Kansas Crimson

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:43 pm

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:34 pm Now, don't get pissy with me. I'm not saying he should walk. And I'm not saying this is a good excuse. This, in fact, is WHY you don't put your knee on a guy's neck, even if you know it won't choke him to death. Cuz a guy with hypertensive heart disease just might fucking die anyway. I'm just saying that this -- plus a toxicology report, if there's anything in it -- will be an issue.

Certainly makes factual causation tougher, but prosecutors will find someone pretty easily to tie it together.

twocoach wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:39 pm

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:34 pm Now, don't get pissy with me. I'm not saying he should walk. And I'm not saying this is a good excuse. This, in fact, is WHY you don't put your knee on a guy's neck, even if you know it won't choke him to death. Cuz a guy with hypertensive heart disease just might fucking die anyway. I'm just saying that this -- plus a toxicology report, if there's anything in it -- will be an issue.

Yeah, I just saw that, too. Man, this will be an interesting case for sure.

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:34 pm Now, don't get pissy with me. I'm not saying he should walk. And I'm not saying this is a good excuse. This, in fact, is WHY you don't put your knee on a guy's neck, even if you know it won't choke him to death. Cuz a guy with hypertensive heart disease just might fucking die anyway. I'm just saying that this -- plus a toxicology report, if there's anything in it -- will be an issue.

twocoach wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:46 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:43 pm

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:34 pm Now, don't get pissy with me. I'm not saying he should walk. And I'm not saying this is a good excuse. This, in fact, is WHY you don't put your knee on a guy's neck, even if you know it won't choke him to death. Cuz a guy with hypertensive heart disease just might fucking die anyway. I'm just saying that this -- plus a toxicology report, if there's anything in it -- will be an issue.

Certainly makes factual causation tougher, but prosecutors will find someone pretty easily to tie it together.

It feels like the defense could also easily find an expert who could separate the two actions enough to create "reasonable doubt" if the jury is amenable to it. Ugh, what a mess.

ousdahl wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:16 pm what makes you guys think he’ll walk?

Is there some particular detail?

...besides the fact cops walk for killing people of color all the fucking time...

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:43 pm

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:34 pm Now, don't get pissy with me. I'm not saying he should walk. And I'm not saying this is a good excuse. This, in fact, is WHY you don't put your knee on a guy's neck, even if you know it won't choke him to death. Cuz a guy with hypertensive heart disease just might fucking die anyway. I'm just saying that this -- plus a toxicology report, if there's anything in it -- will be an issue.

Certainly makes factual causation tougher, but prosecutors will find someone pretty easily to tie it together.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 4:02 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:43 pm

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:34 pm Now, don't get pissy with me. I'm not saying he should walk. And I'm not saying this is a good excuse. This, in fact, is WHY you don't put your knee on a guy's neck, even if you know it won't choke him to death. Cuz a guy with hypertensive heart disease just might fucking die anyway. I'm just saying that this -- plus a toxicology report, if there's anything in it -- will be an issue.

Certainly makes factual causation tougher, but prosecutors will find someone pretty easily to tie it together.

I guess I don't see this report as all that helpful.

Seems like it's ready-made for a prosecutor to identify where in the tape he goes unresponsive, set a timer to when the knee comes off, and ask the jury to try to hold their breath.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 4:02 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:43 pm

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:34 pm Now, don't get pissy with me. I'm not saying he should walk. And I'm not saying this is a good excuse. This, in fact, is WHY you don't put your knee on a guy's neck, even if you know it won't choke him to death. Cuz a guy with hypertensive heart disease just might fucking die anyway. I'm just saying that this -- plus a toxicology report, if there's anything in it -- will be an issue.

Certainly makes factual causation tougher, but prosecutors will find someone pretty easily to tie it together.

I guess I don't see this report as all that helpful.

Seems like it's ready-made for a prosecutor to identify where in the tape he goes unresponsive, set a timer to when the knee comes off, and ask the jury to try to hold their breath.

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 4:23 pm Didn't say it should. Just that it could.

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 4:23 pm Didn't say it should. Just that it could.

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 4:27 pm In fact, in real life, you don't have to deprive a guy with hypertensive heart disease of oxygen for long before you effectively kill him.


And along those lines, I still want to know what happened that he ended up on the ground, already cuffed, with three guys on him -- because the reports say he was telling officers he couldn't breathe before the original video.

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 4:33 pm I think the prosecutor may actually get a pretty favorable jury pool in Minny (it's not the south), but you never really know until it's all over.

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 4:12 pm

jfish26 wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 4:02 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:43 pm

Certainly makes factual causation tougher, but prosecutors will find someone pretty easily to tie it together.

I guess I don't see this report as all that helpful.

Seems like it's ready-made for a prosecutor to identify where in the tape he goes unresponsive, set a timer to when the knee comes off, and ask the jury to try to hold their breath.

I don't see that as relevant/admissible for the factual causation element, but perhaps for the depraved mind element(s). I think DC is trying to say the ME will hurt the causation element.