Kansas Crimson

I would think that the money would trump everything. At least that’s what I’m basing all of my optimism off of. At the end of the day you can always expect the masses to do whatever they gotta do to maximize their revenue even if it means looking the other way on corruption (which I personally think the NCAA has known about and has been doing for decades)

It sure looks like we are breaking the rules of the sport. I agree with the heart of the rules. I don’t like the organization that enforces them.

If we have a link to the payments to DeSousa, we should loose our Final Four banner.

columbusdjkc wrote: ↑Mon Oct 15, 2018 5:31 pm I would think that the money would trump everything. At least that’s what I’m basing all of my optimism off of. At the end of the day you can always expect the masses to do whatever they gotta do to maximize their revenue even if it means looking the other way on corruption (which I personally think the NCAA has known about and has been doing for decades)

I agree with you, generally, but this brings up whether the NCAA has enough foresight to think a few steps ahead on this (or whether it wants to cut off its nose to spite its face).

pdub wrote: ↑Mon Oct 15, 2018 5:32 pm It sure looks like we are breaking the rules of the sport. I agree with the heart of the rules. I don’t like the organization that enforces them.

If we have a link to the payments to DeSousa, we should loose our Final Four banner.

Well, we will never agree on the first thing. That's ok.

As to the second thing - it's easy enough to say that, but if you're being honest with yourself, how many of the last, say, eighty Final Four participants would keep their banners if this is the standard? I would guess far fewer than half, perhaps fewer than ten.

Can you imagine the outrage if this was Calipari or K caught up in this. People would be freaking out. It's hardly a blip on the radar right now it feels like...and maybe part of that is because so many people have known this goes on everywhere and nobody talks about it.

The NCAA needed to work harder to regulate and be fair in judgement. They failed and it’s out of control.

We look to have been caught.

what would cause investigations into the other shoe company’s goings on?

i forget how this all got started with adidas

pdub wrote: ↑Mon Oct 15, 2018 5:54 pm The NCAA needed to work harder to regulate and be fair in judgement. They failed and it’s out of control.

We look to have been caught.

You do realize this makes no sense: the maker and enforcer (and beneficiary) of the rules needed to work harder to regulate and be fair in judgments, they failed and it's out of control, and we deserve to be punished.

I’m not gathering a stake and tinder yet, but just saying hypothetically...
Can I sue Bill Self if he defrauded KU and I paid for a rule-following team to follow? If a coach knew about it, then it is the coach doing the defrauding rather than a shoe company.

TraditionKU wrote: ↑Mon Oct 15, 2018 6:02 pm what would cause investigations into the other shoe company’s goings on?

i forget how this all got started with adidas

We know the public story - they turned some small-time fixer and uncovered a pretty big operation. As for the real story, meaning the politics and agendas and true motivations...I am sure that will come out in time.

DrPepper wrote: ↑Mon Oct 15, 2018 6:08 pm I’m not gathering a stake and tinder yet, but just saying hypothetically...
Can I sue Bill Self if he defrauded KU and I paid for a rule-following team to follow? If a coach knew about it, then it is the coach doing the defrauding rather than a shoe company.

Your example is silly and stupid...and is a perfectly logical thing to suggest given the apparent (and seemingly unquestioned) ease with which breaking private rules can be criminalized into violations of federal law.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Mon Oct 15, 2018 6:07 pm

pdub wrote: ↑Mon Oct 15, 2018 5:54 pm The NCAA needed to work harder to regulate and be fair in judgement. They failed and it’s out of control.

We look to have been caught.

You do realize this makes no sense: the maker and enforcer (and beneficiary) of the rules needed to work harder to regulate and be fair in judgments, they failed and it's out of control, and we deserve to be punished.

We aren’t a victim.
We were just playing losely with the rules because we could.

If your kids were running around breaking curfew and you weren’t doing anything about it and then one night they showed up at 4 am, maybe there would be a time you’d have to say enough.

Otherwise why have rules?

( and you’ll say ‘exactly. Why have rules ‘ )

jfish26 wrote: ↑Mon Oct 15, 2018 6:10 pm

DrPepper wrote: ↑Mon Oct 15, 2018 6:08 pm I’m not gathering a stake and tinder yet, but just saying hypothetically...
Can I sue Bill Self if he defrauded KU and I paid for a rule-following team to follow? If a coach knew about it, then it is the coach doing the defrauding rather than a shoe company.

Your example is silly and stupid...and is a perfectly logical thing to suggest given the apparent (and seemingly unquestioned) ease with which breaking private rules can be criminalized into violations of federal law.

You are welcome

The shoe companies and the AAU programs are not reachable by the NCAA.

TraditionKU wrote: ↑Mon Oct 15, 2018 6:02 pm what would cause investigations into the other shoe company’s goings on?

i forget how this all got started with adidas

It started because some doofus crooked financial advisor decided to rip of a bunch of money from some of his pro athlete clients to finance some b-level movie productions and got caught so he sang like a canary about any crime he happened to catch wind of to lessen his punishment. That's how stupidly random this thing was.

Nike has 93% of the basketball shoe sales market share. Imagine how big the amount of behind the scenes money is flowing out of Nike. You don't get a 93% market share without a well oiled machine churning in the sewers.

DrPepper wrote: ↑Mon Oct 15, 2018 6:08 pm I’m not gathering a stake and tinder yet, but just saying hypothetically...
Can I sue Bill Self if he defrauded KU and I paid for a rule-following team to follow? If a coach knew about it, then it is the coach doing the defrauding rather than a shoe company.

I think I read on the back of my ticket stub "You get what you get and you don't throw a fit".

The purpose of the trial is to determine if Adidas defrauded KU and other Universities correct? Gassnola testified that Self did not know. So why is it necessary to dig any deeper when you heard it straight from the horses mouth?

pdub wrote: ↑Mon Oct 15, 2018 5:54 pm The NCAA needed to work harder to regulate and be fair in judgement. They failed and it’s out of control.

We look to have been caught.

Sounds like they have a lack of institutional control?

Seems like folks are looking at the nuances here an missing the big picture. There is proof Self was discussing recruits with Adidas folk and knowledgeable of the fact they were trying to influence recruits.

Forget what is actually ethically right/wrong - it doesn't matter. Whether or not the rules make sense doesn't matter. We're here because we're fans of the Kansas basketball program. It operates under the rules of the NCAA, like it or not. The NCAA doesn't need to abide by legal rules - it doesn't matter if you're guilty beyond a shadow of doubt, it just matters what the NCAA says.

Given what we now know, there is a decent chance that last year's final four will be vacated, but it goes way beyond that. We're talking post-season ban this year. Forget the "other teams are all doing it" talk - we're the ones that have been explicitly implicated.

I don't think any of this is ethically right - but man, that's what it's looking like is going to happen.

I always say that the great thing about being a college basketball fan is that the cold months when you don't want to leave the house are bearable because we have college basketball. This is going to make winter really, really suck.