Kansas Crimson

twocoach wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 10:30 am

HouseDivided wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 9:53 am
I don't disagree with any of that. The difference is, you are choosing when, what, how, and how much of that is transferred from you to someone else. My objection is when the government confiscates it from me under the assumption that I can't be trusted to do it on my own.

What individuals do on their own simply isn't enough. Put an extra $1,000 in a responsible people's hands and they are much more likely to invest that $1,000 in to themselves than give it to others. Put $1,000 into the hands of an irresponsible person and it's most likely not going anywhere productive to anyone.

Was there a spike in charitable givings when the tax breaks went out? Nope. There isn't an assumption that people can't be trusted to share more if they have more. There is a mountain of statistical evidence that proves it. No assumptions needed.

MICHHAWK wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 10:34 am I thought it was for MICHHAWK to decide what he did with his extra $1000.00. My bad.

twocoach wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 9:19 am

TraditionKU wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 8:53 am

HouseDivided wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 8:17 am Obamacare would be number one with "You didn't build that" as a close number two. The whole idea that government is the answer to our problems and that the common people have no right/ability to control their own destiny is offensive to me.

what’s offensive to me is that one of, if not the wealthiest nation on the planet doesn’t have the compassion or empathy to take care of their own...and this extends beyond basic healthcare to things like support for the impoverished and taking care of our veterans

I am discovering that some people simply are more concerned for their own well being more than they are the well being of others and simply dont care if someone else is negatively impacted by their advancement. Others are wired to have more empathy and are willing to sacrifice a bit of their own to help someone with much less.

Person A isn't bad. They just have a different combinarion of mental wiring, chemical makeup and life experiences. If empathy was scored from 0-100 you have to have people spread across that full range to succeed. You cant just have a society with everyone at 100 any more than a society full of zeroes.

It's the battling over the money that the 100s want that the zeros aren't willing to share that causes the friction. Healthcare, welfare, social programs. It's all basically the same argument.

The Right that likes their life wants to spend their money to safeguard that life and keep the stuff they have. The Left that likes their life wants to give more people a chance to experience that happiness.

IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 10:44 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 9:19 am

TraditionKU wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 8:53 am
what’s offensive to me is that one of, if not the wealthiest nation on the planet doesn’t have the compassion or empathy to take care of their own...and this extends beyond basic healthcare to things like support for the impoverished and taking care of our veterans

I am discovering that some people simply are more concerned for their own well being more than they are the well being of others and simply dont care if someone else is negatively impacted by their advancement. Others are wired to have more empathy and are willing to sacrifice a bit of their own to help someone with much less.

Person A isn't bad. They just have a different combinarion of mental wiring, chemical makeup and life experiences. If empathy was scored from 0-100 you have to have people spread across that full range to succeed. You cant just have a society with everyone at 100 any more than a society full of zeroes.

It's the battling over the money that the 100s want that the zeros aren't willing to share that causes the friction. Healthcare, welfare, social programs. It's all basically the same argument.

The Right that likes their life wants to spend their money to safeguard that life and keep the stuff they have. The Left that likes their life wants to give more people a chance to experience that happiness.

I agree with some of what you say in there, maybe even most...

But I've also found people are a whole lot more compassionate with other people's money than they are with their own money. It's easy to be generous with other people's money. That is true on the left and the right. Saying blanket statements like "the left wants to give more people happiness" is sort of foolish. The left wants to give people that happiness by redistributing the wealth of the rich people on the right and left...or at least that's how it seems. The "right" (typically) wants to give people that happiness by having more available jobs for those people, and more opportunities for those people, to bring happiness to themselves and their families.

twocoach wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:02 am

IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 10:44 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 9:19 am
I am discovering that some people simply are more concerned for their own well being more than they are the well being of others and simply dont care if someone else is negatively impacted by their advancement. Others are wired to have more empathy and are willing to sacrifice a bit of their own to help someone with much less.

Person A isn't bad. They just have a different combinarion of mental wiring, chemical makeup and life experiences. If empathy was scored from 0-100 you have to have people spread across that full range to succeed. You cant just have a society with everyone at 100 any more than a society full of zeroes.

It's the battling over the money that the 100s want that the zeros aren't willing to share that causes the friction. Healthcare, welfare, social programs. It's all basically the same argument.

The Right that likes their life wants to spend their money to safeguard that life and keep the stuff they have. The Left that likes their life wants to give more people a chance to experience that happiness.

I agree with some of what you say in there, maybe even most...

But I've also found people are a whole lot more compassionate with other people's money than they are with their own money. It's easy to be generous with other people's money. That is true on the left and the right. Saying blanket statements like "the left wants to give more people happiness" is sort of foolish. The left wants to give people that happiness by redistributing the wealth of the rich people on the right and left...or at least that's how it seems. The "right" (typically) wants to give people that happiness by having more available jobs for those people, and more opportunities for those people, to bring happiness to themselves and their families.

There are a zillion things we could do to better our society with the tens of billlions of dollars Trump wants to spen don some pointless wall under tbe guise of "safety" that will be maneuvered around within weeks. But that wall is really to buy votes and to pad the pockets of fat cat contractors/donors, not to keep anyone safe.

There are piles of great things we could do with the billions of dollars being paid to build private detention centers under the guise of "safety". But again, that is only happening to pass government money to fat cat contractors/donors, not to keep anyone safe.

Think of all the real GOOD we could do with that money.

twocoach wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:12 am You dont have to hit at 100% to do good. There are thousands of lives made better thanks to government assistance on a daily basis. There are improvements to be made but scrapping it is stupid.

twocoach wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:12 am You dont have to hit at 100% to do good. There are thousands of lives made better thanks to government assistance on a daily basis. There are improvements to be made but scrapping it is stupid.

zsn wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:01 am For the record, still no answer to the original question. No one can yet point to something that is an improvement (vast or not) over the past two years from the eight before.

jeepinjayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Nov 01, 2018 10:08 pm Please...tell me what was the single.....absolutely worst thing about the 8 years of Obama that makes these last 2 years seem like a vast improvement.

I am listening with an open mind.

jeepinjayhawk wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:47 am

zsn wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:01 am For the record, still no answer to the original question. No one can yet point to something that is an improvement (vast or not) over the past two years from the eight before.

I honestly didn't expect one.

dolomite wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:57 am

jeepinjayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Nov 01, 2018 10:08 pm Please...tell me what was the single.....absolutely worst thing about the 8 years of Obama that makes these last 2 years seem like a vast improvement.

I am listening with an open mind.

I think some of the worst things was Obama dividing the country during the Ferguson Mo, debacle, also the comments made during the Trayvon Martin mess("he could have been my son", should have let the jury decide and they did), and having the police stand down while letting the CVS store burn in Baltimore. Holder's "fast and furious" fuck up. Sending a plane load of cash to Iran. There are many more, sorry I could not list just one.

twocoach wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 12:00 pm

dolomite wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:57 am

jeepinjayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Nov 01, 2018 10:08 pm Please...tell me what was the single.....absolutely worst thing about the 8 years of Obama that makes these last 2 years seem like a vast improvement.

I am listening with an open mind.

I think some of the worst things was Obama dividing the country during the Ferguson Mo, debacle, also the comments made during the Trayvon Martin mess("he could have been my son", should have let the jury decide and they did), and having the police stand down while letting the CVS store burn in Baltimore. Holder's "fast and furious" fuck up. Sending a plane load of cash to Iran. There are many more, sorry I could not list just one.

None of those things would even make Trump's Top 20.

zsn wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:01 am For the record, still no answer to the original question. No one can yet point to something that is an improvement (vast or not) over the past two years from the eight before.

dolomite wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:57 am

jeepinjayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Nov 01, 2018 10:08 pm Please...tell me what was the single.....absolutely worst thing about the 8 years of Obama that makes these last 2 years seem like a vast improvement.

I am listening with an open mind.

I think some of the worst things was Obama dividing the country during the Ferguson Mo, debacle, also the comments made during the Trayvon Martin mess("he could have been my son", should have let the jury decide and they did), and having the police stand down while letting the CVS store burn in Baltimore. Holder's "fast and furious" fuck up. Sending a plane load of cash to Iran. There are many more, sorry I could not list just one.

HouseDivided wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:59 am

jeepinjayhawk wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:47 am

zsn wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:01 am For the record, still no answer to the original question. No one can yet point to something that is an improvement (vast or not) over the past two years from the eight before.

I honestly didn't expect one.

Having somebody who acknowledges that Obamacare is a cluster hump and is pledging to do something about is versus insisting that it is working just fine and that any objections to it are just indicative of selfishness, is a HUGE improvement. I thought that was implied.

IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:40 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:12 am You dont have to hit at 100% to do good. There are thousands of lives made better thanks to government assistance on a daily basis. There are improvements to be made but scrapping it is stupid.

I agree...the problem is, and my state knows this well, is that government is (often times) wasteful, corrupt, and inefficient...too many over paid state and federal government workers.

Less government equals better government imo.