Crimscores 2023

[jfish26]

if you think everything everyone does shows up in a box score......then......we are watching different sports.

My point is: whatever "leader on the floor" traits he brings, they very much do manifest in our statistical performance (whether his or others').

I am tired of guys like Harris (and Garrett before him) getting try-hard bonus points (and getting shielded from blame when their limitations cost us).

[pdub]

This is also true.
Other point guards here have been good at the intangibles listed and also much better at the stats that can be measured.

[pdub]

Guards who played some point with over 20 MPG close to Harris's 2023 Crimscore ( .432 ):

Chalmers 2006 .494
Vonte 2016 .456
Tyshawn Taylor 2011 .408
Russ Rob 2007 .402
Tyshawn Taylor 2009 .391
Elijah Johnson 2013. .384

[Deleted User 863]

It's always hard looking back at players because it's easy to only remember the best or last version of them.

[pdub]

Here's the average Bill Self 'starter' ( 20+ MPG ) season:

11.8 PPG
4.9 RPG
2.5 APG
1.1 SPG
.6 BPG
48.1 FG%
33.8 3FG%
72.1 FT%

And the average Bill Self player, regardless of minutes, under Self:

5.8 PPG
2.7 RPG
1.2 APG
.5 SPG
.4 BPG
44.1 FG%
25.2 3FG% *
57.3 FT%

*Note that 0 percent three point shooting, dropped this value down significantly.

[jfish26]

Guards who played some point with over 20 MPG close to Harris's 2023 Crimscore ( .432 ):

Chalmers 2006 .494
Vonte 2016 .456
Tyshawn Taylor 2011 .408
Russ Rob 2007 .402
Tyshawn Taylor 2009 .391
Elijah Johnson 2013. .384

Seems about right. He’s something like a quadrant-three guard under Bill. Which isn’t supposed to come off as an insult! Makes him one of the, I don’t know, 100,000 best basketball players ever?

[ousdahl]

Where’s Tharpe on that list?

[pdub]

Which season?

2014: .381
2013: .242
2012: .052

[pdub]

Don't forget about Remy Martin 2022 .359.
( that'll get the natives restless )

Hot on his heels, Brady Morningstar 2011 .345.

[pdub]

Jalen Wilson .692 - 20.1 PPG, 8.3 RPG, 2.2 APG, 43% FG, 33.7% 3FG
Kevin McCullar .507 - 10.7 PPG, 7 RPG, 2.4 APG, 2 SPG, 44.4% FG, 29.6% 3FG
Gradey Dick .503 - 14.1 PPG, 5.1 RPG, 1.7 APG, 44.2% FG, 40.3% 3FG
KJ Adams .473 - 10.6 PPG, 4.3 RPG, 1.9 APG, 62.2% FG, 0% 3FG
Dajuan Harris .471 - 8.9 PPG, 2.5 RPG, 6.2 APG, 47.1% FG, 40.5% 3FG

Ernest Udeh .471 - 2.6 PPG, 1.8 RPG, .7 SPG, .6 BPG, 75.6% FG
Cam Martin .163 - 1.8 PPG, .5 RPG, 75% FG
Zuby Ejiofor .135 - 1.2 PPG, 1.7 RPG, 65% FG
Joseph Yesufu .132 - 4.1 PPG, 1.2 RPG, .4 APG, 36.7% FG, 28.6% 3FG
Bobby Pettiford .131 - 2.2 PPG, 1.2 RPG, 1.3 APG, 53.4% FG, 30% 3FG

Michael Jankovich .105
MJ Rice .101 - 2.2 PPG, 1 RPG, 40.8% FG
Zach Clemence .083 - 1.4 PPG, 1.3 RPG, 32.4% FG, 22.2% 3FG
Kyle Cuffe .018
Dillon Wilhite .002

[pdub]

Jalen Wilson's .692 Crimscore is 9th all time in the Bill Self era just barely finishing behind 8th place Marcus Morris 2011.

Jalen finishes 3rd in PPG at 20.1 in the Self era behind Mason 17 and Simien 05.

Jalen finishes with the highest FG per 40 in the Bill Self era at 18.1 FG/40.

Gradey Dick's 40.3% 3FG is 20th in the Bill Self era for players who attempted at least 100 3's.
He finishes 7th in 3FG% in the same category for freshmen.

Ernest Udeh's SP40 ( steals per 40 ) is 5th in the Bill Self era players 7 MIN+.

Yesufu's 28.6% 3FG is 125th for Bill Self players 7 MIN+. And the 4th worst under Bill Self for players who attempted over 50 3's in a season ( worst Jeff Hawkins in 2004 followed by Jalen Wilson last season and Charlie Moore 2019 ).

[pdub]

Hunter Dickinson .865 - 19.3 PPG, 11.3 PPG, 60.1% FG, 42.1 3FG
Kevin McCullar .816 - 20 PPG, 6.4 RPG, 4.7 APG, 49.6% FG, 36.8% 3FG
KJ Adams .575 - 12.7 PPG, 5 RPG, 3.2 APG, 62.3% FG
Dajaun Harris .404 - 7 PPG, 6.8 APG, 1.6 SPG, 41.1% FG, 42.1% 3FG
Johnny Furphy .276 - 6.6 PPG, 3.2 RPG, 47.6% FG, 37.3% 3FG
Elmarko Jackson .224 - 4.8 PPG, 1.4 RPG, 2.4 APG, 36.4% FG
Parker Braun .213 - 2.8 PPG, 1.7 RPG, 73.3% FG
Nicolas Timberlake .150 - 4 PPG, 1.3 RPG, 38.2% FG, 28.9% 3FG
Jamari McDowell .109 - 1.7 PPG, 1.2 RPG, 25% FG

[pdub]

Hunter, sigh, currently has the best Crimscore under Bill Self.
Kevin McCullar the third best.

[ousdahl]

I was gonna comment how our PG’s numbers have regressed since last year, and at a 5th year senior still hovering around so many other guards’ underclassman numbers

Then I realized Dajuan and Dejuan must be different players

[DeletedUser]

I was gonna comment how our PG’s numbers have regressed since last year

No surprise you never responded to the post explaining why he has 2 less points per game.

I hope you enjoy the next year and a half of KU basketball with DH as the starting PG. At worst it gives you yet another chance to complain about something you appear to know very little about. Yay us!

[pdub]

We have talked about this being an issue but it's showing in the numbers ( of course has to do with usage as well ) - Johnny Furphy is our 5th best player at the moment with a .276.

The last time our 5th player had a Crimscore sub .300 was in 2009 with Brady Morningstar ( .292 ).

The worst 5th player score we ever had was Christian Moody in 2005 with a .273.

[jfish26]

We have talked about this being an issue but it's showing in the numbers ( of course has to do with usage as well ) - Johnny Furphy is our 5th best player at the moment with a .276.

The last time our 5th player had a Crimscore sub .300 was in 2009 with Brady Morningstar ( .292 ).

The worst 5th player score we ever had was Christian Moody in 2005 with a .273.

Yep. This goes back to GM Bill. Once again, we have guys in too-big roles.

Harris should be our fifth best guy.

Furphy/Jackson should be our sixth- or seventh-best guys - at most.

We have Arterio- and Ernest-shaped holes.

[DeletedUser]

I don't see an Ernest shaped hole on this team. Parker has more than held his own when he's been in for HD.

[pdub]

Kind of agree but only in hindsight.
Elmarko was a borderline 5 star guy - top 20 dude - so you should be able to slot a guy of that caliber as our fifth best guy - and then you could also see the promise of Harris ( we saw his faults for sure but you could see how he could get there ) to be your 4th best guy.

[jfish26]

Kind of agree but only in hindsight.
Elmarko was a borderline 5 star guy - top 20 dude - so you should be able to slot a guy of that caliber as our fifth best guy - and then you could also see the promise of Harris ( we saw his faults for sure but you could see how he could get there ) to be your 4th best guy.

Of course I agree with you - and Bill gets a lot of cash in part BECAUSE he wears two hats. And at least one of those two hats (or maybe both) isn't fitting right in terms of freshman guards.