Kansas Crimson

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 10:40 am**

I have a hard time believing that a guy that valued winning as much as he did risking the opportunity to lose a Finals against a really good Jazz team. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if he was in Vegas the night before but him drinking enough to get hungover I'm not sure if I buy that.

The mob, gambling debt stuff and then his fathers death was used by the press to sell print. Mike was the biggest story in sports and entertainment so anything with his name was going generate interest. There are some rather interesting oddities in Mr. Jordan's case - i.e. his family not reporting him missing until 21 days, his body being cremated as a 'John Doe' before the family could even ID the body but in reality, if you think about it his father was in a remote stretch of North Carolina in a fire red Lexus SC400. If that doesn't scream robbery opportunity I don't know what does.

And yes, I am a Jordan fan but I don't buy for a second that Jordan was forced to 'retire' and it was a suspension. That might be one of the dumbest sports conspiracy theories I have ever heard.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 10:44 am**

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:35 am Also, I can't believe how many locker room cigars that guy would have. Of course, he mentions the 80's Bulls were having beers and cigs at halftime.

He may have averaged 40 a season with today's health regimen.

I think it's also plausible to say he'd still do whatever the hell he wanted regards to cigars and whatnot. He's that damn stubborn.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 10:49 am**

NewtonHawk11 wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:44 am
CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:35 am Also, I can't believe how many locker room cigars that guy would have. Of course, he mentions the 80's Bulls were having beers and cigs at halftime.

He may have averaged 40 a season with today's health regimen.
I think it's also plausible to say he'd still do whatever the hell he wanted regards to cigars and whatnot. He's that damn stubborn.

Oh for sure. It's a what-if. It sure seems like his trainer thought he was ahead of the rest of the pack when it came to building his body for the grind. Kind of like Tiger Woods embracing that before others did. I just wonder how much more physically gifted he could have been without having to overcome 500+ cigars/year.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 10:56 am**

holidaysmore wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:40 am I have a hard time believing that a guy that valued winning as much as he did risking the opportunity to lose a Finals against a really good Jazz team. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if he was in Vegas the night before but him drinking enough to get hungover I'm not sure if I buy that.

The mob, gambling debt stuff and then his fathers death was used by the press to sell print. Mike was the biggest story in sports and entertainment so anything with his name was going generate interest. There are some rather interesting oddities in Mr. Jordan's case - i.e. his family not reporting him missing until 21 days, his body being cremated as a 'John Doe' before the family could even ID the body but in reality, if you think about it his father was in a remote stretch of North Carolina in a fire red Lexus SC400. If that doesn't scream robbery opportunity I don't know what does.

And yes, I am a Jordan fan but I don't buy for a second that Jordan was forced to 'retire' and it was a suspension. That might be one of the dumbest sports conspiracy theories I have ever heard.

I dunno.

If he really valued winning so much, what was he doing in Vegas either way? Save the effort for training and get a good night’s rest. His competitiveness spilled over into gambling too, not just hoops.

As for me personally, I can’t think of any good reason to wait 3 weeks before reporting a missing loved one.

And one could just as easily argue that being in a remote middle of nowhere in the middle of the night makes it less likely to be robbed, not more.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 11:19 am**

Same thing MJ was doing in Atlantic City, with his father none the less after going down 0-2 against the Knicks in the Eastern Conference Finals. MJ was notorious for not sleeping, usually playing cards getting a few hours, if that of sleep and then waking up the next morning and dominating. MJ was just built different than everyone else. He is a once in a lifetime guy.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 11:31 am**

LeBron would get annihilated if he did the vegas ir atlantic city thing.

And he'd be crucified if he took 18 months off for being "tired"

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 11:42 am**

PhDhawk wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 11:31 am LeBron would get annihilated if he did the vegas ir atlantic city thing.

And he'd be crucified if he took 18 months off for being "tired"

So did MJ. The press and the media killed him for the Atlantic City trip.

Maybe he would, maybe he wouldn't. IMO that is to much of a blanket statement without giving any further context.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 11:46 am**

holidaysmore wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 11:42 am
PhDhawk wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 11:31 am LeBron would get annihilated if he did the vegas ir atlantic city thing.

And he'd be crucified if he took 18 months off for being "tired"
So did MJ. The press and the media killed him for the Atlantic City trip.

Maybe he would, maybe he wouldn't. IMO that is to much of a blanket statement without giving any further context.

I don't think I'm going out on a limb saying that mj was often protected by the media and lebron hasn't been.

And for sure public perception of the two is different.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 12:24 pm**

Maybe early on MJ was ‘protected’ by the media but that same media raked him across the coals about how a scorer couldn’t win a championship, then Jordan Rules came out, then his gambling, then it was his lack of social involvement in the black community and the one that certainly stung the most was that he was some how responsible for the death of his father.

I’m just not sure if I can buy that the media protected Jordan. If it wasn’t for Jordan half of those writers wouldn’t even have jobs.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 12:41 pm**

Responses like that pretty much confirm to me that Jordan is more protected, probably moreso than any athlete I'm aware of.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 12:46 pm**

ousdahl wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 10:24 am Okay, universal is strong.

More widely agreed upon?

And given MJ’s well-known gambling issues, I just dunno if you can so quickly conclude that had nothing to do with anything.

What’s next - that for the flu game, a known competitive gambler, who was allegedly seen in Vegas late the night before, couldn’t possibly have just been hungover, and really did get the flu in the middle of June?

Supposedly he didn't have the flu. He had food poisoning. I find it hard to believe MJ played over 1000 "meaningless" games and never showed signs of a hangover but in the NBA Finals - he was in that bad of shape. I believe the food poisoning claim over the Jalen Rose claim.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 1:06 pm**

PhDhawk wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 12:41 pm Responses like that pretty much confirm to me that Jordan is more protected, probably moreso than any athlete I'm aware of.

I must be misunderstanding what your definition of 'protecting' is.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 1:36 pm**

PhDhawk wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 11:46 am
holidaysmore wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 11:42 am
PhDhawk wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 11:31 am LeBron would get annihilated if he did the vegas ir atlantic city thing.

And he'd be crucified if he took 18 months off for being "tired"
So did MJ. The press and the media killed him for the Atlantic City trip.

Maybe he would, maybe he wouldn't. IMO that is to much of a blanket statement without giving any further context.
I don't think I'm going out on a limb saying that mj was often protected by the media and lebron hasn't been.

And for sure public perception of the two is different.

Lol, this guy is a total fucking clown

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 2:06 pm**

Cascadia wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 1:36 pm
PhDhawk wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 11:46 am
holidaysmore wrote: ↑Tue May 12, 2020 11:42 am

So did MJ. The press and the media killed him for the Atlantic City trip.

Maybe he would, maybe he wouldn't. IMO that is to much of a blanket statement without giving any further context.
I don't think I'm going out on a limb saying that mj was often protected by the media and lebron hasn't been.

And for sure public perception of the two is different.
Lol, this guy is a total fucking clown

Holidaysmore, this is what I meant.

Posted: **Tue May 12, 2020 9:34 pm**

Posted: **Wed May 13, 2020 5:35 am**

there's always chatter about how lebron wouldn't have survived as well in the 80s with the physical play, but its interesting to watch the last dance and see Jordan saying things like "its the 90s" to magic, and how magic said "don't get to close to MJ cuz its a foul". Sounds like the nba adjusted how physical they wanted the game to be to cater to MJ a bit. So I think the whole lebron couldn't take the physicality of the 80s thing is a bit overblown, but thats just my opinion. The documentary has really helped squash some of the knocks on lebron imo. Everyone always points to the 6-0 finals record, but ignores all the years they couldn't get by the pistons, but wants to punish lebron excessively for losing to Golden State which is 1 of the top teams ever assembled.

Posted: **Wed May 13, 2020 9:05 am**

You pick one person to win you a title, who are you taking? I take Michael every single time.

If i put together the best functional 5 player team and Im not sure Lebrons on it. Theres a lot of options but i think you go something like

Magic
Michael
Larry
Duncan
Wilt or Shaq

Posted: **Wed May 13, 2020 9:58 am**

The end of the Bad Boys era ended the wide scale physicality of the league because the NBA realized that people enjoyed watching the Showtime Lakers and high flyers like MJ more than they did the physical stuff. That being said the the hand check rule was still around until 2004 and once that was removed that completely changed the game.

Lebron is one of the players that his game would fit in any era. He is one of the top 5 greatest players of all time. Other than maybe Magic and Oscar we have never seen a player as versatile. To try and compare the two is next to impossible and both sides are so dug in you will never find a middle ground. IMO Lebron compares more to Magic then he does anyone else - size, skill set, and leadership style.

Posted: **Wed May 13, 2020 10:48 am**

Give me:

Steph ( sorry Magic - Steph has solid handles and vision and is one of, if not the best, shooter of all time, and LeBron can fill your role too )
MJ ( duh )
LeBron ( can defend positions 1-4, respectable 3 point %, can run point )
Durant ( when he wants to be, is a good defender, great shooter )
Wilt

Posted: **Wed May 13, 2020 10:51 am**

LeBron could handle the physicality of any era.
He is built like no other player in history - combine that with his skill - he has to be on any starting 5.
( here come the 'LeBron is such a whiner' comments )

Kansas Crimson

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