This Team

[jfish26]

Shit assist and steal numbers.
Same steals per game as player B and more steals per game than player C.
.8 fewer assists per game than player B and .2 fewer assists per game than player C.

“But the first part of the flight went fine,” said no one ever on a crashing plane.

[Deleted User 183]

As far as Vick, sure he needs to look in the mirror but I feel some blame lies on Self. He knew what he was getting and was expecting/hoping he would get something more.
Some blame also lies on the athletic department and the University. Vick may be a great kid other than the one alleged "incident" (in which the University felt he was most likely guilty and "recommended" two years of school probation) but he probably never should have been welcomed back.


I honestly believe this......
No matter how/where we finish in conference, some people will vote for Self to be the Big 12 COY and some people wouldn't even give him a top 7 or 8 if it went that far.
A lot of "turmoil" this season and if we can still someway come out on top - he gets my COY vote.
I'll be very interested at the end of the season to see if Self doesn't hint that he may have had enough and just may explore his other options.

[jfish26]

As far as Vick, sure he needs to look in the mirror but I feel some blame lies on Self. He knew what he was getting and was expecting/hoping he would get something more.
Some blame also lies on the athletic department and the University. Vick may be a great kid other than the one alleged "incident" (in which the University felt he was most likely guilty and "recommended" two years of school probation) but he probably never should have been welcomed back.


I honestly believe this......
No matter how/where we finish in conference, some people will vote for Self to be the Big 12 COY and some people wouldn't even give him a top 7 or 8 if it went that far.
A lot of "turmoil" this season and if we can still someway come out on top - he gets my COY vote.
I'll be very interested at the end of the season to see if Self doesn't hint that he may have had enough and just may explore his other options.

One crisis at a time, please.

[Deleted User 183]

Fish - The nice thing is I laughed at your comment. Sure this season sucks at the moment but it sure is great to be spoiled as KU fans. Wouldn't take any other program other than ours since my first day on campus back in 1984. Maybe there have been a few more championships won by other programs since then but overall continued success, KU is second to none.

[Deleted User 75]

Vick isn't the problem. The overall lack of talent on the roster is the problem.

Dotson has been great, no complaints. Dedric has put up monster numbers, no complaints, but I can see how his Memphis teams didn't have very good records. His impact on the box score tends to outweigh his impact on the result of the game imo. Garrett has been great defensively, but he's awful offensively shooting wise and that really hurts Dedric when he's in because you don't have to guard MG outside of the paint. Not sure he's starter quality at a place like Kansas unless he's surrounded by 4 guys with offensive firepower. We've got 1.5 guys (dedric, and Vick about half the time).

After those 2, agbaji has been decent, but he's had multiple duds in his short season too. Vick has had huge games, but many duds as well....but that didn't surprise me because we had 3 years of evidence to let us know that was to be expected.

No complaints about DMac. He wasn't supposed to be a factor this year if Dok was healthy.

People who thought Vick had this unlimited potential to be a 2nd best player on a top 3 team were just being overly enthusiastic/optimistic. He's just not that good. He's not having a bad season imo. He just isn't good enough to consistently score 20pts a night. Very few guys we've had during the Self era could average 20pts per game. He's not consistent. He hasn't been for 3 years. You can't just flip a switch and become someone you're not just because your coach built a shitty roster.

This year is on Self.

[pdub]

I can't put the full year on Self ( most of our players could play better in their spots ) but Illy's closer to what is actually happening.

[kubandalum]

How do players reach this level of the sport and still have so many turnovers? Given the fact that they do, Self and his coaches certainly haven’t fixed it.

[CrimsonNBlue]

I don’t know that anyone has stated that Vick is thee problem, but it’s obvious that he is one of a handful of big problems that is contributing to this team crashing and burning. Fish is spot on with the plane crash analogy.

The biggest storylines of this season are almost all bad:

1. Grimes bad
2. Silvio de Sadface
3. Udoka injury
4. Vick space cadet
5. Dedric Big 12 POY candidate
6. Agbaji surprise
7. Dotson good

[PhDhawk]

Vick isn't the problem. The overall lack of talent on the roster is the problem.

Dotson has been great, no complaints. Dedric has put up monster numbers, no complaints, but I can see how his Memphis teams didn't have very good records. His impact on the box score tends to outweigh his impact on the result of the game imo. Garrett has been great defensively, but he's awful offensively shooting wise and that really hurts Dedric when he's in because you don't have to guard MG outside of the paint. Not sure he's starter quality at a place like Kansas unless he's surrounded by 4 guys with offensive firepower. We've got 1.5 guys (dedric, and Vick about half the time).

After those 2, agbaji has been decent, but he's had multiple duds in his short season too. Vick has had huge games, but many duds as well....but that didn't surprise me because we had 3 years of evidence to let us know that was to be expected.

No complaints about DMac. He wasn't supposed to be a factor this year if Dok was healthy.

People who thought Vick had this unlimited potential to be a 2nd best player on a top 3 team were just being overly enthusiastic/optimistic. He's just not that good. He's not having a bad season imo. He just isn't good enough to consistently score 20pts a night. Very few guys we've had during the Self era could average 20pts per game. He's not consistent. He hasn't been for 3 years. You can't just flip a switch and become someone you're not just because your coach built a shitty roster.

This year is on Self.

Self assembled a team where the sum of the parts is greater than the whole.

But, he didn't injure Dok or Garrett. And I'm not sure what percentage of blame he deserves for De Sousa.

[twocoach]

I don’t recall this much unified blame on one guy since Elijah or Tharpe and those dudes were worse than Vick.

I dont blame just Vick. We have a ton of problems that have been exposed. A freshman backcourt, a top 10 recuit who we needed to be OAD good but who looks to need 3 years, our best big out for the year, our best big off the bench out for the year, our best perimeter defender being a terrible perimeter shooter (and now out injured), our lone senior being an inconsistent flake and a coach who hasn't had to coach a team without a floor general PG for 3 years.

When you finish the most important game of the season to date and say that only Lightfoot and Moore performed at or above their expectation, it's not encouraging.

[twocoach]

How do players reach this level of the sport and still have so many turnovers? Given the fact that they do, Self and his coaches certainly haven’t fixed it.

Lack of focus. Lack of "been there done that" experience. Lack of continuity individually and as a unit in knowing what to do in your role.

[twocoach]

All that said, I fully believe we would be a top 5 team with both Dok and De Sousa playing all year.

[pdub]

All that said, I fully believe we would be a top 5 team with both Dok and De Sousa playing all year.

I agree.
Dok would be a 1b and would open the offense and significantly help the defense.
Vick wouldn't have as much pressure to score.
And DeSousa would have taken any/all of Lightfoot and KJ's minutes.

[twocoach]

Fish - The nice thing is I laughed at your comment. Sure this season sucks at the moment but it sure is great to be spoiled as KU fans. Wouldn't take any other program other than ours since my first day on campus back in 1984. Maybe there have been a few more championships won by other programs since then but overall continued success, KU is second to none.

Agreed. It's odd realizing that this is how most fans feel about their team this time of year. Only a all hamdful of fan bases feel like they are still in it and can make a run. We haven't had this in a while.

Hopefully this is a one year thing.

[PhDhawk]

Bully ball. We'd play inside out. It would open things up for the perimeter guys to drive or shoot.

Playing outside in relies on the perimeter guys and that's not our strength. Someone like Grimes is going to be much better if he has wide open looks or space to get by someone, but if you're relying on him to get his shot off over a defender or create something, we're hurting.

And Lawson's a great rebounder, not good but great....but man he doesn't take up space, he's not a rim-protector. No one's afraid to attack the rim with him as our lone big.

[NDballer13]

And 'collecting buckets' is what this team needs.

This team needs it consistently, not a guy to score 29 one game just for people to say he's averaging 16 points the last 2 games.

[pdub]

And I'm not sure what percentage of blame he deserves for De Sousa.

I think a good amount of the percentage.
Either he knew and was involved in the process ( 100% blame ).
He knew about the process and turned a blind eye ( 85% blame ).
Or he didn't know but didn't do his homework ( 51% blame ).

[PhDhawk]

No complaints about DMac. He wasn't supposed to be a factor this year if Dok was healthy.

I agree with your take. He should have been 5th on the depth chart.

But should he really be given a free pass? He's a McD's AA and top 30 recruit. He didn't even play in the game yesterday and that's with Dok out, no SDS, Garrett hurt, Mitch as the only other big, and we played 2 bigs a lot of the time.

[PhDhawk]

And I'm not sure what percentage of blame he deserves for De Sousa.

I think a good amount of the percentage.
Either he knew and was involved in the process ( 100% blame ).
He knew about the process and turned a blind eye ( 85% blame ).
Or he didn't know but didn't do his homework ( 51% blame ).

Well, with De Sousa suspended and Dok out...Why hasn't McCormack been brought along to the point where he could be counted on for 10-15 mpg?

How much of that is on McCormack and how much is on the staff?

[NewtonHawk11]

And I'm not sure what percentage of blame he deserves for De Sousa.

I think a good amount of the percentage.
Either he knew and was involved in the process ( 100% blame ).
He knew about the process and turned a blind eye ( 85% blame ).
Or he didn't know but didn't do his homework ( 51% blame ).

Well, with De Sousa suspended and Dok out...Why hasn't McCormack been brought along to the point where he could be counted on for 10-15 mpg?

How much of that is on McCormack and how much is on the staff?

Not many big post guys come in ready to play for Self. They are more of 3-4 year guys. Especially with Dok and SDS stuff happening in the thick of the season, it's really tough to get him time in practice and whatnot. Practice times/days are so limited during the season. Mainly walkthrough type of stuff.