Israel/Palestine

[Shirley]

Pussy:

Moment Hamas spokesperson ends BBC interview abruptly after being challenged

[Shirley]

Fmr Israeli PM Naftali Bennett to BBC: “You’ve taken the side of Hamas. Shame on you”

[dolomite]

Hamas = uncivilized, savages, barbarians.
Cease fire? Not a chance in Hell!

[RainbowsandUnicorns]

It's a really murky issue, in part because - and I thought about saying this in a snarkier way but I won't - we in the modern west (1) have a bent toward political correctness (and, thankfully, tolerance), and (2) really don't have a great modern point of reference for what I understand is correctly termed "Lesser Jihad."*

Are all (or even most) adherents to Islam, terrorists? Or even terrorist-sympathizers? Of course not. And restraint in suggesting or concluding otherwise is well-intentioned and in good faith; I'm glad that the bomb-the-desert-and-the-brown-people-in-their-caves troglodyte types are now the ugly, gross exceptions to the norm.

However, we in the modern west might have a bit of a blind spot to how dangerous the radicals are, because the notion of outright religious violence (yes, what we'd perceive to be "indiscriminate" violence) is something we in the modern west consider to be a relic.

Unfortunately, it is not.

This all relates to your question, because I think (without saying this is GOOD) it's more socially acceptable in our discourse to trade in stereotypes of Jews than in stereotypes of Islamic people.

* Go look up "Greater Jihad" and try to tell me, with a straight face, that you don't hear it echoing throughout the religious right. Every. Single. Accusation. Is. A. Confession.

thanks for the thoughtful response

nuance aside, i’m more just curious about what everyone else has seen/read. i know my intake is biased, despite my efforts at “fair and balanced”, but are others seeing the same sort of pattern in the specific language used?

as an example, i’ve not seen anything akin to “extermination of jewish rats” aimed at Palestinians. but, just because i’ve not seen it doesn’t mean that such rhetoric doesn’t exist

I posted here about the Israeli defense minister calling Palestinians “animals,” for one.

Shirley also posted some meme like “why is mooslims the source of all the world’s problems!?!”

Tho I guess Shirley added a note like, *some

Right, and I posted on here about you making a false claim/accusation.
Once again, Gallant (the Israeli Defense Minister) was referring to HAMAS TERRORISTS and not "Palestinian" civilians. His exact words...
“We are fighting human animals and we are acting accordingly”.

[ousdahl]

well, considering how little care Israel is taking to distinguish HAMAS TERRORISTS from "Palestinian" civilians, what good does it do to point that out?

case in point:

[ousdahl]

Indiscriminately, one might say.

https://www.instagram.com/reel/Cy4CUxnP ... BiNWFlZA==

[ousdahl]

Here’s another thought:

Considering how indiscriminately Israel is carpet bombing Gaza, with the rationale that Hamas terrorists could be hiding anywhere, how do they know where Hamas terrorists are hiding Israeli hostages?

Wouldn’t want anything more to happen to those poor folks.

[Shirley]

When a Jew dies, it's a victory for Hamas.

When a Palestinian dies, it's a victory for Hamas.

[ousdahl]

Meh, if Hamas was a shade or two lighter, they just might be getting less “terrorist” and more “freedom fighter” rhetoric, and we’d be hearing all about how they have the right to resist illegal invasions and to defend themselves from their colonial occupiers, maybe even with weapons paid for by you and me.

Either way, that post is a helluva way to reply to concerns that Israel might be bombing the very hostages they claim to be trying to rescue

[Shirley]

Meh, if Hamas was a shade or two lighter, they just might be getting less “terrorist” and more “freedom fighter” rhetoric, and we’d be hearing all about how they have the right to resist illegal invasions and to defend themselves from their colonial occupiers, maybe even with weapons paid for by you and me.

Either way, that post is a helluva way to reply to concerns that Israel might be bombing the very hostages they claim to be trying to rescue

A reason why, among others, I have little to no desire to engage with you:

"Wouldn’t want anything more to happen to those poor folks.

[ousdahl]

Umm bro I mean that comment sincerely.

[Shirley]

Umm bro I mean that comment sincerely.

I considered that. Typed a response and deleted it.

But then, taken in context, it's hard to square.

I'll choose to believe you, I guess.

[ousdahl]

why the fuck would you not believe me?

unless you're attempting to paint me as antisemitic again.

it's not antisemitic to criticize a radical right wing militant religious-ethno-nationalist government in Israel.

speaking of which...

[ousdahl]

honest question:

is it just me, media bias, or reality that the language used by anti-semites is notable worse than that used by islamophobes?

it sure seems like there is a stark difference in the level of hate

It's a really murky issue, in part because - and I thought about saying this in a snarkier way but I won't - we in the modern west (1) have a bent toward political correctness (and, thankfully, tolerance), and (2) really don't have a great modern point of reference for what I understand is correctly termed "Lesser Jihad."*

Are all (or even most) adherents to Islam, terrorists? Or even terrorist-sympathizers? Of course not. And restraint in suggesting or concluding otherwise is well-intentioned and in good faith; I'm glad that the bomb-the-desert-and-the-brown-people-in-their-caves troglodyte types are now the ugly, gross exceptions to the norm.

However, we in the modern west might have a bit of a blind spot to how dangerous the radicals are, because the notion of outright religious violence (yes, what we'd perceive to be "indiscriminate" violence) is something we in the modern west consider to be a relic.

Unfortunately, it is not.

This all relates to your question, because I think (without saying this is GOOD) it's more socially acceptable in our discourse to trade in stereotypes of Jews than in stereotypes of Islamic people.

* Go look up "Greater Jihad" and try to tell me, with a straight face, that you don't hear it echoing throughout the religious right. Every. Single. Accusation. Is. A. Confession.

now do Zionism.

[RainbowsandUnicorns]

well, considering how little care Israel is taking to distinguish HAMAS TERRORISTS from "Palestinian" civilians, what good does it do to point that out?

case in point:

It would be similar for you to say the Black kids who are in the Black Disciples gang that raped and killed the White girl after school in Chicago were complete assholes and deserve to die for what they did.
Then I go and claim you said, ALL Blacks kids in Chicago are assholes and deserve to die.

But hey, considering Black kids who are in the Black Disciples gang are still raping and killing white kids, what good does it do for me to point out the differences?

[jfish26]

Here’s another thought:

Considering how indiscriminately Israel is carpet bombing Gaza, with the rationale that Hamas terrorists could be hiding anywhere, how do they know where Hamas terrorists are hiding Israeli hostages?

Wouldn’t want anything more to happen to those poor folks.

You are not using "indiscriminately" or "carpet bombing" correctly.

If that's because you don't know what they mean, you should look up what they mean.

If you DO know what they mean, then you're misusing them for hyperbolic effect - which weakens your point.

[jfish26]

honest question:

is it just me, media bias, or reality that the language used by anti-semites is notable worse than that used by islamophobes?

it sure seems like there is a stark difference in the level of hate

It's a really murky issue, in part because - and I thought about saying this in a snarkier way but I won't - we in the modern west (1) have a bent toward political correctness (and, thankfully, tolerance), and (2) really don't have a great modern point of reference for what I understand is correctly termed "Lesser Jihad."*

Are all (or even most) adherents to Islam, terrorists? Or even terrorist-sympathizers? Of course not. And restraint in suggesting or concluding otherwise is well-intentioned and in good faith; I'm glad that the bomb-the-desert-and-the-brown-people-in-their-caves troglodyte types are now the ugly, gross exceptions to the norm.

However, we in the modern west might have a bit of a blind spot to how dangerous the radicals are, because the notion of outright religious violence (yes, what we'd perceive to be "indiscriminate" violence) is something we in the modern west consider to be a relic.

Unfortunately, it is not.

This all relates to your question, because I think (without saying this is GOOD) it's more socially acceptable in our discourse to trade in stereotypes of Jews than in stereotypes of Islamic people.

* Go look up "Greater Jihad" and try to tell me, with a straight face, that you don't hear it echoing throughout the religious right. Every. Single. Accusation. Is. A. Confession.

now do Zionism.

How does that relate to the purpose of my response to trad? Or are you just reflexively bothsidesing here?

[RainbowsandUnicorns]

Here’s another thought:

Considering how indiscriminately Israel is carpet bombing Gaza, with the rationale that Hamas terrorists could be hiding anywhere, how do they know where Hamas terrorists are hiding Israeli hostages?

Wouldn’t want anything more to happen to those poor folks.

Israel isn't "indiscriminately" carpet bombing Gaza with the "rationale" that Hamas terrorists could be hiding anywhere.
Where did you see/hear/read that and from who/m did you see/hear/read that from?
Israel has a thought out strategy.

The Israelis do know where some of the hostages are being held but not all of them. It's a horrible situation in which one thing they have to consider is - if the lives of 200 or so people are worth potentially losing the lives of more than 200 people IN Israel.

[Shirley]

With Netanyahu at the helm, I'm not optimistic, at all.

October 31, 2023-The question of whether Israel has a right to defend itself is an absurd one. States don't have rights. They have capacities. A better question is how should Israel defend itself in a way that is smart, strategic and reflects long term thinking.

Mitchell Minute 1708-The Absurdity of Right to Defend Itself Question

[DCHawk1]

Here’s another thought:

Considering how indiscriminately Israel is carpet bombing Gaza, with the rationale that Hamas terrorists could be hiding anywhere, how do they know where Hamas terrorists are hiding Israeli hostages?

Wouldn’t want anything more to happen to those poor folks.

You are not using "indiscriminately" or "carpet bombing" correctly.

If that's because you don't know what they mean, you should look up what they mean.

If you DO know what they mean, then you're misusing them for hyperbolic effect - which weakens your point.

He knows. He just doesn't care.