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Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:57 am
by Deleted User 89
BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:51 am
Arthur was a lotto pick. Doubt he needed/wanted to come back. Same with Aldrich. Sherron and Tyshawn make sense. Chalmers was projected lotto a lot of places so hard to say and he had a good NBA career so i think he made the right choice.
not trying to talk shit, but i really think you undervalue the experience of being a student at KU...particularly one that’s on the hoops team
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:58 am
by pdub
TraditionKU wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:57 am
BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:51 am
Arthur was a lotto pick. Doubt he needed/wanted to come back. Same with Aldrich. Sherron and Tyshawn make sense. Chalmers was projected lotto a lot of places so hard to say and he had a good NBA career so i think he made the right choice.
not trying to talk shit, but i really think you undervalue the experience of being a student at KU...particularly one that’s on the hoops team
This.
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:01 am
by Deleted User 863
jfish26 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:55 am
BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:51 am
Arthur was a lotto pick. Doubt he needed/wanted to come back. Same with Aldrich. Sherron and Tyshawn make sense. Chalmers was projected lotto a lot of places so hard to say and he had a good NBA career so i think he made the right choice.
Didn't Sherron and Tyshawn both stay four?
I'm not suggesting NIL money will ever be worth turning down first round money (so good on ya, Cole, Shady, Julian, etc.).
It's guys in Chalmers' shoes. And Och's.
For sherron and tyshawn i meant their junior year decisions.
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:04 am
by ousdahl
Trying to decide the context of that word undervalued…
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:05 am
by pdub
In this case, the context is the appreciation of something for elements/reasons other than money.
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:07 am
by PhDhawk
pdub wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:05 am
In this case, the context is the appreciation of something for elements/reasons
other than money.
Nothing else matters.
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:10 am
by Mjl
BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:51 am
Arthur was a lotto pick. Doubt he needed/wanted to come back. Same with Aldrich. Sherron and Tyshawn make sense.
Chalmers was projected lotto a lot of places so hard to say and he had a good NBA career so i think he made the right choice.
You make a lot of shit up and state it as fact.
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:11 am
by ousdahl
I wish we had a society and economy and a life for which money didn’t matter so damn much.
But this is Merica.
The funny thing is, money doesn’t actually exist, and really only has a value of what value we choose to give it. And the value we choose is, the most importantest thing ever.
Sigh.
You guys wanna go live on a hippie commune with me?
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:16 am
by Deleted User 863
TraditionKU wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:57 am
BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:51 am
Arthur was a lotto pick. Doubt he needed/wanted to come back. Same with Aldrich. Sherron and Tyshawn make sense. Chalmers was projected lotto a lot of places so hard to say and he had a good NBA career so i think he made the right choice.
not trying to talk shit, but i really think you undervalue the experience of being a student at KU...particularly one that’s on the hoops team
I don't undervalue it at all. I just don't know how to value it for each individual player since it is totally subjective to that player. The guys who want to stay 4 years stay 4 years regardless of the money. Those Florida teams come to mind. UNC as well.
I know i didn't go to Kansas so you assume i know nothing of the culture, and i probably won't be able to change that, which is fine....but i have been attending Kansas games since i was little (maybe 4 or 5), have been to probably 75+ games in AFH, and have spent handfuls of weekends when i was in college partying in Lawrence after driving in for weekend games....so i am well aware they're (basketball players) treated like movie stars/rock stars/whatever you want to call it. That's not necessarily all that unique to Kansas (although i agree it is greater at Kansas than 99% of places). My wife went to Ole Miss and it's similar with their football team. The elite athletes at elite programs for given sport are treated similar....and so are NBA players.
The culture about Kansas/Lawrence that i find most appealing is not reserved simply for athletes. It is the small town vibe / family atmosphere and Mass St that really differentiate Kansas from a lot of other schools i have spent time at....ole miss has some of that feel with the oxford square, but i obviously don't love Ole Miss so i am a bit biased towards Lawrence.
...and let's be real, there is a reason so many former players spend parts of summers in Lawrence. That experience doesn't end when you turn pro at a sport.
Sorry if it seems i undervalue the "student" experience at KU for our players when in the context of making decisions on turning pro. It isn't intentional, it is just hard to account for meaningfully.
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:17 am
by Deleted User 863
Mjl wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:10 am
BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:51 am
Arthur was a lotto pick. Doubt he needed/wanted to come back. Same with Aldrich. Sherron and Tyshawn make sense.
Chalmers was projected lotto a lot of places so hard to say and he had a good NBA career so i think he made the right choice.
You make a lot of shit up and state it as fact.
You don't remember Chalmers being protected lotto?
Iirc espn had him like 13th. Almost everywhere that i remember had him top 20.
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:19 am
by ousdahl
When was the last time a college roster with multiple pro-potential players stuck around for 3-4+ years?
Relatively speaking, those Florida and UNC times were a long ass time ago.
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:24 am
by Deleted User 89
BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:16 am
TraditionKU wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:57 am
BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:51 am
Arthur was a lotto pick. Doubt he needed/wanted to come back. Same with Aldrich. Sherron and Tyshawn make sense. Chalmers was projected lotto a lot of places so hard to say and he had a good NBA career so i think he made the right choice.
not trying to talk shit, but i really think you undervalue the experience of being a student at KU...particularly one that’s on the hoops team
I don't undervalue it at all. I just don't know how to value it for each individual player since it is totally subjective to that player. The guys who want to stay 4 years stay 4 years regardless of the money. Those Florida teams come to mind. UNC as well.
I know i didn't go to Kansas so you assume i know nothing of the culture, and i probably won't be able to change that, which is fine....but i have been attending Kansas games since i was little (maybe 4 or 5), have been to probably 75+ games in AFH, and have spent handfuls of weekends when i was in college partying in Lawrence after driving in for weekend games....so i am well aware they're (basketball players) treated like movie stars/rock stars/whatever you want to call it. That's not necessarily all that unique to Kansas (although i agree it is greater at Kansas than 99% of places). My wife went to Ole Miss and it's similar with their football team. The elite athletes at elite programs for given sport are treated similar....and so are NBA players.
The culture about Kansas/Lawrence that i find most appealing is not reserved simply for athletes. It is the small town vibe / family atmosphere and Mass St that really differentiate Kansas from a lot of other schools i have spent time at....ole miss has some of that feel with the oxford square, but i obviously don't love Ole Miss so i am a bit biased towards Lawrence.
...and let's be real, there is a reason so many former players spend parts of summers in Lawrence. That experience doesn't end when you turn pro at a sport.
Sorry if it seems i undervalue the "student" experience at KU for our players when in the context of making decisions on turning pro. It isn't intentional, it is just hard to account for meaningfully.
i lived in Lawrence nearly 20 years, with nearly half that time spent as undergrad or grad student...please don’t preach to me from the place of someone that’s attended a few games
obviously, i’m not the only one that has gotten the impression from your posts that you undervalue the experience
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:26 am
by Deleted User 863
TraditionKU wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:24 am
BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:16 am
TraditionKU wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:57 am
not trying to talk shit, but i really think you undervalue the experience of being a student at KU...particularly one that’s on the hoops team
I don't undervalue it at all. I just don't know how to value it for each individual player since it is totally subjective to that player. The guys who want to stay 4 years stay 4 years regardless of the money. Those Florida teams come to mind. UNC as well.
I know i didn't go to Kansas so you assume i know nothing of the culture, and i probably won't be able to change that, which is fine....but i have been attending Kansas games since i was little (maybe 4 or 5), have been to probably 75+ games in AFH, and have spent handfuls of weekends when i was in college partying in Lawrence after driving in for weekend games....so i am well aware they're (basketball players) treated like movie stars/rock stars/whatever you want to call it. That's not necessarily all that unique to Kansas (although i agree it is greater at Kansas than 99% of places). My wife went to Ole Miss and it's similar with their football team. The elite athletes at elite programs for given sport are treated similar....and so are NBA players.
The culture about Kansas/Lawrence that i find most appealing is not reserved simply for athletes. It is the small town vibe / family atmosphere and Mass St that really differentiate Kansas from a lot of other schools i have spent time at....ole miss has some of that feel with the oxford square, but i obviously don't love Ole Miss so i am a bit biased towards Lawrence.
...and let's be real, there is a reason so many former players spend parts of summers in Lawrence. That experience doesn't end when you turn pro at a sport.
Sorry if it seems i undervalue the "student" experience at KU for our players when in the context of making decisions on turning pro. It isn't intentional, it is just hard to account for meaningfully.
i lived in Lawrence nearly 20 years, with nearly half that time spent as undergrad or grad student...please don’t preach to me from the place of someone that’s attended a few games
obviously, i’m not the only one that has gotten the impression from your posts that you undervalue the experience
Jesus, nobody was preaching at you.
You are the most Lawrence person ever. Nobody knows Lawrence like you do, certainly not me (and i never claimed i did).
Also, 75ish games is not "a few games" fwiw. LOL
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:29 am
by Deleted User 863
"You can't know ANYTHING about Lawrence because i lived there for 20 years and you didn't!"
Fucking classic.
My dad and his brother and sister would put your 20 years to shame...but they wouldn't, because they're not insecure assholes.
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:32 am
by jfish26
Value is in the eye of the beholder, right?
I think there's a certain type of fan who thinks that our recruits and players should "value" KU just like the fan does/did.
That's simply unrealistic. The recruiting waters we swim in are filled (generally) with kids who see basketball (and, by extension, playing basketball in college) as transactional.
You can say you want fewer of those kids, and more kids whose "values" align with your own. But you're not going to compete for Big 12 titles with those, much less bigger prizes.
KU is a weird-ass program to choose to follow if you're in this for the purity of the game.
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:32 am
by PhDhawk
BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:17 am
Mjl wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:10 am
BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:51 am
Arthur was a lotto pick. Doubt he needed/wanted to come back. Same with Aldrich. Sherron and Tyshawn make sense.
Chalmers was projected lotto a lot of places so hard to say and he had a good NBA career so i think he made the right choice.
You make a lot of shit up and state it as fact.
You don't remember Chalmers being protected lotto?
Iirc espn had him like 13th. Almost everywhere that i remember had him top 20.
I remember him being projected as a 2nd rounder and thinking he was making a huge mistake by declaring.
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:35 am
by Deleted User 863
Is it possible that maybe because you spent 20 years of your life in Lawrence loving Kansas (compared to many of these athletes who spend 4 years or less here and who didn't grow up loving Kansas) that you maybe overvalue the "student experience"?
I don't mean that rudely. But I just don't think say a guy like Josh Jackson loves KU as much as you do (or as much as my dad since he's been loving Kansas for 60+ years!...40 more than you
).
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:35 am
by PhDhawk
jfish26 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:32 am
Value is in the eye of the beholder, right?
I think there's a certain type of fan who thinks that our recruits and players should "value" KU just like the fan does/did.
That's simply unrealistic. The recruiting waters we swim in are filled (generally) with kids who see basketball (and, by extension, playing basketball in college) as transactional.
You can say you want fewer of those kids, and more kids whose "values" align with your own. But you're not going to compete for Big 12 titles with those, much less bigger prizes.
KU is a weird-ass program to choose to follow if you're in this for the purity of the game.
I think you might be talking more about the families and handlers and advisors surrounding these players than the players themselves.
If you loved riding roller coasters, and you got invited to ride them all the time and got to go the greatest roller coasters in the country, and then everyone convinced you that you should be getting paid to ride these roller coasters, you'd probably agree.
Doesn't mean you'd stop enjoying getting to ride amazind roller coasters.
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:36 am
by Deleted User 89
going full illy...what’s your next user name gonna be?
Re: F the NCAA
Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:40 am
by Deleted User 863
PhDhawk wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:32 am
BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:17 am
Mjl wrote: ↑Thu Jul 08, 2021 10:10 am
You make a lot of shit up and state it as fact.
You don't remember Chalmers being protected lotto?
Iirc espn had him like 13th. Almost everywhere that i remember had him top 20.
I remember him being projected as a 2nd rounder and thinking he was making a huge mistake by declaring.
Mario Chalmers, Kansas
Measurements: 6’1”, 190lbs., Age 22
Draft Express Rank: 5
ESPN Rank: 5
Projection: First Round
Synopsis: As the only guard in the draft to have a Gary Roberts Wednesday in his honor, Chalmers has a lot going for him, obviously. Like a few other guards here, he’s definitely been given the combo guard tag, despite not really having shooting guard size.
The knocks against him are numerous, hence the mention of a big talent drop off after Augustin, as he has a poor mid-range game, struggles to make his own shot, and projects as a back-up. Still, he might be the best defender in the entire draft class, is intelligent and fearless in his shot selection, and he has run the point for a National Champion.
He is a gamble in the lottery but has incredible value later in the first round, as his best fit is on a strong team as an instant contributor.
....
I can't find ESPNs mock draft, but i think they had him top 20.
).