Kansas Crimson

zsn wrote: ↑Sun Feb 19, 2023 11:45 pm

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 19, 2023 5:02 pm Yeah. You and henny penny see the sky falling everywhere.

I tend to think that five Knesset elections in four years show the vibrancy of Israeli democracy, but I know youse guys don't really associate democracy with elections much anymore.

Five Knesset elections in four years shows the weakness/fragility of the democracy as there is no one who can get/hold an electoral mandate. And extremely divided electorate. When was the last time someone served out their elected term? This would be akin to having a Presidential election every 10 months because the President was ousted for scandal or corruption or inability to govern.

If you are using the fact that they held an election as a measure of the strength of the democracy then you must love “democracies” under Putin and Saddam Hussein!!

This is maybe your dumbest post yet.

What's the difference between an Israeli election and a Russian election?

Man, I thought I was making good points, but how am I supposed to compete when DC’s only move is condescension?

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 9:58 am

zsn wrote: ↑Sun Feb 19, 2023 11:45 pm

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 19, 2023 5:02 pm Yeah. You and henny penny see the sky falling everywhere.

I tend to think that five Knesset elections in four years show the vibrancy of Israeli democracy, but I know youse guys don't really associate democracy with elections much anymore.

Five Knesset elections in four years shows the weakness/fragility of the democracy as there is no one who can get/hold an electoral mandate. And extremely divided electorate. When was the last time someone served out their elected term? This would be akin to having a Presidential election every 10 months because the President was ousted for scandal or corruption or inability to govern.

If you are using the fact that they held an election as a measure of the strength of the democracy then you must love “democracies” under Putin and Saddam Hussein!!

This is maybe your dumbest post yet.

What's the difference between an Israeli election and a Russian election?

Apparently you seem to believe that the fact that an election was held is the sign of a “vibrant democracy”??

LOL

What other move is pertinent in such a case?

zsn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 10:10 am
Apparently you seem to believe that the fact that an election was held is the sign of a “vibrant democracy”??

I'll refrain from saying what is apparent from your comparison of Israel to Putin's and Saddam's regimes.

No, I was using an absurd example to point out the absurdity of your metric. While I agree without any reservation that Israel has made the most progress towards having a democratic government of anyone in the region the best term to describe the fact that they have trouble maintaining a stable government is dysfunctional (and thus frequent elections). Not vibrancy.

Feral wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 2:14 pm (Who knew Israelis are rude?) Tennis player can't stop laughing at the opposition player's mistake.

Israelis are sabras. Prickly on the outside, sweet on the inside.

zsn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 10:21 am No, I was using an absurd example to point out the absurdity of your metric. While I agree without any reservation that Israel has made the most progress towards having a democratic government of anyone in the region the best term to describe the fact that they have trouble maintaining a stable government is dysfunctional (and thus frequent elections). Not vibrancy.

So having elections triggered by only a calendar is the sign of a functional government?

The sign of a functional government/democracy is the peaceful transfer of power, which Israel does quite well, even if unfortunately frequently of late.

Mjl wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 6:22 pm

zsn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 10:21 am No, I was using an absurd example to point out the absurdity of your metric. While I agree without any reservation that Israel has made the most progress towards having a democratic government of anyone in the region the best term to describe the fact that they have trouble maintaining a stable government is dysfunctional (and thus frequent elections). Not vibrancy.

So having elections triggered by only a calendar is the sign of a functional government?

How would you describe a government that lasts about as long as an average human gestational period, especially one that’s designed to last several times longer?

By your metric Luz Truss was one of the greatest Prime Ministers??

zsn wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 1:11 am

Mjl wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 6:22 pm

zsn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 10:21 am No, I was using an absurd example to point out the absurdity of your metric. While I agree without any reservation that Israel has made the most progress towards having a democratic government of anyone in the region the best term to describe the fact that they have trouble maintaining a stable government is dysfunctional (and thus frequent elections). Not vibrancy.

So having elections triggered by only a calendar is the sign of a functional government?

How would you describe a government that lasts about as long as an average human gestational period, especially one that’s designed to last several times longer?

By your metric Luz Truss was one of the greatest Prime Ministers??

I didn't say shorter was better.
But having elections triggerable by something other than just the calendar makes sense for that country.

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 7:14 pm The sign of a functional government/democracy is the peaceful transfer of power, which Israel does quite well, even if unfortunately frequently of late.

*January 6 has entered the chat*

and this thread's been around a while but still hasn't gone full Qusdahl.

Rather than do that, let's just review the last couple pages:

we got some posters concerned about Israel's leaders facing corruption charges, and trying to neuter the power of their courts, and assassinating journalists, and illegally annexing land, and shitting on the LGBTQ community, and concerns about Israel going "even further right wing" ETA oh and bombing civilians too

then you got other posters pointing to Israel is some shining example of democracy, and functioning gummint, and and "our own" civilizational goals and beliefs; and that anyone who says otherwise must be one of them sky is falling types.

so why even go full Qusdahl when you got all this?

That's really your summary?

Is that a serious post?

ousdahl wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 10:01 am Man, I thought I was making good points, but how am I supposed to compete when DC’s only move is condescension?

You think everyone who disagrees with you is being condescending.

Usually...more accurately people become condescending after engaging with you, repeatedly...providing links, sources, information, experience....all of which you ignore....then you ask for more information, discussion and ask the same questions in different forms.

when people provide you information over and over again and are ignored....the tendency is to become frustrated and condescending because its like interacting with a teenager who thinks they know everything and lives in some fantasy world while ignoring all evidence in the actual physical world.

thanks for your concern. I certainly don't want to ignore links, sources, information, experience. If there's a specific example you'd like to discuss, feel free. I'll certainly make the effort to not ignore anything going forward.

But, respectfully, I'm just not sure that's happening here. Not to the extent you suggest, at least.

Without digging up every example everywhere, let's stick to the last couple pages of this thread. I've provided usually credible journalistic links and sources such as NPR and Reuters, and expressed concerns about what those sources report.

and, since that comment you quoted was in reference to DC - you realize he's the one citing unconfirmed reports from fringe twitter accounts, and calling others dumb...right?

"Every thread"

Sometimes people just have to realize that they don't know enough about a complicated topic and should just tap out of any discussion of it that is more than surface deep. The Middle East has more than a millennia of back story that would be impossible to unravel and even then, we'd still not know much of what impacts it all. Hats off to those who attempt to wade through that morass to seek out peace and safety.

To be clear, I didn't mean to be condescending to my bestie Ousdahl.

I DID mean to be condescending to zsn, who has more than earned it.