Kansas Crimson

We need to get some more Iowa kids like Roi did. Honestly, why would a kid from the east coast want to come to Kansas? I mean it's freaking Kansas, especially if they get offers from Duke, UNC, UK, etc. If I was a kid, I'd much rather go to Arizona than Kansas, especially if I only plan to stay a year or two.

PhDhawk wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2019 3:46 pm

NDballer13 wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2019 3:44 pm That's why I don't buy the whole "FBI is effecting recruiting" complaint by KU fans.

so...what is affecting recruiting?

I agree with NDBaller, but only partially.

I absolutely think that the FBI situation is both affecting and effecting our current recruiting.

We can only imagine other coaches are saying, I know you’re considering KU but bear in mind they’ve recently had star recruits sit out more years than not, so you don’t want that to happen to you too, right?

Maybe it is other factors such as not wanting to come off the bench and stuff. But maybe there is concern about eligibility, fbi, shit like that.

Plenty of other schools have been implicated in stuff as bad or worse than anything we’ve been caught up in. (With no apparent detriment to recruiting?) Maybe it’s simply the fact that while other schools have shrugged it off, KU has been more forthright and actually self-report shit...shame on us.

ousdahl wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 9:37 am We can only imagine other coaches are saying, I know you’re considering KU but bear in mind they’ve recently had star recruits sit out more years than not, so you don’t want that to happen to you too, right?

Maybe it is other factors such as not wanting to come off the bench and stuff. But maybe there is concern about eligibility, fbi, shit like that.

Plenty of other schools have been implicated in stuff as bad or worse than anything we’ve been caught up in. (With no apparent detriment to recruiting?) Maybe it’s simply the fact that while other schools have shrugged it off, KU has been more forthright and actually self-report shit...shame on us.

I can't disagree with any of this. Were I competing with KU for a guy, I'd just show that guy pictures of our guys on the bench in street clothes.

The Langfords said point black that it cost us Romeo.

And, this is speculation, but why did Robinson-Earl and Hurt, huge KU leans, do complete 180's and commit to schools that were never on their respective lists?

I agree w/ jfish on the goldilocks zone. It's not hurting us with guys ranked 50-100. It's the top 25 guys where we're going up against the bigger programs. If I were them and had no KU ties, I don't know that I'd risk anything, either.

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 9:41 am The Langfords said point black that it cost us Romeo.

And, this is speculation, but why did Robinson-Earl and Hurt, huge KU leans, do complete 180's and commit to schools that were never on their respective lists?

I agree w/ jfish on the goldilocks zone. It's not hurting us with guys ranked 50-100. It's the top 25 guys where we're going up against the bigger programs. If I were them and had no KU ties, I don't know that I'd risk anything, either.

Which isn't getting better after - for infuriating, unfair and yet completely logical reasons - absofuckinglutely nothing happened to Zion or Duke.

ousdahl wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 9:37 am Plenty of other schools have been implicated in stuff as bad or worse than anything we’ve been caught up in. (With no apparent detriment to recruiting?) Maybe it’s simply the fact that while other schools have shrugged it off, KU has been more forthright and actually self-report shit...shame on us.

and as another poster said, KU has sat players while others have not...despite red flags

It seems to me that KU is trying to abide by the rules, despite what has been revealed. Meanwhile, the other programs that have been implicated are choosing to still cheat and don't seem to care.

So maybe we are being treated unfairly, or maybe we’re only treating ourselves unfairly, by trying to do the right thing.

If, say, we shrug off and deny the next issue, and ncaa gives us the kiss of death for it, complete with some shit about making an example of us for not self-reporting, then maybe we really are being disproportionally punished.

ousdahl wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 10:24 am So maybe we are being treated unfairly, or maybe we’re only treating ourselves unfairly, by trying to do the right thing.

If, say, we shrug off and deny the next issue, and ncaa gives us the kiss of death for it, complete with some shit about making an example of us for not self-reporting, then maybe we really are being disproportionally punished.

I think it's clear we already are being disproportionately punished. What I don't know is how much of that is our fault, versus someone else's fault versus plain bad luck. At some point, though, this botched process seems more like our fault than anyone else's.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 10:57 am

ousdahl wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 10:24 am So maybe we are being treated unfairly, or maybe we’re only treating ourselves unfairly, by trying to do the right thing.

If, say, we shrug off and deny the next issue, and ncaa gives us the kiss of death for it, complete with some shit about making an example of us for not self-reporting, then maybe we really are being disproportionally punished.

I think it's clear we already are being disproportionately punished. What I don't know is how much of that is our fault, versus someone else's fault versus plain bad luck. At some point, though, this botched process seems more like our fault than anyone else's.

It's E) All of the above.

Bad luck, bad faith, bad actions by Adidas dopes, bad decisions by associates of recruits (Cliff's parents, Preston's mom, DeSousa's guardian), bad timing, the list goes on and on. KU has had a bunch of things flare at the same time to result in th he current situation.

That said, we may very well be landing a Top 5 player and a Top 50 player to go with our already signed Top 50 player and 2 developmental recruits which means the end results are a typical KU class. A likely OAD to go with 2 2-3 year players and 2 4 year players.

The current situation is temporary and we seem to be on the verge of surviving it. It's a nauseating ride that is made worse by Twitter dopes getting some KU fans all spazzed out on an hourly basis.

Perhaps the worst part of it all, again, is that the only thing we “botched” was thinking it benefited us to be forthcoming.

ousdahl wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 1:15 pm Perhaps the worst part of it all, again, is that the only thing we “botched” was thinking it benefited us to be forthcoming.

Maybe. But it's clear from multiple processes that, for whatever reason, we've had a lot of trouble submitting complete paperwork.

Well, what if in the first place all along we just said “we conducted a thorough investigation of Silvio and he’s cool,” or just said “Billy was in a minor fender bender but it’s nbd,” where would we be now?

Wasn’t it us who said, yeah we should diligently look further into this?

ousdahl wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 1:25 pm Well, what if in the first place all along we just said “we conducted a thorough investigation of Silvio and he’s cool,” or just said “Billy was in a minor fender bender but it’s nbd,” where would we be now?

Wasn’t it us who said, yeah we should diligently look further into this?

Yes. We've consistently not been willing to take the risk that the NCAA would call our bluff and look into things. That used to be a defensible approach, but it's not anymore, not after 2 years for what has been disclosed about Silvio's situation (and not after Mizzou got similarly boned).

We botched when we cheated. We botched when we got caught. We have absolutely botched the sds appeal process.

If in fact we have gone above and beyond cooperating with the ncaa, then that is the only thing in all this process that we did not botch.

You get caught with your hand in the cookie jar you pay the consequences. We need to pay up and move on.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 1:17 pm

ousdahl wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 1:15 pm Perhaps the worst part of it all, again, is that the only thing we “botched” was thinking it benefited us to be forthcoming.

Maybe. But it's clear from multiple processes that, for whatever reason, we've had a lot of trouble submitting complete paperwork.

Nothing is clear. Maybe we have submitted everything and the NCAA is just dragging it out to try to force SDS out. We can assume but we dont know.

twocoach wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 1:40 pm

jfish26 wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 1:17 pm

ousdahl wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 1:15 pm Perhaps the worst part of it all, again, is that the only thing we “botched” was thinking it benefited us to be forthcoming.

Maybe. But it's clear from multiple processes that, for whatever reason, we've had a lot of trouble submitting complete paperwork.

Nothing is clear. Maybe we have submitted everything and the NCAA is just dragging it out to try to force SDS out. We can assume but we dont know.

What would the NCAA gain by forcing him out?

Some petty victory for The Rules?

MICHHAWK wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 1:35 pm We botched when we cheated. We botched when we got caught. We have absolutely botched the sds appeal process.

If in fact we have gone above and beyond cooperating with the ncaa, then that is the only thing in all this process that we did not botch.

You get caught with your hand in the cookie jar you pay the consequences. We need to pay up and move on.

Without some smoking gun of a KU staffer directing a specific something to a specific someone, it seems kinda too broad to say we cheated. (Also bear in mind this kind of shit is and has been widespread. It’s not like it’s limited to KU).

And did we get caught, or just self-report, when few other schools bother? In that regard, maybe the fact we did self-report is precisely what we botched - at least with Silvio and Billy.

Cuz that’s the thing! Even if we did get caught with our hand in the cookie jar, is it worth simply saying “no that’s not our hand” if it means potentially...no consequences after all?