement.

2017: 1
2018: 1
2019: 3
2020: 3
2021: 6

[hoopla]

Maybe it should be a warning for what happens when your roster is so top heavy full of elite recruits who only stay one season and isn't balanced with lower tier guys who stay longer instead of "we should have won more!"

yeah, that's the cautionary tale piece

[twocoach]

Maybe it should be a warning for what happens when your roster is so top heavy full of elite recruits who only stay one season and isn't balanced with lower tier guys who stay longer instead of "we should have won more!"

yeah, that's the cautionary tale piece

Self seems to find the right balance and is doing a better job of identifying 2-4 year talent. Not a coincidence he is also experiencing more success than the other coaches.

[CrimsonNBlue]

partial duke recruits since 2015 and national rank:

Brandon Ingram (3)
Derryck Thornton (14)
Chase Jeter (15)
Luke Kennard (21)
Harry Giles (2)
Jayson Tatum (4)
Frank Jackson (13)
Marques Bolden (14)
Javin DeLaurier (39)
Marvin Bagley (1)
Trevon Duval (6)
Wendell Carter (7)
Gary Trent (17)
RJ Barrett (1)
Cam Reddish (2)
Zion Williamson (5)
Tre Jones (15)
Joey Baker (32)
Vernon Carey (6)
Matthew Hurt (12)
Wendell Moore (29)
Cassius Stanley (37)

0 Conference Titles. 0 Final Fours.

Was looking for this. Unreal.

[CrimsonNBlue]

Duke's recruiting classes didn't become consistently excellent until after Coach K stepped down from USA basketball after the 2016 Olympics.

Only stepped down from coaching the senior team.

[jhawks99]

There's not a correlation. His recruiting classes started taking a "dip" way before NIL when K took hold of USA basketball and Nike.

Roster management is more important now, partly because of NIL but the other change that never gets mentioned, and I believe is something that Cal is still getting used to, is the transfer rule changes. 4 of Kentucky's 5 starters began their career elsewhere. One of the reasons for that is Kentucky is also losing players to the portal in addition to the draft now. That's not sustainable. You fill in a hole here and there with transfers, but it seems to be better to recruit and develop HS players to be your core.

They need an identity. Their defense is bad right now and their offense is not much better. You can't run dribble-drive to a top level if you don't have guard talent like John Wall and Derrick Rose.

UK fans also need to calm down a little. They should be good this year, so that's unacceptable. But they had good teams in 2016, 2017, 2019, 2020, and 2022.

"His recruiting classes started taking a "dip" way before NIL when K took hold of USA basketball and Nike."

This makes zero sense. Coach K was made head coach of the USA national team back in 2005 and coached the Olympics in 08, 12 and 16. Cal didn't even start at UK until 2009.

His basketball class rankings on 24/7 since then (their site only goes back to 2011):

2011: 1
2012: 1
2013: 1
2014: 2
2015: 1
2016: 2
2017: 2
2018: 2
2019: 2
2020: 1
2021: 2
2022: 5

there is UK fans' exhibit A for the Cal-hate. you gotta do much better with that much talent for that long. should also serve as a cautionary tale for TX, but i'd love for him to go to Austin when they join SEC and get beat down by KY under a competent coach twice a year.

alternately, KY hires the guy that sucks and that's a poopshow too. its just fun to watch the soap operas, these cliffhangers leave me guessing...

Scott Drew to uk