Kansas Crimson

TraditionKU wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 12:15 pm

pdub wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 12:10 pm Well, i'm sure the 'if you aren't 100% with me then you're a racist" crowd will say something like, "figures or par for the course", but usually you get a ticket with a court date on it for a misdemeanor, so he knew he was charged with something, and from the information we have at the moment, he was charged with fleeing an officer with unlawful possession of a firearm. And he obviously tried evading officers again.

But the guy was shot to death.
So bad choices/bad results applies in an extremely misconstrued way.

the thing is, none of that needs said

yes, of course he shouldn’t have tried to run. but, is running worthy of a death sentence?

the crowd your referencing, of which i may be a part, wonders why you (and others) feel the need to offer up the reminder at all

In the micro sense, the warrant/alleged clerical error stuff is largely irrelevant.

In the macro, it adds to the question of what kind of police enforcement have we created and are we ok with it.

TraditionKU wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 12:15 pm

pdub wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 12:10 pm Well, i'm sure the 'if you aren't 100% with me then you're a racist" crowd will say something like, "figures or par for the course", but usually you get a ticket with a court date on it for a misdemeanor, so he knew he was charged with something, and from the information we have at the moment, he was charged with fleeing an officer with unlawful possession of a firearm. And he obviously tried evading officers again.

But the guy was shot to death.
So bad choices/bad results applies in an extremely misconstrued way.

the thing is, none of that needs said

yes, of course he shouldn’t have tried to run. but, is running worthy of a death sentence?

the crowd your referencing, of which i may be a part, wonders why you (and others) feel the need to offer up the reminder at all

Because people are allowed to speak to points even if you don't agree with them, no matter who they are, to have a discussion.

And no, clearly running isn't worthy of a death sentence.
I just said so in multiple posts.

she resigned

pdub wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 12:42 pm

TraditionKU wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 12:15 pm

pdub wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 12:10 pm Well, i'm sure the 'if you aren't 100% with me then you're a racist" crowd will say something like, "figures or par for the course", but usually you get a ticket with a court date on it for a misdemeanor, so he knew he was charged with something, and from the information we have at the moment, he was charged with fleeing an officer with unlawful possession of a firearm. And he obviously tried evading officers again.

But the guy was shot to death.
So bad choices/bad results applies in an extremely misconstrued way.

the thing is, none of that needs said

yes, of course he shouldn’t have tried to run. but, is running worthy of a death sentence?

the crowd your referencing, of which i may be a part, wonders why you (and others) feel the need to offer up the reminder at all

Because people are allowed to speak to points even if you don't agree with them, no matter who they are, to have a discussion.

And no, clearly running isn't worthy of a death sentence.
I just said so in multiple posts.

In order to be a fleeing felon, you have to have been convicted prior.

If an inmate escapes, for example, they are considered maximum security/high risk...regardless of custody level prior to escaping.

There should not be a death sentence warranted for someone who is most likely running away from at the very least a beat down.

He wasn't going to get beat down.

pdub wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 1:53 pm He wasn't going to get beat down.

And you are sure that it wasn't a concern of his?

Regardless of concern, you shouldn't wrestle out of a police officers grasp, ignore them when they are telling you to stop, and then try to speed away in a car.

Please don't make the mindless leap ( i'm not speaking specifically to you overlander ) that because I don't think you should do what was seen in the video that I support a police officer shooting someone to death.

pdub wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 1:59 pm Regardless of concern, you shouldn't allegedly wrestle out of a police officers grasp, ignore them when they are telling you to stop, and then try to speed away in a car.

Please don't make the mindless leap ( i'm not speaking specifically to you overlander ) that because I don't think you should do what was seen in the video that I support a police officer shooting someone to death.

Added the bold bit, cuz it matters. Sure we saw him try to run on video, but that’s only evidence at that point. Slap another warrant on him, go arrest him at home the next day. The point is, let the kid have his day in court.

Not that I’m trying to give Wright the benefit of the doubt, but do you think maybe he panicked precisely cuz he feared the kind of brutality that ultimately took his life, and that another cop is currently being tried for like 11 miles away?

Why are trained cops the ones who are given so much wiggle room to panic and overreact, and untrained civilians the ones who must keep their cool with a gun in their face?

Thought experiment: what if civilians were allowed to use a “feared for my life” defense against cops too?

Not allegedly.
It was on video.
Unless you think the body cam video was doctored by a CGI expert or cast with actors and restaged.

We are allowed to use common sense when determining things.
i.e. it's common sense that George Floyd was straight murdered - and we could tell very early on he was.

maaaaaybe he wouldn’t have felt compelled to run if he trusted that he would’ve been treated fairly while in custody

which speaks to the broader point fish and c&b were discussing

just the mere fact that black parents, moreso than any other race, have to have “the talk” with their kids about police interactions should speak volumes

pdub wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 3:15 pm Not allegedly.
It was on video.
Unless you think the body cam video was doctored by a CGI expert or cast with actors and restaged.

We are allowed to use common sense when determining things.
i.e. it's common sense that George Floyd was straight murdered - and we could tell very early on he was.

and yet, Chauvin is having his day in court because, legally speaking, he only allegedly murdered Floyd.

Whether Wright ran isn’t a legal conclusion until it’s decided in court, but he doesn’t get that day.

He had a warrant out for his arrest and it had involved evading an officer and possessing a firearm illegally.

I think the officers ( up until the lady screaming taser and then firing a firearm ) acted appropriately from what I have seen on the body cam. He was being searched as he was being arrested for that warrant.

The major issue in this case is that a police officer with 20 plus years under her belt AND was a training officer couldn't tell the difference between a taser and her firearm -- which is inexcusable and she should be charged with a crime.

ousdahl wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 3:23 pm

pdub wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 3:15 pm Not allegedly.
It was on video.
Unless you think the body cam video was doctored by a CGI expert or cast with actors and restaged.

We are allowed to use common sense when determining things.
i.e. it's common sense that George Floyd was straight murdered - and we could tell very early on he was.

and yet, Chauvin is having his day in court because, legally speaking, he only allegedly murdered Floyd.

Whether Wright ran isn’t a legal conclusion until it’s decided in court, but he doesn’t get that day.

I can't.

TraditionKU wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 1:01 pm she resigned

Shoulda been fired

From a societal standpoint, is it worse just to let people like that flee knowing you already have every piece of identifying evidence you need (identification was ran, license plate, last known address on warrant, etc.)?

It's probably a small percentage, but I feel like we've seen a lot of traffic stops escalate much too high. There is already precedent in not pursuing high speed chase when the underlying offense is non-violent.

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:02 pm From a societal standpoint, is it worse just to let people like that flee knowing you already have every piece of identifying evidence you need (identification was ran, license plate, last known address on warrant, etc.)?

It's probably a small percentage, but I feel like we've seen a lot of traffic stops escalate much too high. There is already precedent in not pursuing high speed chase when the underlying offense is non-violent.

Anyone who has ever worked retail has been trained not to go after the shoplifter.

That's a tough one.
I think it would prompt more evading because there would be less deterrent to do so.
And then would bring extra time/hours/money into tracking that person down when they had him/her stopped right there.

If they came to my door with the warrants for evading officers twice and the gun deal, could I just run again and they'd let me flee?

I do think as humans there should be some level of fear - but hopefully closer to respect - for disobeying the law at levels with the levels increasing the amount of fear for punishment.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:07 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:02 pm From a societal standpoint, is it worse just to let people like that flee knowing you already have every piece of identifying evidence you need (identification was ran, license plate, last known address on warrant, etc.)?

It's probably a small percentage, but I feel like we've seen a lot of traffic stops escalate much too high. There is already precedent in not pursuing high speed chase when the underlying offense is non-violent.

Anyone who has ever worked retail has been trained not to go after the shoplifter.

Yes. Although, I have worked a lot of retail and it would have taken something other than training ($$$$$) for me to care enough to go after someone stealing a bagel.

I chased someone who stole 2 cartons of Kools from the gas station I assistant managed.
He had a getaway car/driver but I still got in my car and got close enough to get his plates.