Biden pardons faucci? (And his other finals acts)

[BiggDick]

ADL says “this is a new beginning” and simps to the new admin and a guy who just threw a Nazi salute.

OK? And?

and it's actually pretty funny.

particularly considering it's the ADL.

[twocoach]

Posting this fake, manipulated shit is beyong the pale for you. I expect it from our resident MAGA morons but I thought you had more class and honesty than this.

Did you bother to read what DC posted in his next post?

Comparing those to this is absurd.

[Shirley]

Your fucking "time outs" will be the demise of this message board, in case you haven't noticed.

[pdub]

That’s fine—though I’d argue NOT banning posters earlier had more to do with the demise of this bored ( as posters left because of them - specifically the ones I just put in timeout ).

Loosing randy and psych at this point is a absolutely as close to zero loss as you could get.

DC would be a loss but he rarely posts here and lately, when he does, it’s to correct what he considers a misguided comment about the worst president to ever serve in the history of our country.

I’m going to make it clear that I’m not going to support dancing around what is happening in our nation in the next four years.
If you supported Trump and his admin then own it and everything that comes with it.

[RainbowsandUnicorns]

* Edited.
Ah fuck it, nevermind.

[Shirley]

That’s fine—though I’d argue NOT banning posters earlier had more to do with the demise of this bored ( as posters left because of them - specifically the ones I put in timeout ).

Loosing randy and psych at this point is a absolutely as close to zero loss as you could get.

DC would be a loss but he rarely posts here and lately, when he does, it’s to correct what he considers a misguided comment about the worst president to ever serve in the history of our country.

I’m going to make it clear that I’m not going to support dancing around what is happening in our nation in the next four years.
If you supported Trump and his admin then own it and everything that comes with it.

Of course, it's your site, and you can do whatever you want, and having moderated a site with lots of participants, I know it's not easy deciding when to lower the hammer on people who you think are causing more harm, than good. And, for the record, other than Randy for his firehose of never-ending, baseless, wrong, disinformation about Covid, I'm don't think I would ever have banned anyone here, (other than Noosh and japhy), that I can think of. (I'm talking kcrim)

But, when you lose people like CNB and DC due to, imo, an unforced error, (even in DC's currently diminished role), that's a real, unnecessary, loss.

PhD and I never interacted directly after disagreeing very early on here about the role of vaccines in the pantheon of historic medical achievements, but he left because of Randy, (from I'm told), and he was a huge loss, too. #sad

I'm not sure if you can tell, because sometimes I find it a challenge too, but a little birdie tells me that DC hates what's been happening for the last 8 years almost as much as we socialists do. But, that hasn't kept him, like you pointed out, from trying to keep those of us in the political majority here on the straight and narrow. I really hope he isn't history here, he made me up my game, immensely.

And, I do commend you for feeling a responsibility to counter the propaganda propelling our country's slide into fascism. Time to buckle up.

[pdub]

You wouldn't have banned lobster?
He was randy on steroids at one point.

I apologized to CnB for his one or two hour timeout during the Chiefs Super Bowl.
I apologized to doyel for his one hour timeout during KU's run to the National Championship.

I don't currently feel sorry for putting randy, psych or DC on timeout. Not after already seeing all the things their president is putting into motion.

[jfish26]

That’s fine—though I’d argue NOT banning posters earlier had more to do with the demise of this bored ( as posters left because of them - specifically the ones I put in timeout ).

Loosing randy and psych at this point is a absolutely as close to zero loss as you could get.

DC would be a loss but he rarely posts here and lately, when he does, it’s to correct what he considers a misguided comment about the worst president to ever serve in the history of our country.

I’m going to make it clear that I’m not going to support dancing around what is happening in our nation in the next four years.
If you supported Trump and his admin then own it and everything that comes with it.

Of course, it's your site, and you can do whatever you want, and having moderated a site with lots of participants, I know it's not easy deciding when to lower the hammer on people who you think are causing more harm, than good. And, for the record, other than Randy for his firehose of never-ending, baseless, wrong, disinformation about Covid, I'm don't think I would ever have banned anyone here, (other than Noosh and japhy), that I can think of. (I'm talking kcrim)

But, when you lose people like CNB and DC due to, imo, an unforced error, (even in DC's currently diminished role), that's a real, unnecessary, loss.

PhD and I never interacted directly after disagreeing very early on here about the role of vaccines in the pantheon of historic medical achievements, but he left because of Randy, (from I'm told), and he was a huge loss, too. #sad

I'm not sure if you can tell, because sometimes I find it a challenge too, but a little birdie tells me that DC hates what's been happening for the last 8 years almost as much as we socialists do. But, that hasn't kept him, like you pointed out, from trying to keep those of us in the political majority here on the straight and narrow. I really hope he isn't history here, he made me up my game, immensely.

And, I do commend you for feeling a responsibility to counter the propaganda propelling our country's slide into fascism. Time to buckle up.

This may be true in part - but the second half in particular is a touch hollow. DC purposefully withdrew from the conversation around here, by and large.

Which of course is fine. Probably would be the healthy thing for a lot of us (points finger at self) to do.

But the holistic picture - conservative-leaning poster mostly withdraws from generally center-left leaning board; emerges on Trump's inauguration day; nods head toward minimizing unelected shadow-president's gesture that is unquestionably evocative of something quite right-wing-bad - is a challenging one for a site proprietor, who is trying (on a day of massively heightened sensitivity) to manage some elements that do not bring DC's nuance, discretion, restraint and good-faith to the table.

This isn't intended as support for eliminating DC's voice from the board. Kind of the opposite! - I think the conversation would be improved by that voice being more present. I think it's a voice we're missing, and one that the discourse suffers for its absence.

[Shirley]

You wouldn't have banned lobster?
He was randy on steroids at one point.

I apologized to CnB for his one or two hour timeout during the Chiefs Super Bowl.
I apologized to doyel for his one hour timeout during KU's run to the National Championship.

I don't currently feel sorry for putting randy, psych or DC on timeout. Not after already seeing all the things their president is putting into motion.

I didn't know you had reached out to CNB and sdoyel. Thanks, I'm really glad you did, and I'm glad to know it.

As far as Lobster? Sorry, but I mostly dodged that bullet.

I put myself in timeout, i.e., took a break, shortly after my wife passed in early May of '21, after DC and I had a meltdown. I was gone for > a year, and when I came back not only were CNB, PhD, and sdoyel gone, but Lobster had apparently decompensated and was history, ous had gone over to the darker sides and seemed to have spent whatever capital he had accumulated, and Illy had gone from nearly insufferable to one of the best posters you could hope for-a miraculous transformation, for which he should be commended. (IMO).

So, I missed a lot of the drama, I guess.

I do very much appreciate you running the site and making it available to us, thankless-job tho it is.

And, although I heretofore saw you as the iceberg lettuce of leafy greens, the mayonnaise of condiments, if you will, i.e., painfully bland politically, (No offense intended.), I can't help but say that I am amazed and gratified at your current attitude, and am left to wonder if it was always such and you kept it close to your vest, or if you have experienced a transformation recently, in that respect? (You don't owe me an answer, but I can't help but wonder.)

[twocoach]

Biden's pardons were done to avoid potential injustices if and when Trump tries to charge them for crimes that did not happen.

Trump's pardons were done to overturn justice for crimes that did happen.

[TDub]

You wouldn't have banned lobster?
He was randy on steroids at one point.

I apologized to CnB for his one or two hour timeout during the Chiefs Super Bowl.
I apologized to doyel for his one hour timeout during KU's run to the National Championship.

I don't currently feel sorry for putting randy, psych or DC on timeout. Not after already seeing all the things their president is putting into motion.

I didn't know you had reached out to CNB and sdoyel. Thanks, I'm really glad you did, and I'm glad to know it.

As far as Lobster? Sorry, but I mostly dodged that bullet.

I put myself in timeout, i.e., took a break, shortly after my wife passed in early May of '21, after DC and I had a meltdown. I was gone for > a year, and when I came back not only were CNB, PhD, and sdoyel gone, but Lobster had apparently decompensated and was history, ous had gone over to the darker sides and seemed to have spent whatever capital he had accumulated, and Illy had gone from nearly insufferable to one of the best posters you could hope for-a miraculous transformation, for which he should be commended. (IMO).

So, I missed a lot of the drama, I guess.

I do very much appreciate you running the site and making it available to us, thankless-job tho it is.

And, although I heretofore saw you as the iceberg lettuce of leafy greens, the mayonnaise of condiments, if you will, i.e., painfully bland politically, (No offense intended.), I can't help but say that I am amazed and gratified at your current attitude, and am left to wonder if it was always such and you kept it close to your vest, or if you have experienced a transformation recently, in that respect? (You don't owe me an answer, but I can't help but wonder.)

well now you know. Although most things change.....the one thing you can rely on is my steady awesomeness.

[pdub]

I put up with the spewing of the lobsters and lobster-lites because I still believed America wasn't threatened. In some ways, I welcomed it, because I was trying to serve what I felt America should be - a place where voices were heard even if you disagreed with them.

( yes, I made oopsies with doyel and CnB but I admitted fault and also, come on, don't troll or semi-troll during single elimination games )

But leading up to the 2020 election and the aftermath of that, highlighted by January 6th where rioters attacked the capitol, and trump's role in that, well, that's when I thought this is very damaging to how we should be as a nation.

That angered me. It should have angered everyone. But look, now those people are 'hostages'.
So yes, I guess that's the transformation - where it's OK to threaten what was built and kept safe since we overthrew the British in the late 1700s.

[jfish26]

Biden's pardons were done to avoid potential injustices if and when Trump tries to charge them for crimes that did not happen.

Trump's pardons were done to overturn justice for crimes that did happen.

And, MOST critically to the bad-faith discourse running around: Trump's non-pardons at the end of his first term were done in the framework of the next President (Biden) being, you know, subject to our laws and stuff.

That is a pretty key differentiating factor, when analyzing Biden's pardons!

[twocoach]

Biden's pardons were done to avoid potential injustices if and when Trump tries to charge them for crimes that did not happen.

Trump's pardons were done to overturn justice for crimes that did happen.

And, MOST critically to the bad-faith discourse running around: Trump's non-pardons at the end of his first term were done in the framework of the next President (Biden) being, you know, subject to our laws and stuff.

That is a pretty key differentiating factor, when analyzing Biden's pardons!

Yep, agreed. Now that Trump has been emboldened and feels like he can do anything, things are probably going to get really wild. I don't personally believe the Supreme Court's ruling actually lines up with his belief of what he thinks it was but I think he believes he can do whatever he wants with impunity. Biden at least believed he had to behave within the parameters of the law.

[Shirley]

That’s fine—though I’d argue NOT banning posters earlier had more to do with the demise of this bored ( as posters left because of them - specifically the ones I put in timeout ).

Loosing randy and psych at this point is a absolutely as close to zero loss as you could get.

DC would be a loss but he rarely posts here and lately, when he does, it’s to correct what he considers a misguided comment about the worst president to ever serve in the history of our country.

I’m going to make it clear that I’m not going to support dancing around what is happening in our nation in the next four years.
If you supported Trump and his admin then own it and everything that comes with it.

Of course, it's your site, and you can do whatever you want, and having moderated a site with lots of participants, I know it's not easy deciding when to lower the hammer on people who you think are causing more harm, than good. And, for the record, other than Randy for his firehose of never-ending, baseless, wrong, disinformation about Covid, I'm don't think I would ever have banned anyone here, (other than Noosh and japhy), that I can think of. (I'm talking kcrim)

But, when you lose people like CNB and DC due to, imo, an unforced error, (even in DC's currently diminished role), that's a real, unnecessary, loss.

PhD and I never interacted directly after disagreeing very early on here about the role of vaccines in the pantheon of historic medical achievements, but he left because of Randy, (from I'm told), and he was a huge loss, too. #sad

I'm not sure if you can tell, because sometimes I find it a challenge too, but a little birdie tells me that DC hates what's been happening for the last 8 years almost as much as we socialists do. But, that hasn't kept him, like you pointed out, from trying to keep those of us in the political majority here on the straight and narrow. I really hope he isn't history here, he made me up my game, immensely.

And, I do commend you for feeling a responsibility to counter the propaganda propelling our country's slide into fascism. Time to buckle up.

This may be true in part - but the second half in particular is a touch hollow. DC purposefully withdrew from the conversation around here, by and large.

Which of course is fine. Probably would be the healthy thing for a lot of us (points finger at self) to do.

But the holistic picture - conservative-leaning poster mostly withdraws from generally center-left leaning board; emerges on Trump's inauguration day; nods head toward minimizing unelected shadow-president's gesture that is unquestionably evocative of something quite right-wing-bad - is a challenging one for a site proprietor, who is trying (on a day of massively heightened sensitivity) to manage some elements that do not bring DC's nuance, discretion, restraint and good-faith to the table.

This isn't intended as support for eliminating DC's voice from the board. Kind of the opposite! - I think the conversation would be improved by that voice being more present. I think it's a voice we're missing, and one that the discourse suffers for its absence.

You make some excellent points. I wish DC was more present too, but why would he choose to be in the position of having to defend "Republicans", which is what would inevitably happen, even if he were able to avoid having to defend the Trump gorilla in the room?

I go so far back with DC, and we've bumped heads and disagreed so vehemently so many times, and he has provoked me to react in ways that later challenged my sense of myself, (i.e., Be careful when you fight monsters...the abyss looks back into you...), that I won't pretend not to have a biased and battle-tested pov.

That being said, on more than one occasion, as pertains to Trump, I struggled to stop the urge to use the word "enabler", when responding to his posts.

To me, ambiguity is not a bug, when it comes to DC's posts.

And when push comes to shove, I see him as an ethical and honorable person.

[twocoach]

Of course, it's your site, and you can do whatever you want, and having moderated a site with lots of participants, I know it's not easy deciding when to lower the hammer on people who you think are causing more harm, than good. And, for the record, other than Randy for his firehose of never-ending, baseless, wrong, disinformation about Covid, I'm don't think I would ever have banned anyone here, (other than Noosh and japhy), that I can think of. (I'm talking kcrim)

But, when you lose people like CNB and DC due to, imo, an unforced error, (even in DC's currently diminished role), that's a real, unnecessary, loss.

PhD and I never interacted directly after disagreeing very early on here about the role of vaccines in the pantheon of historic medical achievements, but he left because of Randy, (from I'm told), and he was a huge loss, too. #sad

I'm not sure if you can tell, because sometimes I find it a challenge too, but a little birdie tells me that DC hates what's been happening for the last 8 years almost as much as we socialists do. But, that hasn't kept him, like you pointed out, from trying to keep those of us in the political majority here on the straight and narrow. I really hope he isn't history here, he made me up my game, immensely.

And, I do commend you for feeling a responsibility to counter the propaganda propelling our country's slide into fascism. Time to buckle up.

This may be true in part - but the second half in particular is a touch hollow. DC purposefully withdrew from the conversation around here, by and large.

Which of course is fine. Probably would be the healthy thing for a lot of us (points finger at self) to do.

But the holistic picture - conservative-leaning poster mostly withdraws from generally center-left leaning board; emerges on Trump's inauguration day; nods head toward minimizing unelected shadow-president's gesture that is unquestionably evocative of something quite right-wing-bad - is a challenging one for a site proprietor, who is trying (on a day of massively heightened sensitivity) to manage some elements that do not bring DC's nuance, discretion, restraint and good-faith to the table.

This isn't intended as support for eliminating DC's voice from the board. Kind of the opposite! - I think the conversation would be improved by that voice being more present. I think it's a voice we're missing, and one that the discourse suffers for its absence.

You make some excellent points. I wish DC was more present too, but why would he choose to be in the position of having to defend "Republicans", which is what would inevitably happen, even if he were able to avoid having to defend the Trump gorilla in the room?

I go so far back with DC, and we've bumped heads and disagreed so vehemently so many times, and he has provoked me to react in ways that later challenged my sense of myself, (i.e., Be careful when you fight monsters...the abyss looks back into you...), that I won't pretend not to have a biased and battle-tested pov.

That being said, on more than one occasion, as pertains to Trump, I struggled to stop the urge to use the word "enabler", when responding to his posts.

To me, ambiguity is not a bug, when it comes to DC's posts.

And when push comes to shove, I see him as an ethical and honorable person.

I struggle to understand how ethical and honorable people can remain part of the Republican Party. You can't call yourself an honorable man if you walk past the open door of a room full of frat boys raping an unconscious woman and you keep walking. Trump has shown us all who he is and what he is doing to our country.

We're 10 years into the Era of Trump. Continuing to support it is complicity at this point.

[jfish26]

Biden's pardons were done to avoid potential injustices if and when Trump tries to charge them for crimes that did not happen.

Trump's pardons were done to overturn justice for crimes that did happen.

And, MOST critically to the bad-faith discourse running around: Trump's non-pardons at the end of his first term were done in the framework of the next President (Biden) being, you know, subject to our laws and stuff.

That is a pretty key differentiating factor, when analyzing Biden's pardons!

Yep, agreed. Now that Trump has been emboldened and feels like he can do anything, things are probably going to get really wild. I don't personally believe the Supreme Court's ruling actually lines up with his belief of what he thinks it was but I think he believes he can do whatever he wants with impunity. Biden at least believed he had to behave within the parameters of the law.

And, the Supreme Court (as composed at all relevant times) absolutely would have held Biden to the law, while simultaneously excusing Trump from it.

That's just usual Democrat lies, both sides are evil, you're just looking at this through blue glasses.

Here's how we know that is arrant nonsense: the Supreme Court made itself the sole and unreviewable arbiter of whether or not any given presidential act is immune (and, if so, how immune).

The result is that we have created a lawless monarch, so long as the Supreme Court is ideologically aligned with the aspiring lawless monarch.

(And I will again say: this should make all of us EXTREMELY nervous about whether the right ever expects or will permit power to swing back to the left.)

[Shirley]

I put up with the spewing of the lobsters and lobster-lites because I still believed America wasn't threatened. In some ways, I welcomed it, because I was trying to serve what I felt America should be - a place where voices were heard even if you disagreed with them.

( yes, I made oopsies with doyel and CnB but I admitted fault and also, come on, don't troll or semi-troll during single elimination games )

But leading up to the 2020 election and the aftermath of that, highlighted by January 6th where rioters attacked the capitol, and trump's role in that, well, that's when I thought this is very damaging to how we should be as a nation.

That angered me. It should have angered everyone. But look, now those people are 'hostages'.
So yes, I guess that's the transformation - where it's OK to threaten what was built and kept safe since we overthrew the British in the late 1700s.

Interesting, thanks for sharing that. What an appropriate reaction to such inappropriate behavior.

You're right, Jan 6 and the attempt to overthrow the will of 82 million American citizens "...should have angered everyone...", but the attraction of a cult that gives you someone you already didn't like, to blame for how your life hasn't lived up to your expectations, must be strong.

[Shirley]

This may be true in part - but the second half in particular is a touch hollow. DC purposefully withdrew from the conversation around here, by and large.

Which of course is fine. Probably would be the healthy thing for a lot of us (points finger at self) to do.

But the holistic picture - conservative-leaning poster mostly withdraws from generally center-left leaning board; emerges on Trump's inauguration day; nods head toward minimizing unelected shadow-president's gesture that is unquestionably evocative of something quite right-wing-bad - is a challenging one for a site proprietor, who is trying (on a day of massively heightened sensitivity) to manage some elements that do not bring DC's nuance, discretion, restraint and good-faith to the table.

This isn't intended as support for eliminating DC's voice from the board. Kind of the opposite! - I think the conversation would be improved by that voice being more present. I think it's a voice we're missing, and one that the discourse suffers for its absence.

You make some excellent points. I wish DC was more present too, but why would he choose to be in the position of having to defend "Republicans", which is what would inevitably happen, even if he were able to avoid having to defend the Trump gorilla in the room?

I go so far back with DC, and we've bumped heads and disagreed so vehemently so many times, and he has provoked me to react in ways that later challenged my sense of myself, (i.e., Be careful when you fight monsters...the abyss looks back into you...), that I won't pretend not to have a biased and battle-tested pov.

That being said, on more than one occasion, as pertains to Trump, I struggled to stop the urge to use the word "enabler", when responding to his posts.

To me, ambiguity is not a bug, when it comes to DC's posts.

And when push comes to shove, I see him as an ethical and honorable person.

I struggle to understand how ethical and honorable people can remain part of the Republican Party. You can't call yourself an honorable man if you walk past the open door of a room full of frat boys raping an unconscious woman and you keep walking. Trump has shown us all who he is and what he is doing to our country.

We're 10 years into the Era of Trump. Continuing to support it is complicity at this point.

Well, I've never spoken to DC offline, but someone who does tells me DC has no love for Trump.

My guess is that, like many of the "traditional" Republicans, DC is wondering WTF happened? My party turned into a personality cult!

Maybe DC saw his role here as more of a conservative commenter than as a Republican, these days? Considering the tsunami of opposition he'd evoke any time he posted any refute to our collective wisdom, I cut him some slack...because what's our alternative...Psych, and Randy.

Giving energy to the Elon/Hitler salute is hard to square, but to him, maybe it was a joke?

[pdub]

What was a joke?

DC's post here -- because that sure looked like he was saying, hey, these things are the same, no reason for you at this moment to get upset -- and let me defend randy and psych.
Or Elon's salute ( that he did twice ) that he still hasn't come out and overtly denied.

If DC's post was a joke, it was a whiff.
If Elon's Sieg Heil was a joke, it should, in so many other worlds, land him in deep trouble with some questions to answer.