COOOOOOOOGARS

[DeletedUser]

it's alllllmost like these 1 year rentals of big "stars" that only play from themselves don't lead to the toughest "teams". Gee, that's odd.

It's weird.

I don't get that impression from KM. And I was as skeptical as anyone about him coming into his 1st year at KU.

I actually don't get the feeling that HD plays only "for himself". I actually think he's been a good teammate at KU. A lot better than I expected.

But toughness isn't developed overnight. Especially team toughness. And often times you're only as tough as the weakest link....and we've got some really weak links in our rotation.

Very weird year. HD KM and Kj all surpassed my expectations for themselves individually this year....but Elmarko and Timberlake essentially being our bench has really killed us.

No hate to Parker Braun. He's been better than I expected and was never meant to play a larger role than he's played.

[TDub]

it's alllllmost like these 1 year rentals of big "stars" that only play from themselves don't lead to the toughest "teams". Gee, that's odd.

It's weird.

I don't get that impression from KM. And I was as skeptical as anyone about him coming into his 1st year at KU.

I actually don't get the feeling that HD plays only "for himself". I actually think he's been a good teammate at KU. A lot better than I expected.

But toughness isn't developed overnight. Especially team toughness. And often times you're only as tough as the weakest link....and we've got some really weak links in our rotation.

Very weird year. HD KM and Kj all surpassed my expectations for themselves individually this year....but Elmarko and Timberlake essentially being our bench has really killed us.

No hate to Parker Braun. He's been better than I expected and was never meant to play a larger role than he's played.

yea I'm not including KM, he's not a one year rental, nor a big "star" (at least not when recruited).

HD
Dedric
Wiggins

(I dont really count Embiid here despite his handlers and the decision to not play at the end, the dude played hard and improved dramatically over his short time here).


those are the 3 softest teams Self has had I'd say.

[MICHHAWK]

embiid is the worst of them all. he put himself first. he quit on the team. embiid is the worst of them all.

he will forever be on my HCBS villian list

[KUTradition]

i’ll go out on a limb here and say that if we had a bench and our full compliment of scholly players, a lot of these ills would be cured…even in a game where HD underperformed, we’d have the horses and talent to deal with it

it’s been said since Furphy’s breakout that this team’s starting 5 might be the best 5 in the nation (w/ KM, obviously), but the other shortcomings leave them with a minuscule margin of error

even with everyone healthy there’s a tiny margin of error

[jfish26]

it's alllllmost like these 1 year rentals of big "stars" that only play from themselves don't lead to the toughest "teams". Gee, that's odd.

It's weird.

I don't get that impression from KM. And I was as skeptical as anyone about him coming into his 1st year at KU.

I actually don't get the feeling that HD plays only "for himself". I actually think he's been a good teammate at KU. A lot better than I expected.

But toughness isn't developed overnight. Especially team toughness. And often times you're only as tough as the weakest link....and we've got some really weak links in our rotation.

Very weird year. HD KM and Kj all surpassed my expectations for themselves individually this year....but Elmarko and Timberlake essentially being our bench has really killed us.

No hate to Parker Braun. He's been better than I expected and was never meant to play a larger role than he's played.

I think this is on point.

I don't think the issue is guys not caring. It's that we have too few guys, and the ones we have aren't good enough for the roles we have them in - and that was true BEFORE McCullar was hurt.

We also have - especially with McCullar hurt - NOBODY that can just go get a bucket. And the potency of our only true plus-plus offensive player is diminished by sharing the court with 2+ non-shooters at all times.

The roster is just constructed poorly, again. And when nothing comes easy and everything is a grind, you just keep the engine spinning at high RPMs. Recipe for disaster when you have - when healthy - a grand total of six guys who can play at the level we are accustomed to playing at.

And, my god, we just keep whiffing entirely on guys ranked in the 10-30ish range. You could damn near field a top-4-seed team with the Thompsons, Rices, Udehs and Jacksons of the world.

[DeletedUser]

i’ll go out on a limb here and say that if we had a bench and our full compliment of scholly players, a lot of these ills would be cured…even in a game where HD underperformed, we’d have the horses and talent to deal with it

it’s been said since Furphy’s breakout that this team’s starting 5 might be the best 5 in the nation (w/ KM, obviously), but the other shortcomings leave them with a minuscule margin of error

even with everyone healthy there’s a tiny margin of error

Definitely.

And I still think it was a good move to go ahead and get the entire scholly reduction out of the way instead of letting it linger on.

We should be in a better spot depth wise next year.

[DeletedUser]

And, my god, we just keep whiffing entirely on guys ranked in the 10-30ish range. You could damn near field a top-4-seed team with the Thompsons, Rices, Udehs and Jacksons of the world.

Not sure what is causing this, but it sure seems that way.

Lots of success with guys like Frank Devonte...even DH and Kj.....but then the never-ending cycle of Rice Udeh Elmarko type really confuses me.

Bad fits I guess, but at a certain point it's on Self to get players here who he is actually willing to play.

[jfish26]

And, my god, we just keep whiffing entirely on guys ranked in the 10-30ish range. You could damn near field a top-4-seed team with the Thompsons, Rices, Udehs and Jacksons of the world.

Not sure what is causing this, but it sure seems that way.

Lots of success with guys like Frank Devonte...even DH and Kj.....but then the never-ending cycle of Rice Udeh Elmarko type really confuses me.

Bad fits I guess, but at a certain point it's on Self to get players here who he is actually willing to play.

We all come at this with our biases, but at least when you go shopping for short-time guys on the transfer market, you have a reasonable expectation of what you'll get on the floor.

You clearly have no idea what you're actually getting in freshmen in the 10-30 range - except that, in most cases, you are probably getting guys who THINK they are near-term pros.

[DeletedUser]

Maybe I am letting Timberlake and Yesufu sour me too much on mid major transfer guys, but they just don't typically have what Self "wants" when they actually get here.

I am great with the HDs and KMs of the transfer world. I think they make sense for KU. Surround them with Kj and DH types and then also (hopefully) with some one and done or two and done type talent.

And yes, some thought Elmarko was one and done type talent, but I am not sure how anyone can watch him play and think that. His hype was based solely on his ranking and outside of the very elite guys the rankings sometimes suck.

[jfish26]

Maybe I am letting Timberlake and Yesufu sour me too much on mid major transfer guys, but they just don't typically have what Self "wants" when they actually get here.

I am great with the HDs and KMs of the transfer world. I think they make sense for KU. Surround them with Kj and DH types and then also (hopefully) with some one and done or two and done type talent.

And yes, some thought Elmarko was one and done type talent, but I am not sure how anyone can watch him play and think that. His hype was based solely on his ranking and outside of the very elite guys the rankings sometimes suck.

Which also comes back to - what exactly did we (or anyone else) see in Elmarko? I will readily admit to being ten years past the point of watching a single high school/AAU highlight video of anyone.

So everything I've seen is what he's put on tape here, and...I'm not sure I've seen him do ten pro things, let alone ten pro halves, let alone ten pro games.

If I didn't know about his pedigree, I'd say, "that looks like a guy who might really be something as a junior or senior."

He's an undersized, non-shooting 2. Did we think he was going to grow more or something?

[DeletedUser]

Maybe I am letting Timberlake and Yesufu sour me too much on mid major transfer guys, but they just don't typically have what Self "wants" when they actually get here.

I am great with the HDs and KMs of the transfer world. I think they make sense for KU. Surround them with Kj and DH types and then also (hopefully) with some one and done or two and done type talent.

And yes, some thought Elmarko was one and done type talent, but I am not sure how anyone can watch him play and think that. His hype was based solely on his ranking and outside of the very elite guys the rankings sometimes suck.

Which also comes back to - what exactly did we (or anyone else) see in Elmarko? I will readily admit to being ten years past the point of watching a single high school/AAU highlight video of anyone.

So everything I've seen is what he's put on tape here, and...I'm not sure I've seen him do ten pro things, let alone ten pro halves, let alone ten pro games.

If I didn't know about his pedigree, I'd say, "that looks like a guy who might really be something as a junior or senior."

He's an undersized, non-shooting 2. Did we think he was going to grow more or something?

The non shooting bothers me the most.

We KNEW we had DH and Kj for this year and next. Recruiting multiple non shooters to go with them makes no sense to me.

And next year will be even worse without KM and possibly Furphy.

Like, what's the plan here?

[jfish26]

Maybe I am letting Timberlake and Yesufu sour me too much on mid major transfer guys, but they just don't typically have what Self "wants" when they actually get here.

I am great with the HDs and KMs of the transfer world. I think they make sense for KU. Surround them with Kj and DH types and then also (hopefully) with some one and done or two and done type talent.

And yes, some thought Elmarko was one and done type talent, but I am not sure how anyone can watch him play and think that. His hype was based solely on his ranking and outside of the very elite guys the rankings sometimes suck.

Which also comes back to - what exactly did we (or anyone else) see in Elmarko? I will readily admit to being ten years past the point of watching a single high school/AAU highlight video of anyone.

So everything I've seen is what he's put on tape here, and...I'm not sure I've seen him do ten pro things, let alone ten pro halves, let alone ten pro games.

If I didn't know about his pedigree, I'd say, "that looks like a guy who might really be something as a junior or senior."

He's an undersized, non-shooting 2. Did we think he was going to grow more or something?

The non shooting bothers me the most.

We KNEW we had DH and Kj for this year and next. Recruiting multiple non shooters to go with them makes no sense to me.

And next year will be even worse without KM and possibly Furphy.

Like, what's the plan here?

Dunno.

I, personally, would go out of my way to never have rotation lineups with more than one non-shooter.

So yes, a plan that allocates at least 60 minutes to Harris and Adams is problematic.

[DeletedUser]

Which also comes back to - what exactly did we (or anyone else) see in Elmarko? I will readily admit to being ten years past the point of watching a single high school/AAU highlight video of anyone.

So everything I've seen is what he's put on tape here, and...I'm not sure I've seen him do ten pro things, let alone ten pro halves, let alone ten pro games.

If I didn't know about his pedigree, I'd say, "that looks like a guy who might really be something as a junior or senior."

He's an undersized, non-shooting 2. Did we think he was going to grow more or something?

The non shooting bothers me the most.

We KNEW we had DH and Kj for this year and next. Recruiting multiple non shooters to go with them makes no sense to me.

And next year will be even worse without KM and possibly Furphy.

Like, what's the plan here?

Dunno.

I, personally, would go out of my way to never have rotation lineups with more than one non-shooter.

So yes, a plan that allocates at least 60 minutes to Harris and Adams is problematic.

At least Harris actually can shoot.

Kj isn't even capable of taking them yet.

[MICHHAWK]

elmarko the freshmen is playing like most freshmen play. like a freshmen.

[KUTradition]

might get roasted for this, but i think KJ has been drinking his own koolaid. it’s seemed to me that he’s tried to do too much at times and played outside of himself

[jfish26]

elmarko the freshmen is playing like most freshmen play. like a freshmen.

I would be very interested in an objective analysis of whether (and by how much) we get more or less than others do out of guys in the 10-30ish range. Because it sure feels like we have done very poorly for a while (starting with about the Grimes/Thompson year).

[jfish26]

might get roasted for this, but i think KJ has been drinking his own koolaid. it’s seemed to me that he’s tried to do too much at times and played outside of himself

I agree, and I think it's just a role mismatch.

On a GREAT team, he would be your fifth guy, with his versatility meaning you can comfortably play any style. You don't need him to do anything that doesn't present itself in the flow of the game.

Right now, with McCullar down, he's our second or third guy. He HAS to force things, because of what else is on the floor. That's a horrible place for a supposed contender to be.

[randylahey]

People forget how inexperienced this roster is. Haven't played much together.

We only brought back 3 players from last years team. 1 of them is hurt

There were stretches of that game when dajuan and KJ were out and we had a combination of 3 freshman and 3 transfers playing together

[randylahey]

might get roasted for this, but i think KJ has been drinking his own koolaid. it’s seemed to me that he’s tried to do too much at times and played outside of himself

[randylahey]

might get roasted for this, but i think KJ has been drinking his own koolaid. it’s seemed to me that he’s tried to do too much at times and played outside of himself

In a way, he's trying to step up and create plays when we desperately need them. But him shooting from the midrange isn't gonna bail us out. And even attacking the basket is tough for him sometimes

I like KJ. But he limits the potential of the team to some degree. It's true he is strong athletic and makes exciting plays. It's also true he is an undersized 4 man with no outside shooting ability