Kansas Crimson

pdub wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 8:06 pm

PhDhawk wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2019 10:41 am

jfish26 wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2019 10:28 am

I'm not surprised.

I thought the finale was fine, on its own. The characters' various resolutions were...B+? A-?

How we got here, though, was a complete fucking mess. The last two seasons - needlessly rushed and truncated, with massive dissonances and plot holes resulting - really undercut the weight of the series, taken as a whole. Fears that the show had permanently lost its fastball when it outran the source material were 100% founded.

Tyrion was right: it's the story that matters, and the back 1/3 of this story sucked ass.

I'm still trying to understand why the final two seasons were 13 episodes instead of 20. I think those missing 7 episodes would have made things significantly better. Even in the absence of the original source material, you gotta think 7 hours allows you to fill in a lot of what was missing.

This.
Hell three more episodes if written well enough could have done it.

No matter how many episodes they did, people would complain that they needed more.

I've moved on to Chernobyl, what a harrowing, fantastic show.

KU76erfan wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 10:09 am I've moved on to Chernobyl, what a harrowing, fantastic show.

^^^

twocoach wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 9:50 am

pdub wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 8:06 pm

PhDhawk wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2019 10:41 am

I'm still trying to understand why the final two seasons were 13 episodes instead of 20. I think those missing 7 episodes would have made things significantly better. Even in the absence of the original source material, you gotta think 7 hours allows you to fill in a lot of what was missing.

This.
Hell three more episodes if written well enough could have done it.

No matter how many episodes they did, people would complain that they needed more.

This is true, but the perfect doesn't need to be the enemy of the good. Also, the choice to do just 13 after Season 6 was entirely that - a choice. There was no need to abandon the ten-episode-season format.

laziness

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 10:35 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 9:50 am

pdub wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 8:06 pm

This.
Hell three more episodes if written well enough could have done it.

No matter how many episodes they did, people would complain that they needed more.

This is true, but the perfect doesn't need to be the enemy of the good. Also, the choice to do just 13 after Season 6 was entirely that - a choice. There was no need to abandon the ten-episode-season format.

And it invites criticism.

It's easier to forgive having looose ends or cramming stuff in to the format that already existed.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 10:35 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 9:50 am

pdub wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 8:06 pm

This.
Hell three more episodes if written well enough could have done it.

No matter how many episodes they did, people would complain that they needed more.

This is true, but the perfect doesn't need to be the enemy of the good. Also, the choice to do just 13 after Season 6 was entirely that - a choice. There was no need to abandon the ten-episode-season format.

This season was less than 2 episodes shorter than a standard 10 episode season length due to the nearly 80 minute episode length of half the season.

There was no way for them to land this jumbo jet without complaints.

twocoach wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 10:52 am

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 10:35 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 9:50 am
No matter how many episodes they did, people would complain that they needed more.

This is true, but the perfect doesn't need to be the enemy of the good. Also, the choice to do just 13 after Season 6 was entirely that - a choice. There was no need to abandon the ten-episode-season format.

This season was less than 2 episodes shorter than a standard 10 episode season length due to the nearly 80 minute episode length of half the season.

There was no way for them to land this jumbo jet without complaints.

Eh, you don't get minute-for-minute credit for the extra time in a serialized show. The pacing suffers when you remove three week-long breaks (and four "starts" of episodes).

If you have never seen the show Vikings, you should give it a looksy. It is on the History Channel. It definitely has a GoT vibe for sure. Very good television.

It will quench your thirst for blood.

twocoach wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 10:52 am

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 10:35 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 9:50 am
No matter how many episodes they did, people would complain that they needed more.

This is true, but the perfect doesn't need to be the enemy of the good. Also, the choice to do just 13 after Season 6 was entirely that - a choice. There was no need to abandon the ten-episode-season format.

This season was less than 2 episodes shorter than a standard 10 episode season length due to the nearly 80 minute episode length of half the season.

There was no way for them to land this jumbo jet without complaints.

More like 3.

There was at least 15 minutes of Arya in peril and in a staring contest with a horse while Kings Landing was being destroyed and another 30 minutes of heros in peril in the battle of winterfell that should have been on the cutting room floor.

Actually, that's something that makes it worse. In a season with too much material to fit in 6 episodes, there sure were a lot of scenes of Tyrion pushing in chairs and jokes about democracy that added nothing.

I don't think the viewers would be as up in arms as they are if there wasn't some legitimate issue.
It's a tough ask.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 10:54 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 10:52 am

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 10:35 am

This is true, but the perfect doesn't need to be the enemy of the good. Also, the choice to do just 13 after Season 6 was entirely that - a choice. There was no need to abandon the ten-episode-season format.

This season was less than 2 episodes shorter than a standard 10 episode season length due to the nearly 80 minute episode length of half the season.

There was no way for them to land this jumbo jet without complaints.

Eh, you don't get minute-for-minute credit for the extra time in a serialized show. The pacing suffers when you remove three week-long breaks (and four "starts" of episodes).

Good grief.

PhDhawk wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 11:14 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 10:52 am

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 10:35 am

This is true, but the perfect doesn't need to be the enemy of the good. Also, the choice to do just 13 after Season 6 was entirely that - a choice. There was no need to abandon the ten-episode-season format.

This season was less than 2 episodes shorter than a standard 10 episode season length due to the nearly 80 minute episode length of half the season.

There was no way for them to land this jumbo jet without complaints.

More like 3.

There was at least 15 minutes of Arya in peril and in a staring contest with a horse while Kings Landing was being destroyed and another 30 minutes of heros in peril in the battle of winterfell that should have been on the cutting room floor.

Actually, that's something that makes it worse. In a season with too much material to fit in 6 episodes, there sure were a lot of scenes of Tyrion pushing in chairs and jokes about democracy that added nothing.

Every season has been filled with random narratives that were given too much time, dumb jokes to attempt to make a character more likeable and slow mo shots of castles, fields, trees and other time fillers. They were all just years ago so we forget about them.

After 70+ episodes of blood and death and backstabbing and treachery, I thought the little bit of levity at the end was perfect.

Not sure that last episode could have been better. It was almost perfect.

twocoach wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 12:34 pm

PhDhawk wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 11:14 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Wed May 22, 2019 10:52 am

This season was less than 2 episodes shorter than a standard 10 episode season length due to the nearly 80 minute episode length of half the season.

There was no way for them to land this jumbo jet without complaints.

More like 3.

There was at least 15 minutes of Arya in peril and in a staring contest with a horse while Kings Landing was being destroyed and another 30 minutes of heros in peril in the battle of winterfell that should have been on the cutting room floor.

Actually, that's something that makes it worse. In a season with too much material to fit in 6 episodes, there sure were a lot of scenes of Tyrion pushing in chairs and jokes about democracy that added nothing.

Every season has been filled with random narratives that were given too much time, dumb jokes to attempt to make a character more likeable and slow mo shots of castles, fields, trees and other time fillers. They were all just years ago so we forget about them.

Nah.

I re-watched the series in the weeks leading up to this season, the scale of it was much much greater in this season.

And...I actually like the effect of some of the slow motion stuff. They did it in the battle of the bastards with much greater impact...because Jon Snow nearly getting crushed to death lasted 5 minutes instead of 15.

And, again, you're really missing the point...they cut episodes when they needed them. If you are vacuuming your car at the car wash, and you put in your last 4 quarters, it runs for five minutes and you don't quite finish the job, it sucks, but no big deal, good enough...but if the car wash suddenly changes the vacuum to 3 minutes, you're gonna be a lot further away from being done, and it's more upsetting, because you couldn't get the job done in 5, how in the world would you think you can get it done in 3? Now the 15 seconds you wasted freeing up the straw wrapper that clogged the vacuum nozzle is a much bigger waste of time than it was before.

To tag onto your awful analogy, my point is that they were trying to vacuum out a car that was returning from 4 college males living at the beach to surf and party all summer. Three minutes, five minutes, twenty minutes of vacuuming, they were never going to get that car cleaned to where someone wouldn't still find sand after inspecting it. People complain about everything; it seems to be what we do in today's era.

There's no perfect way to replace a leader/ruler. Not in today's America and not in Westeros. All the choices have something that sucks about them. I was glad to see GoT not attempt to become Gotham, where the good guys comically always end up winning.