The Great Outdoors

Coffee talk.
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TDub
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Re: The Great Outdoors

Post by TDub »

jfish26 wrote: Wed Sep 11, 2024 3:19 pm
pdub wrote: Wed Sep 11, 2024 2:31 pm Meh.
The advancements in technology are exponential.
Never say never.
What I kept waiting for in that article, and never came, is a discussion of how in all likelihood the leap to technology that would make Mars habitable probably leaves only an incremental step until technology that would make other "local" options - which might already be closer to habitability - habitable.
this is so very far beyond my grasp of understanding. But, the thought of there being anything "local" and more habitable is fairly well past anything I can comprehend. if I recall there is a moon that has potential but it is quite a distance from the Sun.


Space, and potential space travel boggles the mind.
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KUTradition
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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this is all a moot point

humanity will never make it to mars unless trump wins

:lol:
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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But seriously. If you have no idea how to navigate out there, don't go alone. Also don't go with "guides" that have no clue either.
A British Columbia woman seeking spiritual insight through "ego death" during a solo venture into the Colorado backcountry lacked basic navigation skills and was not properly outfitted for emergencies by her guides, according to a report compiled by authorities.

But Gina Chase survived four days by building a shelter with tree branches and filtering stagnant water through her campfire's charcoal - skills she said she learned from watching television shows.

Searchers spent four days looking for the 53-year-old last month outside Norwood. Chase was deliberately fasting as part of the experience.

Chase paid $1,400 to a Durango-based non-profit adventure service, Animas Valley Institute, for the multi-day excursion. She was one of 11 participants. The group camped together for five days, then split up for "solo quests."

The loneliness and physical stress of the outing would, by design, bring the explorers into a clearer state of mind.

However, no sufficient attempt was made by the organization to measure Chase's personal survival skills, nor of those possessed by any of the other members of the group being led and released into the backcountry, according to the report from the San Miguel County Sheriff's Office. Plus, they were encouraged by their guides to leave their cell phones behind. It was meant to curtail access to social media as the campers isolated themselves from civilization.

On a personal level, Chase confided to investigators that she was struggling with her mother's recent passing, according to the report. San Miguel County Sheriff's Office Sgt. Michael Donnellon asked her how the excursion was meant to deal with that loss.

"I pushed Gina more on this, looking specifically for what the desired physiological response they were seeking was as opposed to their spiritual goal," Donnellon wrote in the report. "Gina told me the act of fasting does not have the desired goal of hallucinating but to causes a person to crack a little bit. Gina told me when she fasted before her solo that she was, 'Hoping nature would speak back to me.'"

But by the time she was reported missing and searchers had started to gather for the mission, Chase had been without food and water for 36 hours, according to the report.

As first responders arrived, they asked the guides to notify the other 11 campers to return to the camp's base at the Lone Cone Trailhead. This, they told the guides, would keep searchers on foot and in the air from confusing the other campers with the subject of their mission: Chase.

Another sergeant with the sheriff's office, Lane Masters, was told by an Animas Valley Institute guide that communication with the campers would be difficult. The sergeant, as recounted in the report, asked the guide for the campers' general location. He intended to send his deputies out to those locations to instruct the other campers.

The guide, Masters wrote, "pulled out a handwritten note from one camper, and read it to me. The directions were ludicrously poor, such as 'Take a left at the small meadow and walk for a while.'"

As deputies tried to contact the other campers, Masters inquired about the gear Chase had with her. He was told green, a color recommended by the Animas Valley Institute, according to Chase's husband, so Chase could "be closer to nature."

"I pointed out how stupid this was from a safety perspective," Sgt. Masters wrote in the report, "as these colors were difficult to see in wooded terrain."


He added: "(The guide) then pointed at the map where they thought the subject may be. (The guide) pointed directly to our current location in the command area, a fact which I related to her. (The guide) commented 'Oh.' I pointed out to (the guide) that this was a serious problem, the relevance of which seemed to be lost on (the guide)."

Though all the campers were separated, the institute implemented a pairing system between them. Two campers would acknowledge their safety by alternately signaling one another at a remote location. In Chase's case, she and another woman moved rocks on a log, Chase every night and the other woman every morning.

Chase never responded after establishing her camp. According to the report, she attempted to circumvent another camper's site - in an attempt to not disturb that camper, as she'd been instructed - by going off trail. But in doing so, Chase became disoriented and walked in the opposite direction from the "communication rocks."

Chase's "rock buddy" reported the lack of contact to guides the next morning, Aug. 15. Those guides called 9-1-1.

Chase, expecting to be away 10 minutes, walked away from her camp only with a whistle, space blanket, matches, and a water bottle. Left behind were her tent, sleeping bag, inflatable sleeping pad, 12 liters of water and a three-day supply of emergency food, if needed.

Chase constructed a shelter out of tree limbs that first night, according to the report. It was minimally effective and made for "a very cold night," as she later said.

The next day, Chase set out again and attempted to find her camp. Without success. In short order, she became more lost.

Chase grew more fatigued due to her fasting but managed to construct a better shelter for the following four nights. This shelter was in a thick stand of trees, however, which Chase hesitated to leave. Chase blew her whistle at passing helicopters that she assumed were looking for her, but the searchers did not see her nor the shiny space blanket she was keeping in the trees.

Chase started small fires in hopes of signaling the aircraft. Investigators later determined the smoke from these never cleared the trees' canopy. When asked why she didn't build a bigger fire, Chase told investigators she afraid of starting a forest fire.

There was also a meadow a short distance away, and investigators expressed dismay that Chase did not place her space blanket or other items in the open area where they could be seen from overhead.

Remarkably, however, Chase made a water filter out of charcoal from her fires and moss from a nearby body of water she referred to as a "swamp." She collected water from the "swamp," drained it through the makeshift filter, and collected it in a rubber glove. She drank the filtered water from the glove.

According to the report, Chase said she learned much about surviving in the wilderness from watching the TV shows "Alive" and "Naked and Afraid."

Chase decided to follow the rising sun in the east the morning of Aug. 18. She soon encountered searchers and was led back to the main camp. There, she was medically evaluated, warmed and fed.

During this time, Chase was asked if at any time during her ordeal she thought she might die. Chase told investigators she considered it a possibility.

Later, Chase told investigators she owned a satellite-based beacon and tracking/communication device, but guides had advised her to leave it at home.

Chase also said she had her cell phone with her but told investigators it was not functioning due to a lack of cell service coverage during the ordeal.

This is in contrast to the Animas Valley Institute's claims. In a Facebook post days after her rescue, the organization stated:

"We want to clarify that Gina was not without food or communication tools. She carried a fully functional cell phone with satellite capabilities and activated the SOS function when necessary. In addition to her phone, she was also carrying a pack that contained; rain jacket and pants, insulated jacket, emergency blankets, knife, fire starting supplies, a whistle, laminated emergency instructions, water, personal first aid kit, a flashlight and ground insulation."

Investigators were able to confirm the lack of cell phone by observing "selfies" Chase took with landmarks in the area. Those messages had yet to be delivered.

Investigators also used data from those photos to later determine her location when they were taken. Those photos showed she spent most of her time just more than half a mile from her original solo campsite and .68 miles from the "communication rocks." They also learned there was no one camped in the 237 yards between her solo camp and the "communication rocks," meaning there was no reason for Chase to veer off trail in the first place.

As she recovered, investigators drilled Chase on her errant direction of travel, changes in elevation which she apparently confused, and the obvious landmarks she ignored - most notably a 13,000-foot mountain to her south. And the sun.

"It was clear Gina did not possess the skills and was not prepared enough for basic navigation in the back country," Donnellon concluded in the report. "This was compounded by Animas Valley Institute not vetting people enough to place them in a situation where they are weak from fasting, not possessing basic navigation tools and not having proper safety measures in place to prevent such an event. Most importantly, not providing or requiring a GPS device with SPOT technology that can be used in the event one of their clients becomes lost or has an emergency. The cause of exactly how or why Gina became lost is inconclusive at this time. It is hard to understand how she made it to the location she was, missing all of the glaring navigational cues that would have pointed her in the correct direction. Her mindset during the ordeal can only be taken at her word and reflected in the photographs she took of herself during the incident that is now left to interpretation. Gina did say she is going to continue her learning and journey into the back country but will equip herself with a GPS in the future."

The Animas Valley Institute stated that it is bringing in outside experts to review its practices.

"The backcountry is inherently unpredictable," it stated on its Facebook post, "and while we strive to mitigate risks, some level of uncertainty is always present. We are committed to conducting a thorough review of the incident to understand what occurred and to ensure that our protocols continue to prioritize participant safety."
Freezing to death in the woods is a spiritual journey. Lessons that last a lifetime.
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KUTradition
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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one hell of a vision quest
Have we fallen into a mesmerized state that makes us accept as inevitable that which is inferior or detrimental, as though having lost the will or the vision to demand that which is good?
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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“The Electoral College is DEI for rural white folks.”
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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They released a herd of Caribou onto the Wyoming plains.

Kinda cool.
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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TDub wrote: Thu Sep 19, 2024 4:59 pm They released a herd of Caribou onto the Wyoming plains.

Kinda cool.
Gotta feed those wolfs
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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jhawks99 wrote: Thu Sep 19, 2024 5:47 pm
TDub wrote: Thu Sep 19, 2024 4:59 pm They released a herd of Caribou onto the Wyoming plains.

Kinda cool.
Gotta feed those wolfs
the fat behind caribou eyeballs apparently tastes exactly like pizza dough. sounds delicious
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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TDub wrote: Thu Sep 19, 2024 5:55 pm
jhawks99 wrote: Thu Sep 19, 2024 5:47 pm
TDub wrote: Thu Sep 19, 2024 4:59 pm They released a herd of Caribou onto the Wyoming plains.

Kinda cool.
Gotta feed those wolfs
the fat behind caribou eyeballs apparently tastes exactly like pizza dough. sounds delicious
I'm down
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TDub
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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jhawks99 wrote: Thu Sep 19, 2024 6:34 pm
TDub wrote: Thu Sep 19, 2024 5:55 pm
jhawks99 wrote: Thu Sep 19, 2024 5:47 pm

Gotta feed those wolfs
the fat behind caribou eyeballs apparently tastes exactly like pizza dough. sounds delicious
I'm down
to Wyoming then?
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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Hellyea
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TDub
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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I might get distracted and accidentally stay for the next 30 or 40 years
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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A buddy of mines brother got stuck in a blinding blizzard on Pikes Peak years ago.

My buddy and 2 of his friends risked their own lives to go and recover his body
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Re: The Great Outdoors

Post by Shirley »

I need to remember to have the agility of a leopard, next time:

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Re: The Great Outdoors

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I'm all right...
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TDub
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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I lost 8 ducks....all in one night. not a sign of struggle, no feathers, no blood....just poof...gone.


coyote, wolf, bobcat or cougar
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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immigrants
Have we fallen into a mesmerized state that makes us accept as inevitable that which is inferior or detrimental, as though having lost the will or the vision to demand that which is good?
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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Aliens
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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KUTradition wrote: Fri Oct 04, 2024 10:08 amimmigrants
dammit! I didn't think about that....im going searching for the nearest Haitians after work.
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Re: The Great Outdoors

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TDub wrote: Fri Oct 04, 2024 1:47 pm
KUTradition wrote: Fri Oct 04, 2024 10:08 amimmigrants
dammit! I didn't think about that....im going searching for the nearest Haitians after work.
watch, in like a week we’ll see a viral story about immigrants stealing farm animals from rural PNW properties
Have we fallen into a mesmerized state that makes us accept as inevitable that which is inferior or detrimental, as though having lost the will or the vision to demand that which is good?
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