Shoe money trial

[Geezer]

What makes you think the 60K actually happened?

[jfish26]

If I'm following correctly, the alleged 60k has nothing to do with Kansas.
There was an alleged 20k offered but never paid.

I am curious if that will matter. If Maryland payed him and we played him, then it's us on the hook for playing an ineligible player. Maryland could also be hit with something, but it'd be in addition to us because regardless SDS played for Kansas, not Maryland.

Right. There are two different tracks here, and they won't intersect for some time:

1. What should/will KU do right now, and

2. What punishment should/will KU get for whatever happened with Silvio, whether KU-related or otherwise.

KU has to solve #1 before #2 is remotely close to being resolved. And...no, KU will not solve #1 by guessing at a suspension for $2,500.

[pdub]

The issue for me is intent.
In previous circumstances, the payments to players were linked to a player going to said program.
In this case, the payment looks like it didn't land a player to said program ( at least with the current evidence ).

That said, who knows what the NCAA would decide, since they have shown zero evidence of being a fair/just organization when it comes to equal punishment.

[twocoach]

I'm sorry, but if you read those text strings and don't think Self knew exactly what was going on then I think you're being willfully ignorant.

Why on earth would Self thank Gatto for recruits committing if he didn't know what was going on? Come on now. We are all smart enough to see what's going on.

It doesn't make KU a bad program or Self a bad person. It's just how it works. Refusing to accept reality will only result in some of our fans looking foolish. Let's not drift into UK-ish bizarro land where everyone cheats but us. It's clear we aren't squeaky clean. It's not the end of the world. Ncaa may not even do anything. And since none of our coaches were arrested then I imagine we stayed away from the part of this that actually broke laws.

All we are saying is that your stance of "the ncaa can do whatever they want" is not accurate. They cannot and do not punish based on innuendo. They simply cannot. Yes they do not require "beyond a reasonable doubt" but they can't just hammer us for what has been released so far.

And just a reminder that this is the FBI investigation, not the ncaa investigation. The ncaa doesnt have subpoena power. They could ask Falmagne and Gassnola questions looking for more details and get nothing but the middle finger. They dont have to tell the ncaa jack.

[pdub]

What makes you think the 60K actually happened?

I don't think he's lying.
I get the argument why someone would lie in this case but I don't think it's a strong one.
If he cooperates with the feds, he can avoid time.

[jfish26]

I'm sorry, but if you read those text strings and don't think Self knew exactly what was going on then I think you're being willfully ignorant.

Why on earth would Self thank Gatto for recruits committing if he didn't know what was going on? Come on now. We are all smart enough to see what's going on.

It doesn't make KU a bad program or Self a bad person. It's just how it works. Refusing to accept reality will only result in some of our fans looking foolish. Let's not drift into UK-ish bizarro land where everyone cheats but us. It's clear we aren't squeaky clean. It's not the end of the world. Ncaa may not even do anything. And since none of our coaches were arrested then I imagine we stayed away from the part of this that actually broke laws.

All we are saying is that your stance of "the ncaa can do whatever they want" is not accurate. They cannot and do not punish based on innuendo. They simply cannot. Yes they do not require "beyond a reasonable doubt" but they can't just hammer us for what has been released so far.

And just a reminder that this is the FBI investigation, not the ncaa investigation. The ncaa doesnt have subpoena power. They could ask Falmagne and Gassnola questions looking for more details and get nothing but the middle finger. They dont have to tell the ncaa jack.

Agree, but that's why documentary evidence (as opposed to testimonial evidence) changes how I feel about our exposure here. As far as the NCAA goes, I couldn't give two shits about a bag man saying Bill Self knew about - even directed - every dime.

I am a lot more concerned where documentary evidence can show these things. And to be clear, the texts we've seen do not do that. But they're closer than I ever wanted to be, and make me very nervous about what else might be out there.

[Geezer]

Gassnola said that he was told about the 60K.
Silvio's guardian denied that it ever happened.
U/A isn't about to say that we were screwed out of 60K.

[jfish26]

Gassnola said that he was told about the 60K.
Silvio's guardian denied that it ever happened.
U/A isn't about to say that we were screwed out of 60K.

Maybe, like, their CEO won't. But you don't think their version of Gassnola or Gatti, when he's staring down a prison sentence, wouldn't?

In any case, again, this is all irrelevant to Silvio, as he will long have departed KU by the time the NCAA gets around to enforcing any of this (if it does, which I suspect it largely won't).

[Deleted User 89]

If I'm following correctly, the alleged 60k has nothing to do with Kansas.
There was an alleged 20k offered but never paid.

I am curious if that will matter. If Maryland payed him and we played him, then it's us on the hook for playing an ineligible player. Maryland could also be hit with something, but it'd be in addition to us because regardless SDS played for Kansas, not Maryland.

but he had been cleared when we played him, which i think (right or wrong) gets us off the hook for last season

i'm in the boat with those that say based on what we know as of this minute, you sit him for 5-9 games and then say fuck it

[pdub]

I think because of our depth at frontcourt, Silvio may not play another game.
Lightfoot and McAnderson will be enough behind Dok and Dedric ( and perhaps even KJ in some spots ).

If I were Self, and I 100% knew that KU didn't have involvement in anything more than that 2,500, I would sit him for 5 games, and then say 'fuck it'. But if there's more to the story, you can't play him, not in this light.

[jfish26]

If I'm following correctly, the alleged 60k has nothing to do with Kansas.
There was an alleged 20k offered but never paid.

I am curious if that will matter. If Maryland payed him and we played him, then it's us on the hook for playing an ineligible player. Maryland could also be hit with something, but it'd be in addition to us because regardless SDS played for Kansas, not Maryland.

but he had been cleared when we played him, which i think (right or wrong) gets us off the hook for last season

i'm in the boat with those that say based on what we know as of this minute, you sit him for 5-9 games and then say fuck it

I think the risk, now, of playing him one game is exactly the same as playing him 40 games. I don't see a realistic outcome where we guess at a suspension, and the NCAA (a) was going to suspend him in the first place, and (b) says, "you know what, that's about right."

[MICHHAWK]

Bye bye sds. We hardly knew ya.

[MICHHAWK]

How stupid of our coaching staff to leave a text trail. Dumb.

Whatever we get we deserve.

[MICHHAWK]

Playing sds again would be an even dumber move than leaving that dumb text trail.

[twocoach]

Gassnola said that he was told about the 60K.
Silvio's guardian denied that it ever happened.
U/A isn't about to say that we were screwed out of 60K.

It was allegedly paid by a Maryland booster, not UA, making it even less likely to come up.

[DCHawk1]

Gassnola said that he was told about the 60K.
Silvio's guardian denied that it ever happened.
U/A isn't about to say that we were screwed out of 60K.

It was allegedly paid by a Maryland booster, not UA, making it even less likely to come up.

Isn't UA itself a Maryland Booster, almost by definition?

[Deleted User 75]

If I'm following correctly, the alleged 60k has nothing to do with Kansas.
There was an alleged 20k offered but never paid.

I am curious if that will matter. If Maryland payed him and we played him, then it's us on the hook for playing an ineligible player. Maryland could also be hit with something, but it'd be in addition to us because regardless SDS played for Kansas, not Maryland.

but he had been cleared when we played him, which i think (right or wrong) gets us off the hook for last season

I don't think that's actually how it works, but to be honest I'm not sure anymore.

[Deleted User 75]

Saying "fuck it" with SDS and playing him with no concern about games being vacated is unfair to the other players on the team....you just can't do it. You can keep him in school and practice him, but you can't risk having wins vacated knowing all of this.

[DCHawk1]

Saying "fuck it" with SDS and playing him with no concern about games being vacated is unfair to the other players on the team....you just can't do it. You can keep him in school and practice him, but you can't risk having wins vacated knowing all of this.

Beat the shit outta that straw man!

No one in a position of responsibility is now suggesting or ever would suggest "saying 'fuck it.'" The very idea is stupid.

You get confused sometimes about where you are. This is a message board, not the KUAD.

[jfish26]

Playing sds again would be an even dumber move than leaving that dumb text trail.

Considering the marginal benefit of playing him now, unfortunately I agree with this.