Kansas vs Kansas State (Official Game Thread)

[CrimsonNBlue]

You have to use what you have, and if you have nothing, that's still on the staff.

We're the top college basketball program in the entire world at present.

I agree.

...but we've been unable to recruit like the top program for a bit. It changed a bit this year with Gradey MJ and Udeh. Next year that changes for good I think. We get major upgrades at guard positions.

I think Clemence and one of the littles will move on. MJ will be ready by then, it seems like he's close. Hopefully we keep McCullar. Another 1 seed.

If it were just Zuby not ready, that's one thing.

But you have two top 50 guys in Udeh and Clemence, and then spent a scholly on the D-II NPOY, and he's not playable either. It's the fact that there's not one right now.

[Deleted User 863]

You have to use what you have, and if you have nothing, that's still on the staff.

We're the top college basketball program in the entire world at present.

I agree.

...but we've been unable to recruit like the top program for a bit. It changed a bit this year with Gradey MJ and Udeh. Next year that changes for good I think. We get major upgrades at guard positions.

I think Clemence and one of the littles will move on. MJ will be ready by then, it seems like he's close. Hopefully we keep McCullar. Another 1 seed.

Honest question - why do we think MJ is "close?" We literally haven't seen him hardly at all for weeks.

He has played...19 minutes since December 1.

Because in his minutes his individual offense is there. But he's lost on defense. And he's lost enough on offense that he isn't a net positive for our main guys he's out there with.


This team is all about our main 5.

3 of those 5 had BAD nights (DH GD and KM). JW had a good night. KJ had a decent night ruined by the refs.

[pdub]

Sorry, not buying this.
At a program like ours, PARTICULARLY in a transfer portal world, getting to January 18 with 0.8 reliable bigs is a recruiting/development failure, not a personnel failure.

A Bill failure, not a Zach/Zuby/Ernest/Cam failure.

I agree that this is ( and has been ) a Bill failure.

But also with the caveat it's like critiquing a Caravaggio.
You can certainly do it but you know it's already a masterpiece.

[jfish26]

Sorry, not buying this.
At a program like ours, PARTICULARLY in a transfer portal world, getting to January 18 with 0.8 reliable bigs is a recruiting/development failure, not a personnel failure.

A Bill failure, not a Zach/Zuby/Ernest/Cam failure.

I agree that this is ( and has been ) a Bill failure.

But also with the caveat it's like critiquing a Caravaggio.
You can certainly do it but you know it's already a masterpiece.

Absolutely. He's the best in the game, and it's not close. Kansas math.

[CrimsonNBlue]

Through the Bill failure on that, also consider what he's done with KJ. That defies logic, almost.

[Deleted User 863]

You have to use what you have, and if you have nothing, that's still on the staff.

We're the top college basketball program in the entire world at present.

I agree.

...but we've been unable to recruit like the top program for a bit. It changed a bit this year with Gradey MJ and Udeh. Next year that changes for good I think. We get major upgrades at guard positions.

I think Clemence and one of the littles will move on. MJ will be ready by then, it seems like he's close. Hopefully we keep McCullar. Another 1 seed.

If it were just Zuby not ready, that's one thing.

But you have two top 50 guys in Udeh and Clemence, and then spent a scholly on the D-II NPOY, and he's not playable either. It's the fact that there's not one right now.

Ok. I feel you. But zuby was never really supposed to be ready for THIS year. Clemence was never supposed to be a 5.

I am not a fan of force outs. So they are definitely paying for the Cam mistake from a few years ago (which was an attempt to upgrade from Mitch). But I think he's earned his spot.



I agree, I think they've fumbled Udeh this season.

But I give them so much credit for how awesome KJ DH and JW have developed into that it's not fair to expect them to bat 1.000%.

[pdub]

KJ has dunked all over expectations.
Zuby and Udeh and Rice don't get to try because Self is doin' Self things.

[ousdahl]

what were Dajuan's stats after he checked back in post-head injury?

I was kinda surprised to see it happen, especially considering the increased awareness and precautions surrounding concussions.

either way, he's a tough MFer for doing so.

and either way, hope he's OK

[twocoach]

Somebody wake me up when a loss doesn't result in a bunch of "we should have played our bench guys more" discussions.

Our depth quite frankly is excellent. When KJ Adams fouled out with more than a minute left to go in regulation and we were already down McCullar, I thought KU was totally fucked. But we made it to OT and had a great chance to win.

The odds of KU starters hitting a higher rate of threes and free throws in their next game is dramatically higher than whether or not Udeh would have been the difference in winning or losing. We had too many turnovers and missed too many shots. We don't need to attack the coaching staff and lose our minds over a 1 point loss in OT on the road at a ranked and good KSU.

[DCHawk1]

JFC you're bad at this.

And only show up to talk hoops after a loss. So transparent.

please chill. Please!

I'm begging you.

please dude. What'll it take?

can we please not argue about absolutely everything?

what can I do?

what can you do?

what'll it take?

Please?

You can stop ONLY coming to the hoops board to trash our players you don't like.

You stay on the "i need help with all things life and hate my job" thread and the "i am an expert on war" thread, and we won't have any problems.

"Please chill"

LOL

Pussy.

yeah, Ousie

Quit trashing OUR players.

[AlOerter]

Kitties still have to come to the Phog and I'm pretty sure we won't have 3 starters sitting on the bench to finish the game.

[Deleted User 863]

please chill. Please!

I'm begging you.

please dude. What'll it take?

can we please not argue about absolutely everything?

what can I do?

what can you do?

what'll it take?

Please?

You can stop ONLY coming to the hoops board to trash our players you don't like.

You stay on the "i need help with all things life and hate my job" thread and the "i am an expert on war" thread, and we won't have any problems.

"Please chill"

LOL

Pussy.

yeah, Ousie

Quit trashing OUR players.

Good job. Good post.

[DCHawk1]

For now, it's still early.

I don't usually think of it that way, but whenever you say that, I remember Cole -- who played 8 mpg and averaged 2.8 ppg -- until one day, he showed up and fucking crushed Hansbro.

[DCHawk1]

I just think it's fun when Salukis tell Jayhawks how to be KU fans.

[pdub]

1. It's a loss. So posters talk about what went wrong. Or what they think went wrong. It's what happens.
2. We know Bill Self is a top notch coach. You are still allowed to critique him within reason. My personal critique is he has had issues in the past not developing depth.
3. We will kick the shit out of ksu in a couple weeks.

[twocoach]

We went to a national title game with Justin Wesley and Zac Efron as our first big and guard off the bench. Depth is dramatically overrated.

When was the last time anyone feels like we lost in a tourney game because we didn't have enough depth and not because multiple starters all had terrible days on the same day? I'd love it if Udeh was balling out right now and I am 100% confident that Self would also love that. But if he is playing more then perhaps Adams is playing less and then maybe we aren't seeing Adams blossom given the opportunity he has right now. If you play someone more, then someone else has to play LESS.

Did KJ playing microscopic minutes last year prevent him from being a stud this year? Nope, doesn't seem to have. Self seems to develop his talent just fine.

[CrimsonNBlue]

We went to a national title game with Justin Wesley and Zac Efron as our first big and guard off the bench. Depth is dramatically overrated.

When was the last time anyone feels like we lost in a tourney game because we didn't have enough depth and not because multiple starters all had terrible days on the same day? I'd love it if Udeh was balling out right now and I am 100% confident that Self would also love that. But if he is playing more then perhaps Adams is playing less and then maybe we aren't seeing Adams blossom given the opportunity he has right now. If you play someone more, then someone else has to play LESS.

Did KJ playing microscopic minutes last year prevent him from being a stud this year? Nope, doesn't seem to have. Self seems to develop his talent just fine.

I think it's less about depth and more about not having a guy that can score from the block--or more generally, the traditional advantages of having a true 5-man.

There are missing pieces to this team. But, that doesn't necessarily disqualify us from every success, just makes it less likely.

[ousdahl]

I’m looking forward to seeing how we match up with UK, who might be turning it around; and specifically how our front court handles Oscar, who had like 35 and 24 last night.

[CrimsonNBlue]

I feel like we've ran Oscar's ass out of the gym before, and we should do it one last time for good measure.

[ousdahl]

I guess that’s our scouting report thus far - we’re more of a threat to run, than in the half court.

The past few weeks, at least, our best half court look might be PnR getting KJ downhill.

That, combined with Jalen isos and Dick 3s, is a pretty good triple threat.

I imagine we’ll have all 3 going by March.