Kansas Crimson

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 1:14 pm

Cascadia wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 1:10 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 1:02 pm I'm not endorsing the Rothstein tweet. Just a way to get conversation flowing from what I think we all saw last night: good Dave vs. bad Dave looks like it's going to mean a lot for how good this team is. And that should make everyone pretty damn nervous come March.

I agree with the good Dave vs bad Dave take and it does make me nervous for March. Even more nervous for April.

If coming off the bench works for Dave, then why would we be in a hurry to change that?

Not suggesting, just pondering.

I agree as long as Dave can handle it long term. I’d guess he’s to fragile to do that though.

Too*

I've said to people in the past I think Dave is one of those guys that plays better against good teams and good players. That's why he was slow out of the gates last year before putting in an all-conference league season. It was annoying and frustrating seeing fans call for him to be bench for Zach and KJ after "bad" games against teams like SFA and George Mason. "Well he only had 2 points!" He also only played 10 minutes because teams with 5 perimeter players are bad matchups for him. He was good against Nevada with their pair of footers. He dominated Mizzou's 7'3" monster. Now his best game came against a team that plays a true 5.

He's not coordinated enough to play fast and rarely gets position to score before getting the pass, so when they play mid-majors or teams with 6'7" 200 lb centers, he looks like a spaz trying to rush and score before the double team comes. When he's matched up against guys his size, he can take a breathe and slow down knowing he can take his time, feel his man, then make a move without as much worrying about littles coming in and slapping away at him.

It’s so paradoxical.

You’d think if he has 3+ inches and 50+ pounds of muscle on a dood, it should make it easier to play well, not more difficult.

Agreed. Not saying there's any weight to what I said, just what it seems like when you look at his best games matched up to his worst games. The mind is a crazy thing.

At the same time, how many people scream at the TV, no matter who the player is to make a layup.
Seems easy when they forget that there's an entire team trying to prevent that said layup from going in. Or coaches saying how well Dok shot FT's in practice, then come gameday he's 2-11.

The best big he played last season absolutely pantsed him.

pdub wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 1:14 pm His peak changes the entire game.
We don't need 17 and 15 but we might need 13 and 8.

Self as said how important DMac is to this season often. His doing well on offense is not just the points but the doubles and attention to him posting up.

Dave said B12 is like a new season to him. Hopefully he follows suit and does what he did in conference play again. He does that and we are a 1 seed.

I'm less concerned about bad Dave's drop in productivity than I am with his wasted possessions turnovers and missed loose balls.

We can get points and rebounds elsewhere. We can't get those empty possessions back.

hasbeen wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 3:42 pm The best big he played last season absolutely pantsed him.

Which big are we talking about?

The big averaging 15pts 8rebs and 2.5asts for the Cavs this year?

ousdahl wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 1:14 pm Well, it’s just awful difficult to imagine any kind of deep run in which we DON’T encounter at least one elite D1 front court.

And the only real piece we have to counter that much, is Dave.

Dave is never going to play 40mpg. It'll be a team effort regardless.

BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 3:46 pm

hasbeen wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 3:42 pm The best big he played last season absolutely pantsed him.

Which big are we talking about?

The big averaging 15pts 8rebs and 2.5asts for the Cavs this year?

Or the one still in college basketball.

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 1:14 pm

Cascadia wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 1:10 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 1:02 pm I'm not endorsing the Rothstein tweet. Just a way to get conversation flowing from what I think we all saw last night: good Dave vs. bad Dave looks like it's going to mean a lot for how good this team is. And that should make everyone pretty damn nervous come March.

I agree with the good Dave vs bad Dave take and it does make me nervous for March. Even more nervous for April.

If coming off the bench works for Dave, then why would we be in a hurry to change that?

Not suggesting, just pondering.

Like i mentioned yesterday, he doesn't look capable of playing 30mpg...coming off the bench helps ensure he's available at end of games.

I'd rather he be available to finish games more than i care if he starts games.

I think coming off the bench could actually help him play MORE minutes.

ousdahl wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 1:21 pm I suppose the trade-off, is if our sacrificial lamb Mitch is getting barbecued by some good frontcourt, so we’re already down double digits by the time Dave checks in.

Dumb.

Our team is very good. Och CB Remy and DH will be competitive against any team in the nation regardless of who starts at the 5.

Cascadia wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 1:42 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 1:14 pm

Cascadia wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 1:10 pm

I agree with the good Dave vs bad Dave take and it does make me nervous for March. Even more nervous for April.

If coming off the bench works for Dave, then why would we be in a hurry to change that?

Not suggesting, just pondering.

I agree as long as Dave can handle it long term. I’d guess he’s to fragile to do that though.

The way Self was screaming cuss words in his face last night early in the game, i don't think Dave is as fragile as we've been thinking.

A senior getting benched and then having a huge game doesn't scream fragile to me. It also helps that he and Mitch have been together a long time. I think Mitch genuinely wants Dave to do well. Hopefully they both just want to win.

ousdahl wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 2:28 pm It’s so paradoxical.

You’d think if he has 3+ inches and 50+ pounds of muscle on a dood, it should make it easier to play well, not more difficult.

You go back and forth on this.

Earlier in the season you were saying JW is a matchup problem at the 5. Which in theory he is. But unfortunately he is so bad at interior defense that the juice isn't worth the squeeze.

So which is it? You think big has an advantage on small or small has an advantage on big?


My take: every player is different. Dave plays better against bigger defenders historically it seems like.

hasbeen wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 3:49 pm

BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 3:46 pm

hasbeen wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 3:42 pm The best big he played last season absolutely pantsed him.

Which big are we talking about?

The big averaging 15pts 8rebs and 2.5asts for the Cavs this year?

Or the one still in college basketball.

Drew Timme was and still is the best big in college basketball. He did that to everyone. Blows my mind people actually thought Gonzaga was Kispert and Suggs team last year, lol.

hasbeen wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 3:49 pm

BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 3:46 pm

hasbeen wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 3:42 pm The best big he played last season absolutely pantsed him.

Which big are we talking about?

The big averaging 15pts 8rebs and 2.5asts for the Cavs this year?

Or the one still in college basketball.

Ahh Timme.

Yes, he's a beast.

Mobley will be the better pro, but Timme probably the better college player.

I'm still not quite convinced Mitch is our best option behind Dave at the 5 for rest of the season. He's playing best ball of his career, but I can see him getting exposed over the next month.

We're running out of time, though, to get Wilson, Clemence, and Adams ready for that role.

Yea.

And we haven’t even taken the shirt off Cam yet either.

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 4:07 pm I'm still not quite convinced Mitch is our best option behind Dave at the 5 for rest of the season. He's playing best ball of his career, but I can see him getting exposed over the next month.

We're running out of time, though, to get Wilson, Clemence, and Adams ready for that role.

Wilson is clearly not the guy. He has about 10min at the 5 this year. Almost all situational. Interior defense is awful. And he's shooting so poorly it's not like he's stretching the defense on the other end...not to mention, imo, JW looks better next to Dave than next to Mitch. That's a good combo off the bench even if their minutes stay the same or go up. More about minutes played than who is in at the tip.

I just think KJ and Clemence probably just limit us so much on the other end with what they are comfortable running as far as not messing up the flow of the other players or committing turnovers in bad spots.

Stan Van Gundy said something like "everyone thinks the guy on the bench should be starting until the guy on the bench has to start".

The fact we brought in Cam shows that Self wasn't just going to play Mitch out of sheer loyalty. He brought in 3 guys to battle for those minutes and Mitch has beaten them all out fair and square.

It’s January.

Historically, this is the dog days of Self KU ball. Gonna be some ugly games the next few weeks.

It’s also the time of year a player may step up into a new role. Stay tuned.