Kansas Crimson

Fanciful development wishcasting: it's not just for sports.

Here is a headline and sub-headline:

More beauty, less ‘junk’ retail: Country Club Plaza’s new owner reveals future look

“I want people in the neighborhoods to walk across the bridge and feel like you’ve entered Oz. . . .The streets are beautiful,” said Ray Washburne, a new principal owner of the Country Club Plaza.

https://www.kansascity.com/news/local/a ... 98720.html

Here are some essential parts of the story:

“We are going to reconfigure all this area,” Washburne said. “We’re calling it the Paseo District, with wider sidewalks, outdoor dining. We’re going to take a lot of nothing and turn it into a lot of something.”

Grand roundabout fountains at intersections. Retail shops removed to make room for outdoor walkways. Asphalt streets out, brick streets in. Facades, roofs, entire buildings transformed to more thoroughly evoke the district’s Spanish flair.

[...]

Since the purchase, Washburne has already outlined, in broad terms, numerous plans he has for the district: added security, a boutique hotel, a new office tower in the empty 3 acres where a Nordstrom store had been planned, more unique local restaurants and local retail over national chains.

But in a discussion with The Star last week, those plans took on sharper focus. Maps and renderings were later shared which, when viewed together, reveal a Plaza whose future streetscape is likely to look remarkably different than the one that this weekend was set to draw tens of thousands of visitors to the annual Plaza Art Fair.

And here is one of those renderings:



I would suggest that there is a disqualifying disconnect with reality here - that this can't even be described as what a best-case scenario looks like. If you're going to keep the Plaza fully open to vehicle traffic, then in a best-case scenario (meaning: the Plaza is doing well) there will be 3x more vehicle traffic.

Why do "aspirational" renderings like this matter? They anchor the public's expectations. Doing so unrealistically means you're setting yourself up to fail.

I, personally, think the bolder (and long-term better) play would be to close the center of the Plaza to personal vehicles, and instead have nodes on the borders/corners for parking and even dropoff, and then a network of small (electric, autonomous?) low-speed vehicles to provide a connectivity option within the core.

But if we're not going to close the Plaza off to personal vehicle traffic, then we need to be realistic about what the Plaza can and should look and function like.

tl;dr - just like with Royals (and the airport before), KC's got to get over the belief that it is not just reasonable, but justifiable and desirable, for people to be able to drive their own cars to precisely where they want to go, in all cases.

"I, personally, think the bolder (and long-term better) play would be to close the center of the Plaza to personal vehicles, and instead have nodes on the borders/corners for parking and even dropoff, and then a network of small (electric, autonomous?) low-speed vehicles to provide a connectivity option within the core."

I hell to the yes agree here.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 12:11 pm

KC's got to get over the belief, for people to be able to drive their own cars to precisely where they want to go, in all cases.

This is it. It's a fat, lazy, midwestern dump.

Back2Lawrence wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 12:39 pm

jfish26 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 12:11 pm

KC's got to get over the belief, for people to be able to drive their own cars to precisely where they want to go, in all cases.

This is it. It's a fat, lazy, midwestern dump.

Mass should probably be closed to vehicles as well. But, same reason.

pdub wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 12:32 pm "I, personally, think the bolder (and long-term better) play would be to close the center of the Plaza to personal vehicles, and instead have nodes on the borders/corners for parking and even dropoff, and then a network of small (electric, autonomous?) low-speed vehicles to provide a connectivity option within the core."

I hell to the yes agree here.

^^^

Back2Lawrence wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 12:40 pm

Back2Lawrence wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 12:39 pm

jfish26 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 12:11 pm

KC's got to get over the belief, for people to be able to drive their own cars to precisely where they want to go, in all cases.

This is it. It's a fat, lazy, midwestern dump.

Mass should probably be closed to vehicles as well. But, same reason.

I think Mass is different though it could certainly work.
The traffic on certain days is so light that closing it entirely off seems overkill.
I think closing it down on the weekend or during a certain time during the weekend would be the route i'd take though I don't know the logistics of enforcement for this.

Back2Lawrence wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 12:40 pm

Back2Lawrence wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 12:39 pm

jfish26 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 12:11 pm

KC's got to get over the belief, for people to be able to drive their own cars to precisely where they want to go, in all cases.

This is it. It's a fat, lazy, midwestern dump.

Mass should probably be closed to vehicles as well. But, same reason.

i’ve been advocating for that for damn near 30 years

The way Mass is laid out I think the stores would needlessly suffer and Lawrence doesn't need that right now.

meh

aside from a few old timers, Mass seems to always be a revolving door of retailers

KUTradition wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 1:41 pm meh

aside from a few old timers, Mass seems to always be a revolving door of retailers

I think less traffic ( people not cars ) would mean even worse turnover.

pdub wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 1:46 pm

KUTradition wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 1:41 pm meh

aside from a few old timers, Mass seems to always be a revolving door of retailers

I think less traffic ( people not cars ) would mean even worse turnover.

maybe?

on the flip side, if it were to be paved over and turned into a grassy mall with local artists’ work on display, and maybe even artists working, it might bring more traffic

KUTradition wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 2:05 pm

pdub wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 1:46 pm

KUTradition wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 1:41 pm meh

aside from a few old timers, Mass seems to always be a revolving door of retailers

I think less traffic ( people not cars ) would mean even worse turnover.

maybe?

on the flip side, if it were to be paved over and turned into a grassy mall with local artists’ work on display, and maybe even artists working, it might bring more traffic

I'd like to think so but I have my big time doubts.

You’d need to build more garages. Right now a big part of the issue isn’t that people don’t want to park and walk around, it’s that they really can’t.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 2:13 pm You’d need to build more garages. Right now a big part of the issue isn’t that people don’t want to park and walk around, it’s that they really can’t.

This logic seems right, but it’s not really accurate. I mean, there would need to be more garages, for sure, but people absolutely don’t want to walk. Part of that l, I get, the weather here sucks more often than not.

A common theme running through the “revival” of many European city centers is the initial vehement opposition to pedestrian-only development followed by immense appreciation that the powers-that-be didn’t listen to the vehement opposition and implemented the plan anyway. This didn’t mean that entire city centers were closed to vehicles. As mentioned before, peripheral streets were designated to bring people as close as possible to the main streets with parking at walking distance.

Using Mass Street as an example, if the length of Mass, say 7th to 15th, was closed to vehicles on the weekends (eg Friday noon to Sunday midnight) maybe 9th or 11th would be open to cross traffic. Parking would be expanded at say 6th and streets to the east and west of Mass.

I think the Plaza plan looks good and if it makes people realize that getting out of their cars and walking a few blocks, or several, is a good thing then it would be a great success.

Visit Boulder. Seems to be thriving with big chunks closed to cars.

The Boulder model is the one I’d use if/when Lawrence were to do such a thing. I’d also be careful to recognize huge differences in climate/usage ability.

Cross streets still allow traffic through, like 8th, 9th, 10th here.

Definitely wouldn’t need to be closed to 15th. Only to 11th. 6th-11th is business district.

Would need to make some of East-west streets good pick up spots for Uber/lyfts/taxi stands/whatever as well.

I’d put a center traffic lane down middle for some electric/hydrogen/squirrel powered type of transportation to get those that don’t want to walk in horrible weather/for those who try mobility issues.

Lots of ways to make such a thing work. As stated, the leaders would just need to do it. With a plan.


All this said, it’s doubtful I see anything ever done.