Kansas Crimson

chiknbut wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 9:56 am

TDub wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 9:53 am Perhaps a combination of social distancing and drug treatments would be even better? I dont know that chloroquine is the answer but that doesnt mean we should stop testing and trying to find a solution.

Who is saying we should stop testing and trying to find a solution?

Lets just hope the administration doesnt announce any progress.

seahawk wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 10:16 am

dolomite wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 10:05 am

seahawk wrote: ↑Mon Apr 06, 2020 4:28 pm Let us be honest, Trump is not hyping hydroxychloroquine because he thinks it works, he no longer has the mental faculties to make those kinds of projections. If he ever did.

Like all narcissists, Trump knows that he needs a scapegoat, an excuse and he's setting up a lack of embrace of hydroxychloroquine as his scapegoat when this all looks really bad during April.

Don’t think so.

So, maybe you're correct it wasn't about a scapegoat, just a usual Trump "Follow the money, for me."

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/donald-t ... d10a696280

lulz

Vega wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 9:21 am

TraditionKU wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 9:19 am some optimism

https://pnas.org/content/early/2020/04/02/2004168117#T1

I think your link may be broke.

i’ll try to fix, but...

small chinese study (10 severe patients) inoculated with antibodies from those that have recovered...positive results

Vega wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 9:21 am

TraditionKU wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 9:19 am some optimism

https://pnas.org/content/early/2020/04/02/2004168117#T1

I think your link may be broke.

fixed

Ah yeah, they've been putting plasma platelets into patients (tongue twister) here in the US as well to good results. A donor can assist three people per donation. IIRC, you can donate up to twice a week.

TDub wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 10:19 am

chiknbut wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 9:56 am

TDub wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 9:53 am Perhaps a combination of social distancing and drug treatments would be even better? I dont know that chloroquine is the answer but that doesnt mean we should stop testing and trying to find a solution.

Who is saying we should stop testing and trying to find a solution?

Lets just hope the administration doesnt announce any progress.

What?

TDubs is taking the HD position that opponents of Trump are hoping that chloroquine-type meds don't work, as those people are so desperate that Trump takes the fall, that any sort of progress is bad for the opponents' cause.

Vega wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 10:55 am TDubs is taking the HD position that opponents of Trump are hoping that chloroquine-type meds don't work, as those people are so desperate that Trump takes the fall, that any sort of progress is bad for the opponents' cause.

That's what I thought, but I wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt.

That's just idiotic.

Not necessarily, Im no Trump fan, but I do think it is frustrating that anything he or his people say causes theae types of responses. He said cholorquine has promise and people say hes killing people. Its all just silly. If he doesnt announce progress the exact same response will be elicited "trump knew there was a promising drug and he held back!? Hes killing people!"

TDub wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 11:04 am Not necessarily, Im no Trump fan, but I do think it is frustrating that anything he or his people say causes theae types of responses. He said cholorquine has promise and people say hes killing people. Its all just silly. If he doesnt announce progress the exact same response will be elicited "trump knew there was a promising drug and he held back!? Hes killing people!"

To the extent there's a near-universal negative response to anything Trump says on this subject...it's because he is nearly-always contrary to science and logic on this subject. And always - always - favorable to views and approaches that align with his self-interest.

TDub wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 11:04 am Not necessarily, Im no Trump fan, but I do think it is frustrating that anything he or his people say causes theae types of responses. He said cholorquine has promise and people say hes killing people. Its all just silly. If he doesnt announce progress the exact same response will be elicited "trump knew there was a promising drug and he held back!? Hes killing people!"

I think people who have a similar mindset as me want the follow: Actual expects talking about the true course of action, instead of Trump, a known snake oil salesperson, talking about specifics of unproven treatments. This is the type of shit that gets people killed.

I don't know if you've actually been following what Trump has been saying in the daily COVID-19 pressers, but he spends an inordinate amount of time pushing this unproven drug as a cure all. He says it's safe, and people should try it. No one, including the doctors, have corroborated that the drug is ready for widespread public use.

Surrounding that, he has demonstrable lies, such as everyone who wants a test can get one (false), testing has never been an issues (false), while spouting off political lies about governors who have been critical of his response. This is also after he downplayed the pandemic, gave extremely bad information early on. Especially now it's coming out he had the info in January that millions could die with inaction.

I don't want to be woe is me, but I've been on lockdown for a month, while ambulances are rushing to Columbia Presbyterian down the street from me, and hundreds are dying, with thousands in hospitals/convention centers/churches/tennis courts, and soon, buried in our parks because we have no place to put them. It's nerve-wrecking. I want the virus to magically disappear in heat. I want some random drug that we have a stockpile of to be the cure. But I also don't want it to be another Thalidomide because people aren't willing to social distance for a couple of months while we let our trained professionals deal with it in the normal due process.

The virus is unique, in the sense it's fairly deadly to where we need to lock down the country, but not deadly enough to throw every miracle cure at it to save our dying citizens.

I fucking hate Trump, as he is an anathema to nearly everything I stand for. However, I will give him all the credit in the world he just says the right things, and allows those who actually know what they are talking about just take the reigns, and shuts the fuck up. He's so starved for attention and credit, he can't just step aside, and say, "I'm smart, I'm well-educated, and been very successful in my life. However, this is a pandemic unlike anything we've ever seen. I'm putting X, Y and Z in charge of A, B and C, as they are more experienced in these sort of things, and you just let me know where to sign to get everything rolling."

731 dead in New York today.

Geezer wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 11:21 am 731 dead in New York today.

And I haven't even had lunch

I'm not sure why I've failed to mention it before, but doctors in hospitals all over have been prescribing hydroxychloroquine to some of their (especially sicker) patients, for months. For some time before the pandemic ramped up here, and now, the "Comments" section following COVID-19 articles on medical websites include detailed entries by physicians here relating the experiences of their friends and colleagues in China, and all over east Asia. Unsurprisingly, one of the things that was being tried and discussed constantly, was hydroxychloroquine, with and without azithromycin. So, this was already happening and there's no doubt it was going to happen in significant numbers in the US too, whether Dr. Trump had ever mentioned it, or not. The fact that he did mention it, continues mentioning it, promotes it so inappropriately, and even kept Dr. Anthony Fauci from answering a question about it the other day, is the real problem, and frankly, beyond absurd.

America’s major medical society specializing in the treatment of respiratory diseases has endorsed using hydroxychloroquine for seriously ill hospitalized coronavirus patients.

The American Thoracic Society issued guidelines Monday that suggest COVID-19 patients with pneumonia get doses of the anti-malaria drug.

“To prescribe hydroxychloroquine (or chloroquine) to hospitalized patients with COVID-19 pneumonia if all of the following apply: a) shared decision-making is possible, b) data can be collected for interim comparisons of patients who received hydroxychloroquine (or chloroquine) versus those who did not, c) the illness is sufficiently severe to warrant investigational therapy, and d) the drug is not in short supply,” the Thoracic Society said.

...The Thoracic Society said its guidelines are based on input from an international task force comprised of doctors from medical centers that are currently treating COVID-19 patients.

The medical group said evidence about the impact of hydroxychloroquine is “contradictory” but it is worth experimenting with during a public health crisis to treat very sick patients.

“We believe that in urgent situations like a pandemic, we can learn while treating by collecting real-world data,” said Dr. Kevin Wilson, chief of guidelines and documents at the American Thoracic Society...

“There has been anecdotal evidence that it is promising, that’s why we’re going ahead, doctors have to prescribe it. There are some people who have pre-existing conditions where it doesn’t work, or they’re taking medication that’s not consistent with this treatment, but anecdotally it’s been positive,” the governor said during a press briefing in Albany.

He said studies will ultimately determine the drug’s efficacy.

A top doctor with the city’s public hospital system agreed.

“We have multiple types of treatments, studies underway to see what’s working best. Many of our patients are receiving Hydroxychloroquine as part of those treatment regimens,” said Dr. Eric Wei, vice president and chief quality officer for NYC Health+Hospitals.

“I think it’s still too early to tell,” Wei said when asked of the results from use of the anti-malaria drug on coronavirus patients. “We’re still looking at the data, but right now we’re willing to try just about anything to save patients”.

TDub wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 11:04 am Not necessarily, Im no Trump fan, but I do think it is frustrating that anything he or his people say causes theae types of responses. He said cholorquine has promise and people say hes killing people. Its all just silly. If he doesnt announce progress the exact same response will be elicited "trump knew there was a promising drug and he held back!? Hes killing people!"

he said a whole lot more than “it has promise”

not gonna argue about it though

Feral wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 2:59 pm I'm not sure why I've failed to mention it before, but doctors in hospitals all over have been prescribing hydroxychloroquine to some of their (especially sicker) patients, for months. For some time before the pandemic ramped up here, and now, the "Comments" section following COVID-19 articles on medical websites include detailed entries by physicians here relating the experiences of their friends and colleagues in China, and all over east Asia. Unsurprisingly, one of the things that was being tried and discussed constantly, was hydroxychloroquine, with and without azithromycin. So, this was already happening and there's no doubt it was going to happen in significant numbers in the US too, whether Dr. Trump had ever mentioned it, or not. The fact that he did mention it, continues mentioning it, promotes it so inappropriately, and even kept Dr. Anthony Fauci from answering a question about it the other day, is the real problem, and frankly, beyond absurd.

America’s major medical society specializing in the treatment of respiratory diseases has endorsed using hydroxychloroquine for seriously ill hospitalized coronavirus patients.

The American Thoracic Society issued guidelines Monday that suggest COVID-19 patients with pneumonia get doses of the anti-malaria drug.

“To prescribe hydroxychloroquine (or chloroquine) to hospitalized patients with COVID-19 pneumonia if all of the following apply: a) shared decision-making is possible, b) data can be collected for interim comparisons of patients who received hydroxychloroquine (or chloroquine) versus those who did not, c) the illness is sufficiently severe to warrant investigational therapy, and d) the drug is not in short supply,” the Thoracic Society said.

...The Thoracic Society said its guidelines are based on input from an international task force comprised of doctors from medical centers that are currently treating COVID-19 patients.

The medical group said evidence about the impact of hydroxychloroquine is “contradictory” but it is worth experimenting with during a public health crisis to treat very sick patients.

“We believe that in urgent situations like a pandemic, we can learn while treating by collecting real-world data,” said Dr. Kevin Wilson, chief of guidelines and documents at the American Thoracic Society...

“There has been anecdotal evidence that it is promising, that’s why we’re going ahead, doctors have to prescribe it. There are some people who have pre-existing conditions where it doesn’t work, or they’re taking medication that’s not consistent with this treatment, but anecdotally it’s been positive,” the governor said during a press briefing in Albany.

He said studies will ultimately determine the drug’s efficacy.

A top doctor with the city’s public hospital system agreed.

“We have multiple types of treatments, studies underway to see what’s working best. Many of our patients are receiving Hydroxychloroquine as part of those treatment regimens,” said Dr. Eric Wei, vice president and chief quality officer for NYC Health+Hospitals.

“I think it’s still too early to tell,” Wei said when asked of the results from use of the anti-malaria drug on coronavirus patients. “We’re still looking at the data, but right now we’re willing to try just about anything to save patients”.

Damn you, Trump!

sdoyel wrote: ↑Tue Apr 07, 2020 8:51 pm

I thought The Babylon Bee was satire. Weird.

I honestly have no issue with people not being able to get tested when they are showing minimal/minor non-life threatening symptoms. I feel those who are in bad shape are the ones who need to be tested and who the tests should be saved for.
I'm just treating myself as if I have the virus and I'm ok with it.
What I am NOT ok with is when our President and his "task force" boast about testing and how "available" it is. They show these wonderful looking graphs and charts and are basically sugar coating horse shit and trying to show us Chateaubriand.
I am also NOT ok with the media providing "score cards". I can look on CNN right now and see Total Cases 399,929 and Deaths 12,911. Obviously it's sensationalism at it's grim finest.
Bedsides the assumed fact that 12,911 people have died from the virus in this country, my biggest issue is those numbers are extremely misleading. I very well may and probably do have the virus. Am I being counted in the 399,929? Of course not and neither are a shit load of other people who probably if not definitely do have the virus. I feel it should say CONFIRMED Cases (by the CDC?). As far as Deaths, of course some/many/(most?) people who have died had underlying conditions but as I have told others - having the virus most likely was the contributing factor to their death - so I have less of a problem with the Death/s "score" - despite my strong feeling that it's somewhat if not completely wrong.

Good news: My Sister N Law has been cleared by the CDC to resume normal activites.

Bad news: One of my best friends at work's wife lost her father to the virus in Ecuador.