Today in "so much winning"!

[DCHawk1]

I mean...lulz...

Does this mean that she filled in "Native American" to further her career? Because she already had a BS and a JD by the time she filled this out. Maybe so.

It does NOT necessarily mean that. And while that's a claim that is often made about her, I didn't make it and it doesn't change the facts of the story. In the case of her Texas bar card, she filled that out, complete with racial details, AFTER she had been admitted to the Texas bar, so why she did so is anyone's guess.

[Geezer]

https://www.msnbc.com/morning-joe/watch ... 1560773873

[Deleted User 89]

Settle down, Beavis.

She lied.

so disingenuous

good for you

lulz.

I mean...I posted a picture of her actual Texas bar card, on which she lists her "Race" as "American Indian." Even if she were 1/16 Cherokee -- which she isn't -- she isn't Cherokee, because she does NOT have a direct ancestor on the Dawes Rolls. She flat out lied. And you can blame me all you want for it, but it doesn't change the fact that her direct ancestors killed Cherokee and settled illegally on Cherokee land, and then she stole Cherokee identity to suit her own purposes -- whatever they may be.

That's NOT disingenuous. It's factual.

It doesn't mean she's a worse person than Donald Trump. And it doesn't mean that she should barred from public life. But it is a lie, bald-faced and inexcusable.

Which, of course, is why she apologized for it.

it seems to me we’re approaching this from two different angles: (1) whether or not she has native heritage, and (2) whether the degree of that heritage qualifies her for minority status

the funny thing is that the criteria for such status is largely arbitrary, whether its bestowed by the feds or by an individual tribe/band/nation

should she have claimed such status on the card you linked? no, probably not (and i wouldn’t have either). but that doesn’t change what her DNA says.

somewhat ironically, there was a story on npr last night on my way home that was talking about the native peoples of Utah, and how the feds, arbitrarily, lumped a number of bands together and recognized them all as Ute...even though they are different peoples with different cultures and different heritages. some of those that aren’t actually Ute, but were lumped in with them, have been banished from the Ute and Ouray reservations because of their fight to maintain sovereignty and cultural identity, and have lost their livelihoods as a result. my point in referencing this story is that it isn’t a simple black/white issue...even among those who nobody would question as being “native”.

i don’t know the warrens personally, and i’d imagine neither do you. i choose to give her the benefit of the doubt, and you apparently do not. that’s fine. equating her behavior with that of trump is, indeed, disingenuous whether you want to admit so or not.

obviously not the same, but i regularly tout my Scottish/Irish ancestry even though it represents a relatively small proportion of my family tree. i do so, i suppose, because it seems cooler and more romantic than German or “western european”, whatever that is. if i has been told since i was a child that i had native american ancestry, there is no doubt that i would do the same, regardless of the degree. but again, as i said earlier, there is no way i’d make the leap to trying to be recognized as a minority.

[Shirley]

"Trade wars are good and easy to win."

[seahawk]

Anyone who seriously thinks that Warren would have ever done the DNA test if she had known she was "lying", i.e., wrong, to have believed that she did have native American ancestry, is likely too dum to feed themselves.

What I think is that if you've lived in Oklahoma, you know that there are people of Cherokee "heritage" and there are people who ARE Cherokees and that distinction is pretty well known. But, it shouldn't have been the big deal that Warren let it become. A candidate knows what will come up and they and their advisers figure out what to say, how to offset that. My experience in watching local elections is that voters often vote for the person that does everything they can to win.

If Elizabeth Warren were that kind of candidate, she'd hire an Axelrod or a Carrville and listen to them and get rid of that Harvard/Yale cabal. She would have apologized right away, gone back to Oklahoma and given some Major speech about Native Americans. (See Obama with the speech on race after Rev. Wright revelations). She would have also done some stuff previously for Native American women--prior to starting to run for election.

Doing the DNA test just showed how rigid she is and that she's not going to do every last thing to show voters, because she always knows she's right and she's by god going to prove it to everyone.

She's still the Harvard Law professor vying with Bernie Sanders for the elite white vote, not going after every vote that it will take to win.

[DCHawk1]

Pat Caddell is gone now (and had moved in strange directions before that), but I always wondered why Democratic candidates don't recycle the more successful strategists -- like Caddell, Carville, Axe, etc. They recycle the losers, but not the winners.

[TDub]

You cant be progressive if you're relying on the past. And that's no malarkey.


Jokes aside, that is an interesting question. I do think there is such a push to be new and cutting edge that there is a tendency to miss lessons from past campaigns. I think that happens on both sides, but more so on the democratic side due to the make up of the base.

[japhy]

Yeah!!! it's not Person of the Year but it's something.

https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-mete ... wer-wrong/

[Geezer]

[DCHawk1]

[Deleted User 289]

Serious question/s.
Was anyone on here who is reading this a participant in the Fox News Has the President abused power, Obstructed Congress, Committed bribery, Poll?
What about the new CNN poll that shows support for impeachment and removal at 45% and opposition at 47% - or the 3 previous CNN polls showing support and opposition for impeachment and removal?
My point in asking, what about the majority of the country who had ZERO say in those polls?
They and their opinion/s don't matter - in terms of the polls. Right?
I can't speak for everyone but my guess is the majority of those on here realize polls are worth nothing more than what those who are interpreting them want them (or don't want them) to mean.
That being said, why do some of us give them so much power and/or meaning - and on the flip side, why do some of us choose to completely discount the results?

[Shirley]

[Shirley]

[chiknbut]

[Geezer]

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/impeachment-polls/

[DCHawk1]

lulz

[chiknbut]

[DCHawk1]

Give your money to George Conway. High-larious.

[Shirley]

[Geezer]

Sinks, uh, showers, all of this stuff, I did a lot of it. No water comes out. You have areas where there’s so much water you don’t know what to do with it. You turn on the shower, you’re not allowed to have any water anymore. I mean, we do a lot of it. Uh, dishwashers. You did the dishwasher, right? You press it. Remember the dishwasher, you press it? Boom, there’d be like an explosion, five minutes later, you open it, the steam pours out, the dishes. Now you press it 12 times. Women tell me. Again. You know, they give you four drops of water. And they’re in places where there’s so much water they don’t know what to do with it. So we just came out with a reg on dishwashers. We’re going back to you.

... Now we’re doing it with a lot of other things. Uh, dishwashers, and uh, you know. I won’t tell you one of the things because every time I tell you they do a big number on it. You know the one I’m talking about, right? Sinks, right? Showers? And what goes with a sink and a shower?

[Crowd chants, “A toilet!”]

Ten times, right? Ten times. [Trump does flushing motion while saying something that sounds like ‘bah, bop.’] Not me of course, not me, but you. You. But I never mention that. Because one time I mentioned all three. I said, sinks, showers, and toilets. The headline was, ‘Trump with the toilets, toilets.’ That’s all they want. They don’t even mention the, so I didn’t mention that, okay? I go off the record.

But you know what, it’s terrible. You wanna wash your hands, you turn on the sink, no water comes out. So you leave the water, go ten times as long, it’s same thing. You have a shower. Drip. It’s no good for me, for me.

You know, the one thing that came out really good about being in this business, they used to say I wore a hairpiece...