Kansas Crimson

I didn't see the game, but I don't think you can ever criticize putting the ball in your dude's hands.

I think we're seeing a shift away from conventional football end-of-game management.


And, perhaps, maybe I am overly spooked by putting the game on FG kickers.

Reid is a tad bit too reliant on kickers at the end of the game. Has done it the last few years with Butker. Seemingly would rather be conservative and go for a 50 yarder compared to going for a TD.

NewtonHawk11 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:33 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:25 am

ousdahl wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:09 am They were in field goal range with a minute left.

A run play to burn clock and also maybe get a couple more yards usually isn’t high risk, but go figure it’s the Cajun dood’s first fumble ever

Yep. If they leave it in Mahomes hands and he gets sacked or has a(nother) turnover of his own then it is "why didn't the Chiefs just hand it to their 1st round draft pick and then kick the FG?"

Hindsight fandom.

It was the right call. The Baltimore defender just made an elite play.

Don't play for a FG. You gained 40 yards in 3 plays, then that.

Easy thing to say from a keyboard the next morning with results in hand.

NewtonHawk11 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:39 am Reid is a tad bit too reliant on kickers at the end of the game. Has done it the last few years with Butker. Seemingly would rather be conservative and go for a 50 yarder compared to going for a TD.

Because the odds of hitting that FG are higher than driving for a TD.

Man, people are going loony over a 1 point loss in Week 2 of the regular season.

I said it in real time too. Just not on here because I'm hardly on here during a game. I go to twitter instead.

Especially after being up 11 WITH the ball you go UGLY pick, Baltimore score, punt, Baltimore score, Fumble, then end of game. Ugly ending.

But yet on that final drive, it wasn't ugly until the fumble. You're worst play was Kelce on a wide open 7 yard pass. Baltimore knew they were running with their loaded box and KC still did it.

But the ball in your best players hands, like Baltimore did with Lamar, and let them cook.

twocoach wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:41 am

NewtonHawk11 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:39 am Reid is a tad bit too reliant on kickers at the end of the game. Has done it the last few years with Butker. Seemingly would rather be conservative and go for a 50 yarder compared to going for a TD.

Because the odds of hitting that FG are higher than driving for a TD.

Man, people are going loony over a 1 point loss in Week 2 of the regular season.

I'm far from loony like others in the internet world. I'm just a big proponent on giving your best player, who happens to be the best in the world at his job, the ball and let him do his thing. Mahomes was 24-31, wasn't sacked, threw a self-admittedly bad interception and threw to 9 different guys. But yet, on 2nd and 3, whenever the entire stadium knows it's a run, let's still run the ball. Doesn't make sense.

pdub wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:25 am

ousdahl wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:09 am They were in field goal range with a minute left.

A run play to burn clock and also maybe get a couple more yards usually isn’t high risk, but go figure it’s the Cajun dood’s first fumble ever

1:20 and 2nd and 3 from the 32.
That's a what, 49 yard field goal which is in Butker's range.
A run of even no gain might force Balty to use their last timeout - and you still have 3rd and 3 to figure out what to do. A run of 3 yards gets you a first down, complete control of the last moments, and comfortably in Butker's range.

49 is within his range, but that's by no means close enough to give up on trying to get closer, especially when a miss means you lose. Not when you've literally got the best quarterback ever to get you closer or to the end zone.

I'll use a basketball analogy since all you fools focus on that even in fucking July..

The year is 2017, Frank Mason is in the middle of his Naismith POY season, KU is down by 1. Self calls a play for a post play because that's the "high probability" play. Player misses a bunny, KU loses. KU fans are questioning why Self calls a play for Landen Lucas when Frank is your guy.

Patrick is your guy. Give him the ball and let him do his thing.

NewtonHawk11 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:54 am I'll use a basketball analogy since all you fools focus on that even in fucking July..

The year is 2017, Frank Mason is in the middle of his Naismith POY season, KU is down by 1. Self calls a play for a post play because that's the "high probability" play. Player misses a bunny, KU loses. KU fans are questioning why Self calls a play for Landen Lucas when Frank is your guy.

Patrick is your guy. Give him the ball and let him do his thing.

So weird--I was literally thinking of the exact analogy but rather counting on Landen (at like 70ish%) to get to the foul line at the end of the game instead of letting Frank pull up for jumper.


Fans can't second guess using your best weapon for what you pay him to do.

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:57 am

NewtonHawk11 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:54 am I'll use a basketball analogy since all you fools focus on that even in fucking July..

The year is 2017, Frank Mason is in the middle of his Naismith POY season, KU is down by 1. Self calls a play for a post play because that's the "high probability" play. Player misses a bunny, KU loses. KU fans are questioning why Self calls a play for Landen Lucas when Frank is your guy.

Patrick is your guy. Give him the ball and let him do his thing.

So weird--I was literally thinking of the exact analogy but rather counting on Landen (at like 70ish%) to get to the foul line at the end of the game instead of letting Frank pull up for jumper.


Fans can't second guess using your best weapon for what you pay him to do.

Especially not in Reid's offense, where it can have run-like risk/reward.

That was like the second game of the year.

Dunno if anyone realized Frank was a consensus POY yet.

Or rather, I recall a starting a thread that was named “don’t look now but…” Frank is doin POY things

And even added that “‘he hit that game winner against dook’ will resonate”

I think letting Patrick go for closer or to the end zone is the play. I understand the logic of running the ball to eat more clock and get a little closer. But I would go for a couple or few more pass plays to Kelce and such to make it a lot closer kick. Heck, who knows Kelce could break another long run and get a touchdown. Just think it plays out where the Chiefs when if you do like Newton says. Give the ball to your best guy and see what happens. CEH is not that guy, maybe in the future, maybe.

Reid went with the old school coaching manual. That is fine if CEH doesn't fumble but when you have a Ferrari what is the point of keeping it in the garage. Point being play for the win. The Ravens couldn't stop the pass so why go away from it when the only thing the Ravens could stop was the run. It seemed very predictable and 'Reid like' to run the ball.

It seems like EB and Reid are really trying to force the run especially on first down. It seemed more times than not that the Chiefs would then find themselves behind in the chains. I like the balance but I also don't like forcing something that isn't working.

holidaysmore wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 12:24 pm Reid went with the old school coaching manual. That is fine if CEH doesn't fumble but when you have a Ferrari what is the point of keeping it in the garage. Point being play for the win. The Ravens couldn't stop the pass so why go away from it when the only thing the Ravens could stop was the run. It seemed very predictable and 'Reid like' to run the ball.

It seems like EB and Reid are really trying to force the run especially on first down. It seemed more times than not that the Chiefs would then find themselves behind in the chains. I like the balance but I also don't like forcing something that isn't working.

I agree--CEH isn't a back with whom you can force the run either. That is what is so galling. You have bigger backs and wasted a slot on a Fullback. And you run into an angry stacked box. It was an incredible lapse in judgment.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:52 am

pdub wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:25 am

ousdahl wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:09 am They were in field goal range with a minute left.

A run play to burn clock and also maybe get a couple more yards usually isn’t high risk, but go figure it’s the Cajun dood’s first fumble ever

1:20 and 2nd and 3 from the 32.
That's a what, 49 yard field goal which is in Butker's range.
A run of even no gain might force Balty to use their last timeout - and you still have 3rd and 3 to figure out what to do. A run of 3 yards gets you a first down, complete control of the last moments, and comfortably in Butker's range.

49 is within his range, but that's by no means close enough to give up on trying to get closer, especially when a miss means you lose. Not when you've literally got the best quarterback ever to get you closer or to the end zone.

It was 2nd and 3.
They had 3 timeouts.
They were trying to get closer - while also forcing Balty to spend the timeout so they could be in 100% control of the game.

Just imagine if Mahomey threw another pick, or threw incompletions then the chiefs doinked a fg attempt

WhY DiDnT ThEy JuSt RuN iT!!!!!¡!

NewtonHawk11 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:54 am I'll use a basketball analogy since all you fools focus on that even in fucking July..

The year is 2017, Frank Mason is in the middle of his Naismith POY season, KU is down by 1. Self calls a play for a post play because that's the "high probability" play. Player misses a bunny, KU loses. KU fans are questioning why Self calls a play for Landen Lucas when Frank is your guy.

Patrick is your guy. Give him the ball and let him do his thing.

Not a good analogy though.
It was 2nd and 3 so there should, in most scenarios, have another play ( or more ) to work with.
And there is a secondary reason for running it - burning the Ravens last timeout - so that you can dictate how the game is finished and leave them with zero seconds to come back.

Butker has gone 18/20 from FG's 40-49 yards in the last two seasons.
So your analogy not only doesn't factor the fact that there was a minute 20 with several plays left in the game but also that your post play guy shoots 90% from the field.

The fault is not the play call, at all, by any means, it was absolutely the right thing to do.
The fault is CEH not securing the ball.

It's funny to me, thinking about that game just how efficient I thought the Chiefs were on offense and how little they had to show for it.
I thought Pringle, D-Rob, and Hardman all had there best games. Kelce was elite. They game planned Reek, which is fine. I thought they did a great job on the screens to Bell and even to Burton. Hell, Fortson even caught a ball for 11 yards. What killed them was penalties (that PI or holding on Robinson was a terrible call) and Humphrey missed a couple scoop blocks that blew up running plays on, you guessed it first down. 2nd and 15 is an entirely different play call compared to 2 and 4 or even 5.

I believe the Chiefs success on offense and how many weapons they have is there biggest hang up. They want to get everyone involved. They want to show new and innovate ways when in all realities they could have went four or five wide every single play and threw to McKinnon when Queen was on him. They could have throw hitch routes every single time to Kelce. To the naked eye it almost seems they overtly complicate something when they really don't have to.

ousdahl wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 12:43 pm Just imagine if Mahomey threw another pick, or threw incompletions then the chiefs doinked a fg attempt

WhY DiDnT ThEy JuSt RuN iT!!!!!¡!

Nah, I don’t think so. Chiefs fans are on a ride or die with Mahomes journey, understandably so.

And then, I think at some point, a Mahomes to Kelce route really is the Chiefs best and safest bet to move the ball.