Kansas Crimson

pdub wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 6:30 am DC is loosing badly here.

Is he though?

Seemed like he proved a point with facts, and then the goal posts moved. To 1992. To per capita basis. And then to all the other things that are bad, as if that means the good progress isn't still a fact.

PDub is a religious fanatic -- as are most posters in this thread. There's no factual remedy for religious fanaticism.

The only thing that matters is per capita duh. Of course it doesnt matter that the US is actually a bigger country whose carbon emissions are trending in the correct direction. Or that China has 1.1 billion more people to skew the per capita numbers. None of that matters. None of it.

What I take from this is that people in the US need to start having more babies pronto so our numbers drop to acceptable per capita levels.

DC has Illy on his team.
Nuff said.

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 16, 2020 8:05 pm

Geezer wrote: ↑Sun Feb 16, 2020 7:53 pm So the US has been pouring the same amount of CO2 emissions for over 25 years and no other nation can catch us on a per capita basis.

You are correct, Boomer. My generation and those after it have done our best, but we still can't clean up your mess.

if only...

Feral posted a list of what your shittastic president and company have done/attempted to do while in office.

You don’t reverse protections just because “hey! They aren’t doing it!”

pdub wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:04 am Feral posted a list of what your shittastic president and company have done/attempted to do while in office.

You don’t reverse protections just because “hey! They aren’t doing it!”

What are you babbling about?

Your English gets fuzzy when you get animated defending your faith.

TraditionKU wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:01 am

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 16, 2020 8:05 pm

Geezer wrote: ↑Sun Feb 16, 2020 7:53 pm So the US has been pouring the same amount of CO2 emissions for over 25 years and no other nation can catch us on a per capita basis.

You are correct, Boomer. My generation and those after it have done our best, but we still can't clean up your mess.

if only...

We haven't?

Re-read:

And then, there's our current republican administration and senate. smfh

95 Environmental Rules Being Rolled Back Under Trump

(Don't worry, I'll only include the ways republicans are directly adding to our nation's air pollution, and skip what republicans are choosing to do to degrade our water, make us more susceptible to toxic substances, etc.)

...All told, the Trump administration’s environmental rollbacks could significantly increase greenhouse gas emissions and lead to thousands of extra deaths from poor air quality every year, according to a report prepared by New York University Law School's State Energy and Environmental Impact Center...

Air pollution and emissions

1. Canceled a requirement for oil and gas companies to report methane emissions.

2. Revised and partially repealed an Obama-era rule limiting methane emissions on public lands, including intentional venting and flaring from drilling operations.

3. Replaced the Obama-era Clean Power Plan, which would have set strict limits on carbon emissions from coal- and gas-fired power plants, with a new version that would let states set their own rules.

4. Revoked California’s power to set its own more stringent emissions standards for cars and light trucks.

5. Repealed a requirement that state and regional authorities track tailpipe emissions from vehicles traveling on federal highways.

6. Loosened a Clinton-era rule designed to limit toxic emissions from major industrial polluters.

7. Revised a permiting program designed to safeguard communities from increases in pollution from new power plants to make it easier for facilities to avoid emissions regulations.

8. Amended rules that govern how refineries monitor pollution in surrounding communities.

9. Stopped enforcing a 2015 rule that prohibited the use of hydrofluorocarbons, powerful greenhouse gases, in air-conditioners and refrigerators.

10. Weakened an Obama-era rule meant to reduce air pollution in national parks and wilderness areas.

11. Weakened oversight of some state plans for reducing air pollution in national parks.

12. Directed agencies to stop using an Obama-era calculation of the “social cost of carbon” that rulemakers used to estimate the long-term economic benefits of reducing carbon dioxide emissions.

13. Withdrew guidance that federal agencies include greenhouse gas emissions in environmental reviews. But several district courts have ruled that emissions must be included in such reviews.

14. Lifted a summertime ban on the use of E15, a gasoline blend made of 15 percent ethanol. (Burning gasoline with a higher concentration of ethanol in hot conditions increases smog.)

15. Changed rules to allow states and the E.P.A. to take longer to develop and approve plans aimed at cutting methane emissions from existing landfills.

16. Revoked an Obama executive order that set a goal of cutting the federal government’s greenhouse gas emissions by 40 percent over 10 years.

IN PROCESS
17. Proposed relaxing Obama-era requirements that companies monitor and repair methane leaks at oil and gas facilities.

18. Proposed weakening Obama-era fuel-economy standards for cars and light trucks.

19. Submitted notice of intent to withdraw the United States from the Paris climate agreement. The process of withdrawing cannot be completed until November 2020.

20. Proposed eliminating Obama-era restrictions that in effect required newly built coal power plants to capture carbon dioxide emissions.

21. Proposed a legal justification for weakening an Obama-era rule that limited mercury emissions from coal power plants.

22. Proposed revisions to standards for carbon dioxide emissions from new, modified and reconstructed power plants.

23. Began a review of emissions rules for power plant start-ups, shutdowns and malfunctions. In April, the E.P.A. proposed reversing a requirement that Texas follow the emissions rule, with implications for 35 other states.

24. Proposed the repeal of rules meant to reduce leaking and venting of hydrofluorocarbons from large refrigeration and air conditioning systems.

25. Opened for comment a proposal limiting the ability of individuals and communities to challenge E.P.A.-issued pollution permits before a panel of agency judges.

[...]

What's your point?

Emissions are still going down.

As Trad -- of all people -- pointed out. It's the triumph of market forces over government.


Also, fracking. But lulz.

Emissions are going down BECAUSE these policies were put in place.
Once you start to reverse them, emissions will rise.
We don't want emissions to rise, we want them to continue to go down, despite whatever China is doing.

pdub wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:42 pm Emissions are going down BECAUSE these policies were put in place.
Once you start to reverse them, emissions will rise.
We don't want emissions to rise, we want them to continue to go down, despite whatever China is doing.

I don't think these policies should be rolled back.

But I do think DC's right in that the progress that's been made is more about a cultural paradigm shift than it is about political policy.

People want to drive electric cars. People want cleaner electricity. They want to buy local meat and produce, people want to have houses and lawns that require less energy, etc.

It makes it more surprising that there's a political push to roll things back.

But no one's paying $90,000 to drive a Tesla because of a political regulation.

pdub wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:42 pm Emissions are going down BECAUSE these policies were put in place.
Once you start to reverse them, emissions will rise.
We don't want emissions to rise, we want them to continue to go down, despite whatever China is doing.

I mean...you re-posted so I assume you read it. Which is to say that you should know that 16 of the 25 are ALREADY IN PLACE.

So..."once you start to reverse them"...well...fuckitall.

Additionally, fracking is a HUGE key here.

Fracking makes natural gas more accessible and much cheaper, allowing it to compete with coal on a price basis, not just on an emissions basis. The rollback of coal regulations had far less impact BECAUSE of fracking.

That's progress -- real, tangible progress that will be reversed immediately by any of the Democratic candidates, specifically to virtue signal to you religious nuts.

solar has now become the cheapest source of electricity at 4 cents per kilowatt hour, thanks in large part to government subsidies

Ignore the horse, its on topic

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/06/africa/a ... index.html

this has been done with planting practices for crops so as to keep from stripping a single plot of land from all nutrients, so it’s good to see it being done with cattle (although for different reasons)

no mention of the erosive impact cattle have vs natural grazers, though

Wait for it...

Alright everyone, stop whining about climate change(or just buy an electric vehicle) and get off your duffs and plant trees!
https://boisedev.com/news/2020/02/14/el ... challenge/