Re: 2024
Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2023 12:24 pm
never heard of moms4liberty. maybe they are made up by the propaganda machine.
…and voters to groom. Certainly ONE strategy, when forced to confront the deep unpopularity of your platform, is to get to ‘em younger and younger.
If you were an "informed parent" you would know about your kid's orientation questions before the school counselor.JKLivin wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 11:41 am If my kid thinks he or she might be trans, I damn well better know about it, especially if some counselor I don't even know is calling them by a name different than the one I gave them and talking to them about transitioning their sex. That's not "far right" in my book, it's just being an informed parent.
No.japhy wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 12:50 pmIf you were an "informed parent" you would know about your kid's orientation questions before the school counselor.JKLivin wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 11:41 am If my kid thinks he or she might be trans, I damn well better know about it, especially if some counselor I don't even know is calling them by a name different than the one I gave them and talking to them about transitioning their sex. That's not "far right" in my book, it's just being an informed parent.
Define "functional," 'cause if it means proficiency in reading, writing, and mathematics, then it is not even close.
Which sort of gets at the heart of the issue, right? If a teenager comes to their teacher and says they’re afraid to talk to their parents about sexual orientation…the teacher should have an absolute obligation to tell the parents?japhy wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 12:50 pmIf you were an "informed parent" you would know about your kid's orientation questions before the school counselor.JKLivin wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 11:41 am If my kid thinks he or she might be trans, I damn well better know about it, especially if some counselor I don't even know is calling them by a name different than the one I gave them and talking to them about transitioning their sex. That's not "far right" in my book, it's just being an informed parent.
Kids are their own living entity and should not be required to tell their parents everything. If they want you to know about something, they will tell you. It is not your right to know everything about them. It is not in the Constitution as some unassailable right as a US citizen. They are not your property and you do not have domain over their every thought.JKLivin wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 11:41 am
Meh. I'd be curious about the definition of "far right". Is it really unreasonable not to want grade school kids to be taught about intersectionality, or even sexuality in general, without their parents' permission? I don't have a problem with schools wanting to address the issues, but I want the opportunity to opt my kid out if I so choose. I was teaching a grad seminar last week with a group of student interns in the school systems, and I was shocked at how much the schools hide from parents about the discussions counselors and teachers have with students about their sexuality. If my kid thinks he or she might be trans, I damn well better know about it, especially if some counselor I don't even know is calling them by a name different than the one I gave them and talking to them about transitioning their sex. That's not "far right" in my book, it's just being an informed parent.
Yes, there is. The answer is "no, we do not need to tell parents about your thoughts and feelings. We only need to tell them if you are being put in danger or being harmed/abused."jfish26 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 1:00 pmWhich sort of gets at the heart of the issue, right? If a teenager comes to their teacher and says they’re afraid to talk to their parents about sexual orientation…the teacher should have an absolute obligation to tell the parents?japhy wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 12:50 pmIf you were an "informed parent" you would know about your kid's orientation questions before the school counselor.JKLivin wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 11:41 am If my kid thinks he or she might be trans, I damn well better know about it, especially if some counselor I don't even know is calling them by a name different than the one I gave them and talking to them about transitioning their sex. That's not "far right" in my book, it's just being an informed parent.
There isn’t an easy answer here.
I think it’s more complicated than that. But, I also feel like (generally) the parents that kids are afraid of telling…are the parents whose existence supports your view.twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 1:20 pmYes, there is. The answer is "no, we do not need to tell parents about your thoughts and feelings. We only need to tell them if you are being put in danger or being harmed/abused."jfish26 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 1:00 pmWhich sort of gets at the heart of the issue, right? If a teenager comes to their teacher and says they’re afraid to talk to their parents about sexual orientation…the teacher should have an absolute obligation to tell the parents?
There isn’t an easy answer here.
Obviously everything is "more complicated" than a two line response on a message board. But in general, we do not need to tell parents about every conversation a kid has, even if they are about sensitive topics. Should a counselor require permission before beginning some sort of therapy or treatment? Yes, in my opinion all forms of treatment for your kids, be it for physical, mental or medical reasons, should be cleared through a parent prior to starting. But parents don't need to know EVERYTHING. They have no right to that.jfish26 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 1:28 pmI think it’s more complicated than that. But, I also feel like (generally) the parents that kids are afraid of telling…are the parents whose existence supports your view.twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 1:20 pmYes, there is. The answer is "no, we do not need to tell parents about your thoughts and feelings. We only need to tell them if you are being put in danger or being harmed/abused."jfish26 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 1:00 pm
Which sort of gets at the heart of the issue, right? If a teenager comes to their teacher and says they’re afraid to talk to their parents about sexual orientation…the teacher should have an absolute obligation to tell the parents?
There isn’t an easy answer here.
He was going to loose anyway, but now he plans to "tour the country"" and talk to people about what they want...
I much more agree than disagree. I also think, MICH’s reductive alliteration notwithstanding, one of the whole POINTS of school is for kids to transition (oops) from relying on their parents for everything, into a position of near-self-sufficiency. That very much INCLUDES learning how to, with help, become advocates for their own well-being.twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 1:36 pmObviously everything is "more complicated" than a two line response on a message board. But in general, we do not need to tell parents about every conversation a kid has, even if they are about sensitive topics. Should a counselor require permission before beginning some sort of therapy or treatment? Yes, in my opinion all forms of treatment for your kids, be it for physical, mental or medical reasons, should be cleared through a parent prior to starting. But parents don't need to know EVERYTHING. They have no right to that.
100% agree with that. It's critical to make your kids voice their own needs, thoughts and concerns. Too many kids have helicopter parents who speak for them and do everything for them and when they find themselves responsible for themselves they find they aren't up for the task. With how self-conscious kids are, having a safe space with some expectation of privacy is crucial.jfish26 wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 1:49 pmI much more agree than disagree. I also think, MICH’s reductive alliteration notwithstanding, one of the whole POINTS of school is for kids to transition (oops) from relying on their parents for everything, into a position of near-self-sufficiency. That very much INCLUDES learning how to, with help, become advocates for their own well-being.twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 1:36 pmObviously everything is "more complicated" than a two line response on a message board. But in general, we do not need to tell parents about every conversation a kid has, even if they are about sensitive topics. Should a counselor require permission before beginning some sort of therapy or treatment? Yes, in my opinion all forms of treatment for your kids, be it for physical, mental or medical reasons, should be cleared through a parent prior to starting. But parents don't need to know EVERYTHING. They have no right to that.
Confidentiality laws in Kansas state that a minor does not have a legal right to confidentiality from a legal guardian prior to age 16. They are similar in other states. I didn’t make the law.twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 1:18 pmKids are their own living entity and should not be required to tell their parents everything. If they want you to know about something, they will tell you. It is not your right to know everything about them. It is not in the Constitution as some unassailable right as a US citizen. They are not your property and you do not have domain over their every thought.JKLivin wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 11:41 am
Meh. I'd be curious about the definition of "far right". Is it really unreasonable not to want grade school kids to be taught about intersectionality, or even sexuality in general, without their parents' permission? I don't have a problem with schools wanting to address the issues, but I want the opportunity to opt my kid out if I so choose. I was teaching a grad seminar last week with a group of student interns in the school systems, and I was shocked at how much the schools hide from parents about the discussions counselors and teachers have with students about their sexuality. If my kid thinks he or she might be trans, I damn well better know about it, especially if some counselor I don't even know is calling them by a name different than the one I gave them and talking to them about transitioning their sex. That's not "far right" in my book, it's just being an informed parent.
Children need to have an outlet to discuss things outside of their relationship with their parents. Parents have total control over every facet of their existence and happiness. The basics of their lives are provided by their parents; food, water, shelter, their schooling, their activities, their access to friends, their hobbies, their interests. EVERYTHING. So I do not blame a child for not wanting to tell a parent something that they fear might not be received well as they may feel that it puts everything in their lives at risk. They have to have some other outlet for their issues where they feel they can speak freely about things without putting everything they hold dear at risk.
You're mixing concepts here.JKLivin wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 3:17 pmConfidentiality laws in Kansas state that a minor does not have a legal right to confidentiality from a legal guardian prior to age 16. They are similar in other states. I didn’t make the law.twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 1:18 pmKids are their own living entity and should not be required to tell their parents everything. If they want you to know about something, they will tell you. It is not your right to know everything about them. It is not in the Constitution as some unassailable right as a US citizen. They are not your property and you do not have domain over their every thought.JKLivin wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2023 11:41 am
Meh. I'd be curious about the definition of "far right". Is it really unreasonable not to want grade school kids to be taught about intersectionality, or even sexuality in general, without their parents' permission? I don't have a problem with schools wanting to address the issues, but I want the opportunity to opt my kid out if I so choose. I was teaching a grad seminar last week with a group of student interns in the school systems, and I was shocked at how much the schools hide from parents about the discussions counselors and teachers have with students about their sexuality. If my kid thinks he or she might be trans, I damn well better know about it, especially if some counselor I don't even know is calling them by a name different than the one I gave them and talking to them about transitioning their sex. That's not "far right" in my book, it's just being an informed parent.
Children need to have an outlet to discuss things outside of their relationship with their parents. Parents have total control over every facet of their existence and happiness. The basics of their lives are provided by their parents; food, water, shelter, their schooling, their activities, their access to friends, their hobbies, their interests. EVERYTHING. So I do not blame a child for not wanting to tell a parent something that they fear might not be received well as they may feel that it puts everything in their lives at risk. They have to have some other outlet for their issues where they feel they can speak freely about things without putting everything they hold dear at risk.
There are limits to your confidentiality, too, via Duty to Warn laws. Is that a violation of your Constitutional rights?