Mahomie

[holidaysmore]

I thought secondary as well. They need bigger, lanky corners like Ward. Nelson is gone but you have Ward, Fuller, EB, Watts, Murray and Dirty Dan. Go out and draft or spend on a true #1 corner. A ball hawking safety would be nice as well...cough, cough Earl Thomas.
Houston is gone. Franchise Ford. Resign Jones. Hope that Nnadi and Williams are ready because Bailey is probably gone.

I was just thinking...and without seeing the defensive snaps from last night for a team that likes to play press man it seemed like the Chiefs were in off coverage a lot. Brady would take 3 or 5 step drops and immediately have the ball out to a wide open Pats WR.
I think back to the Denver teams that had some success against the Pats and Talib, CH JR / No Fly Zone would come up and beat the crap out of the Pats WR at the line. Maybe Sutton didn’t believe his personnel was good enough to play that same way.

[twocoach]

You being serious?

Are you saying that he is selfish for trying to overcome his injury and be on the field? Maybe I missed you supporting your accusation with reasoning somewhere. I am busy right now so not skimming back through all these posts.

Berry made it pretty clear that his motivation was to play in the Super Bowl because, among other reasons, it's in his hometown. In service of that motivation, he refused to go on IR and made himself a distraction throughout the year. Then, whether because of the injury or general rust, he wasn't very good when he did play.

Well OK. I guess we will agree to disagree.

Berry wanted to play in the Super Bowl- pretty sure all his teammates did too. I hope you dont believe that if the Suoer Bowl was in Phoenix that he wouldnt have been as motivated to try to get there.

I have not heard a single player or coach say that Berry's situation was a distraction. By all accounts he has been a tremendous leader and has been a very active coach to all of the DBs trying to help them while he could not play.

And no one on defense was very good yesterday. If nit Berry then who? His replacements have been playing all season and our defense sucked with them in the lineup too. The scheme we run under Sutton is garbage and does not put players in a position to impact the game enough.

Sutton teaches BS defense where you sit around waiting for the offensive player to come at you and try to scramble and tackle them. They got gashed up the middle, gashed on the sidelines, gashed down the seams. Belicbik and Brady eviscerated his garbage system.

The Chiefs would be wise to do like they did with Alex Smith and realize that Sutton's ceiling prevents them from their ultimate goal. Time to move on from him.

[jfish26]

Are you saying that he is selfish for trying to overcome his injury and be on the field? Maybe I missed you supporting your accusation with reasoning somewhere. I am busy right now so not skimming back through all these posts.

Berry made it pretty clear that his motivation was to play in the Super Bowl because, among other reasons, it's in his hometown. In service of that motivation, he refused to go on IR and made himself a distraction throughout the year. Then, whether because of the injury or general rust, he wasn't very good when he did play.

Well OK. I guess we will agree to disagree.

Berry wanted to play in the Super Bowl- pretty sure all his teammates did too. I hope you dont believe that if the Suoer Bowl was in Phoenix that he wouldnt have been as motivated to try to get there.

I have not heard a single player or coach say that Berry's situation was a distraction. By all accounts he has been a tremendous leader and has been a very active coach to all of the DBs trying to help them while he could not play.

And no one on defense was very good yesterday. If nit Berry then who? His replacements have been playing all season and our defense sucked with them in the lineup too. The scheme we run under Sutton is garbage and does not put players in a position to impact the game enough.

Sutton teaches BS defense where you sit around waiting for the offensive player to come at you and try to scramble and tackle them. They got gashed up the middle, gashed on the sidelines, gashed down the seams. Belicbik and Brady eviscerated his garbage system.

The Chiefs would be wise to do like they did with Alex Smith and realize that Sutton's ceiling prevents them from their ultimate goal. Time to move on from him.

That's exactly what I believe. I don't believe, for a second, that multiple people covering the Chiefs (Mellinger, Pryor, Paylor, Taylor) would bring up the hometown thing (and Berry's desire to play in an Atlanta Super Bowl) so often, and so consistently, if it wasn't a factor.

[vmlb]

Rehashing last night:
Reid has never learned that he needed to play defense with his offense.
The drive that started with 3:26 to go in the game, he ran the ball 1 time. Hence the drive was for 1:29.
If he runs the ball 5 times, for 0 yards, in that drive, they win the game. Every play was a pass play except the TD run from the one yard line. Memories of the Colts loss.
I will give him credit for calling a TO when the Pats were going to score. That at least got us into OT.
Pats Oline was better then Chefs. That was the difference in the game. Also Gronk>Kelce. Pats had 48 rushing attempts, Chefs had 12. I wonder why our dline was tired in the OT?

On to the off season. Gonna be fun seeing who gets signed, who gets released, who gets drafted.
Do you sign Hill? Ford? Patty?
Do you release Houston?
Does Berry get offseason surgery? Will he be ready by game 3?
Do they get some LBs in the draft? Joe? Am I just being a homer? Mr. Wise?
Mitch Morris? Resign or let him walk?

I strongly disagree with this. The Chiefs run game, when used as a primary attack and not a complementary option, is awful. I understand that there comes a time when you play defense with your offense, but that's limited to when you're in field goal range and only need a field goal to win (if your running stalls).

In the situation the Chiefs were in, you never ever don't use your best stuff to get a touchdown, whenever it comes.

[vmlb]

sorry, this site sucks,
I put in a response 90 minute ago

[twocoach]

Berry made it pretty clear that his motivation was to play in the Super Bowl because, among other reasons, it's in his hometown. In service of that motivation, he refused to go on IR and made himself a distraction throughout the year. Then, whether because of the injury or general rust, he wasn't very good when he did play.

Well OK. I guess we will agree to disagree.

Berry wanted to play in the Super Bowl- pretty sure all his teammates did too. I hope you dont believe that if the Suoer Bowl was in Phoenix that he wouldnt have been as motivated to try to get there.

I have not heard a single player or coach say that Berry's situation was a distraction. By all accounts he has been a tremendous leader and has been a very active coach to all of the DBs trying to help them while he could not play.

And no one on defense was very good yesterday. If nit Berry then who? His replacements have been playing all season and our defense sucked with them in the lineup too. The scheme we run under Sutton is garbage and does not put players in a position to impact the game enough.

Sutton teaches BS defense where you sit around waiting for the offensive player to come at you and try to scramble and tackle them. They got gashed up the middle, gashed on the sidelines, gashed down the seams. Belicbik and Brady eviscerated his garbage system.

The Chiefs would be wise to do like they did with Alex Smith and realize that Sutton's ceiling prevents them from their ultimate goal. Time to move on from him.

That's exactly what I believe. I don't believe, for a second, that multiple people covering the Chiefs (Mellinger, Pryor, Paylor, Taylor) would bring up the hometown thing (and Berry's desire to play in an Atlanta Super Bowl) so often, and so consistently, if it wasn't a factor.

Gee, it couldnt just be that media members think it makes a nice angle to the story. I just read the "Possible Trip to Hometown Super Bowl Fueling Eric Berry's Second Return to Chiefs" story that ran in the kc star. There is nothing in the story that supports that headline as an actual thought of Berry himself. It appears that dramatic headlines have convinced you of something that may or may not be true.

What I did see in there were multiple quotes from players and coaches such as "Eric Berry has kind of taken me under his wing since I got here. We call him 'Coach' in our room because he's so knowledgable" and "He means a lot to our team and our defense, so whenever we can have him out there, it's a great thing."

[jfish26]

Well OK. I guess we will agree to disagree.

Berry wanted to play in the Super Bowl- pretty sure all his teammates did too. I hope you dont believe that if the Suoer Bowl was in Phoenix that he wouldnt have been as motivated to try to get there.

I have not heard a single player or coach say that Berry's situation was a distraction. By all accounts he has been a tremendous leader and has been a very active coach to all of the DBs trying to help them while he could not play.

And no one on defense was very good yesterday. If nit Berry then who? His replacements have been playing all season and our defense sucked with them in the lineup too. The scheme we run under Sutton is garbage and does not put players in a position to impact the game enough.

Sutton teaches BS defense where you sit around waiting for the offensive player to come at you and try to scramble and tackle them. They got gashed up the middle, gashed on the sidelines, gashed down the seams. Belicbik and Brady eviscerated his garbage system.

The Chiefs would be wise to do like they did with Alex Smith and realize that Sutton's ceiling prevents them from their ultimate goal. Time to move on from him.

That's exactly what I believe. I don't believe, for a second, that multiple people covering the Chiefs (Mellinger, Pryor, Paylor, Taylor) would bring up the hometown thing (and Berry's desire to play in an Atlanta Super Bowl) so often, and so consistently, if it wasn't a factor.

Gee, it couldnt just be that media members think it makes a nice angle to the story. I just read the "Possible Trip to Hometown Super Bowl Fueling Eric Berry's Second Return to Chiefs" story that ran in the kc star. There is nothing in the story that supports that headline as an actual thought of Berry himself. It appears that dramatic headlines have convinced you of something that may or may not be true.

What I did see in there were multiple quotes from players and coaches such as "Eric Berry has kind of taken me under his wing since I got here. We call him 'Coach' in our room because he's so knowledgable" and "He means a lot to our team and our defense, so whenever we can have him out there, it's a great thing."

All I can say is it's not just headlines. All of those writers are on the radio with some frequency here, and they make it very clear that the angle is not merely a convenient link. They are very clear that Atlanta is a specifically-motivating item here.

[twocoach]

So what? Again, you're using that information to jump to the conclusion that he would have chosen to go on IR if the Super Bowl was somewhere else.

If Ford lines up onside then everyone sings the praise of what a warrior and team player Berry is for overcoming yet another tough break.

Fans get carried away when their team loses. This whole conversation just feels like anorher overreaction to a brutallt frustrating season ender. Whatever.

[jfish26]

So what? Again, you're using that information to jump to the conclusion that he would have chosen to go on IR if the Super Bowl was somewhere else.

If Ford lines up onside then everyone sings the praise of what a warrior and team player Berry is for overcoming yet another tough break.

Fans get carried away when their team loses. This whole conversation just feels like anorher overreaction to a brutallt frustrating season ender. Whatever.

I think I've bee pretty consistent in this thread about my uneasiness with the Berry situation, going back a while.

Do I know that he would have gone on IR if the Super Bowl was somewhere else? Of course I don't.

Do I think he would have been more realistic and honest about his recovery if the Super Bowl was not going to be in Atlanta? I do.

Do I think the Chiefs would have been better off putting him on IR instead of going along with Berry's process? I do.

[twocoach]

So what? Again, you're using that information to jump to the conclusion that he would have chosen to go on IR if the Super Bowl was somewhere else.

If Ford lines up onside then everyone sings the praise of what a warrior and team player Berry is for overcoming yet another tough break.

Fans get carried away when their team loses. This whole conversation just feels like anorher overreaction to a brutallt frustrating season ender. Whatever.

I think I've bee pretty consistent in this thread about my uneasiness with the Berry situation, going back a while.

Do I know that he would have gone on IR if the Super Bowl was somewhere else? Of course I don't.

Do I think he would have been more realistic and honest about his recovery if the Super Bowl was not going to be in Atlanta? I do.

Do I think the Chiefs would have been better off putting him on IR instead of going along with Berry's process? I do.

Why do you think the Chiefs would have been better off if he went on IR? We played basically all season without him and there is zero evidence that he replaced a player who would have done better than him lasr night.

Maybe if he is on IR then he isn't in the DB room all season, our DBs play even more terrible than they did and the Chiefs dont even make the playoffs. Who knows. It's just a huge leap of logic to blame it for anything.

KC fell short. Again. At least enough good parts are in place that we have a great shot to build on this versus it being a one time fluky season.

[Deleted User 104]

I wish we still had the kick feature (to use on Gutter).

[Deleted User 104]

The one thing that is clear is that no team was better than the other last night. It all just came down to luck.

[jfish26]

So what? Again, you're using that information to jump to the conclusion that he would have chosen to go on IR if the Super Bowl was somewhere else.

If Ford lines up onside then everyone sings the praise of what a warrior and team player Berry is for overcoming yet another tough break.

Fans get carried away when their team loses. This whole conversation just feels like anorher overreaction to a brutallt frustrating season ender. Whatever.

I think I've bee pretty consistent in this thread about my uneasiness with the Berry situation, going back a while.

Do I know that he would have gone on IR if the Super Bowl was somewhere else? Of course I don't.

Do I think he would have been more realistic and honest about his recovery if the Super Bowl was not going to be in Atlanta? I do.

Do I think the Chiefs would have been better off putting him on IR instead of going along with Berry's process? I do.

Why do you think the Chiefs would have been better off if he went on IR? We played basically all season without him and there is zero evidence that he replaced a player who would have done better than him lasr night.

Maybe if he is on IR then he isn't in the DB room all season, our DBs play even more terrible than they did and the Chiefs dont even make the playoffs. Who knows. It's just a huge leap of logic to blame it for anything.

KC fell short. Again. At least enough good parts are in place that we have a great shot to build on this versus it being a one time fluky season.

I would tend to think that if you're not going to have a useful version of a player, it's better and easier to just plan not to have him. Not that I personally care about Clark Hunt's money, also, but it's certainly possible that not going on IR prevented the Chiefs from making an insurance claim to recover a meaningful amount of money.

[CrimsonNBlue]

The one thing that is clear is that no team was better than the other last night. It all just came down to luck.

I don't see that as clear at all. In fact, it was pretty clear that the Pats played like the better team last night for that particular game. Nothing the Chiefs did on either side of the ball confounded the Pats and the Pats successfully limited the Chiefs two biggest strengths: home run plays with Hill and the pass rush.

The pats actually made more mistakes than the Chiefs did last night and still won. That's how much they dominated the Chiefs outside of the mistakes. The Chiefs still had a chance, though, and what I do think is clear is if the Chiefs would have played their game or at their ceiling like the Pats did, the Chiefs would have won by 2+ scores.

[Deleted User 104]

If you're judging the whole game, yes the Pats played better. If you're judging the 4th quarter, we scored 24, right? We were playing much better than the Pats when it mattered the most. Only to have it stripped away by a "roughing the passer" call, and then the bad luck of a coin. That's all it came down to. Brady had the worst performance of his playoff career with 3 or 4 picks.

[jfish26]

The one thing that is clear is that no team was better than the other last night. It all just came down to luck.

I don't see that as clear at all. In fact, it was pretty clear that the Pats played like the better team last night for that particular game. Nothing the Chiefs did on either side of the ball confounded the Pats and the Pats successfully limited the Chiefs two biggest strengths: home run plays with Hill and the pass rush.

The pats actually made more mistakes than the Chiefs did last night and still won. That's how much they dominated the Chiefs outside of the mistakes. The Chiefs still had a chance, though, and what I do think is clear is if the Chiefs would have played their game or at their ceiling like the Pats did, the Chiefs would have won by 2+ scores.

Honestly, chasing 14 (and getting the ball) was a best-best-best-case outcome for how comprehensively whooped the Chiefs were in the first half.

[CrimsonNBlue]

If you're judging the whole game, yes the Pats played better. If you're judging the 4th quarter, we scored 24, right? We were playing much better than the Pats when it mattered the most. Only to have it stripped away by a "roughing the passer" call, and then the bad luck of a coin. That's all it came down to. Brady had the worst performance of his playoff career with 3 or 4 picks.

Well you stated that one team wasn't better than the other last night, so I wasn't aware that we could only consider a certain part of the game.

The roughing the passer call was terrible, but was called with half the 4th quarter left. Something tells me that Sutton's defense was broken a little bit more than that single time they got pressure. Brady had one terrible play and was basically brilliant the rest of the game.

The game was lost b/c Sutton got his ass kicked and Mahomes/Reid had an awful first half. That makes for a big difference in a game with two good teams going at it in a big game.

[CrimsonNBlue]

The one thing that is clear is that no team was better than the other last night. It all just came down to luck.

I don't see that as clear at all. In fact, it was pretty clear that the Pats played like the better team last night for that particular game. Nothing the Chiefs did on either side of the ball confounded the Pats and the Pats successfully limited the Chiefs two biggest strengths: home run plays with Hill and the pass rush.

The pats actually made more mistakes than the Chiefs did last night and still won. That's how much they dominated the Chiefs outside of the mistakes. The Chiefs still had a chance, though, and what I do think is clear is if the Chiefs would have played their game or at their ceiling like the Pats did, the Chiefs would have won by 2+ scores.

Honestly, chasing 14 (and getting the ball) was a best-best-best-case outcome for how comprehensively whooped the Chiefs were in the first half.

Correct. The hole was way too big and the Ragland INT of Brady saved the game for the Chiefs.

[LVCHawk]

But they did come back, and they had it won if Ford didn't line up offsides. NE doesn't make boneheaded mistakes like that in big games, which is one reason why they continually win.

[holidaysmore]

I struggled to think this morning was it more that the Chiefs beat themselves or were the Pats the better team.
IMO the three biggest things were...

1. Penalties. Chiefs were a undisciplined team. Eventually playing like that it will come back to haunt. Boy, did it ever last night. Six inches and an absolute STUPID play by Ford cost this team a trip to the SB.
2. Inability to stop teams on 3rd down. Chiefs set a LEAGUE record this year for allowing teams to convert on 3rd downs. It showed last night. Which leads to my last point...
3. The Pats did a magnificent job negating the Chiefs strengths and the lack of adjustments on both sides killed them. The lack of creativity to get Hill and Kelce open along with the pass rush having ZERO affect on Brady was astounding. Last night we saw first hand what a first class, Super Bowl winning coaching staff looks like.