Kansas Crimson

TDub wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 8:13 am where'd ya hear that

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxbus ... grants.amp

"The grant program would extend free community college to individuals regardless of their "basis of citizenship, alienage, or immigration status," according to the most recent version of the reconciliation bill."

Not going to happen, because moderate Dems won't go for it, but still crazy to think this stuff is getting crammed into the reconciliation bill.

BasketballJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 9:12 am

TDub wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 8:13 am where'd ya hear that

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxbus ... grants.amp

"The grant program would extend free community college to individuals regardless of their "basis of citizenship, alienage, or immigration status," according to the most recent version of the reconciliation bill."

Not going to happen, because moderate Dems won't go for it, but still crazy to think this stuff is getting crammed into the reconciliation bill.

Yeah, I am not a fan of that. Non-citizens should not have their Community College paid for by citizens. That's too far. Heck, I dont even feel like college should be free to citizens like Bernie wants.

I dunno about non-citizens

But I do generally wish our public resources went more to things like education for taxpaying citizens.

ousdahl wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 10:14 am I dunno about non-citizens

But I do generally wish our public resources went more to things like education for taxpaying citizens.

At the very least we need to find better ways of loaning money to students. (and by better I mean less expensive for the student long term)

Yeah.

Pretty crazy that an 18 year old can take out a quarter million dollar loan for education but not for a house.

With one of the biggest differences being, at least you get equity with a house

Not only that, but you can do into deferment on a student loan, that's great, you took a low paying internship or decided to go to a graduate program, no need to make payments, right now, oh, but the interest will accrue like a mother fucker and pretty soon your loan is much bigger than it was when you graduated.

ousdahl wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 10:14 am I dunno about non-citizens

But I do generally wish our public resources went more to things like education for taxpaying citizens.

Better subsidized? Yes.

Fully paid for? No.

And agree with PhD that student loans should be changed. Waive the interest on them entirely as a way to help subsidize education. Of course some of the "I paid my own way" crowd will complain but someone complains about every program.

twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 11:37 am

ousdahl wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 10:14 am I dunno about non-citizens

But I do generally wish our public resources went more to things like education for taxpaying citizens.

Better subsidized? Yes.

Fully paid for? No.

And agree with PhD that student loans should be changed. Waive the interest on them entirely as a way to help subsidize education. Of course some of the "I paid my own way" crowd will complain but someone complains about every program.

As a part of the "I paid my own way" crowd - I'd like it to be better for everyone in the future, I don't wish that on anyone.

Go to school to get a good job, land the good job, live like your poor cause you're in debt. How is that good for our country, or incentive, or the economy...it's not.

I'll never understand that line of thinking that if it sucked for me it should suck for you too.

PhDhawk wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 11:40 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 11:37 am

ousdahl wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 10:14 am I dunno about non-citizens

But I do generally wish our public resources went more to things like education for taxpaying citizens.

Better subsidized? Yes.

Fully paid for? No.

And agree with PhD that student loans should be changed. Waive the interest on them entirely as a way to help subsidize education. Of course some of the "I paid my own way" crowd will complain but someone complains about every program.

As a part of the "I paid my own way" crowd - I'd like it to be better for everyone in the future, I don't wish that on anyone.

Go to school to get a good job, land the good job, live like your poor cause you're in debt. How is that good for our country, or incentive, or the economy...it's not.

I'll never understand that line of thinking that if it sucked for me it should suck for you too.

Agreed. I paid my way through with no loans as well because I could. I dont think there should be additional financial burdens put on people because they couldn't afford it in the first place. That feels upside down.

This country could use less randylaheys.

A secondary education should be easy to get without adding significant debt.

For what it takes to completely set up 1 cop with his Oakleys, tactical boots, 4 guns and all the tacti-cool gear....you could pay a year of a decent college for 2-3 people who will likely come out of it far more productive for society

A few points I’m throwing in to clarify certain assumptions: please understand that ‘non-citizens’ doesn’t automatically mean people who are breaking the law and are freeloaders. FWIW I don’t think people are risking their lives, paying bribes and traveling long distances to abuse the system in order to obtain free community college education. Often these are children of temporary workers (H1-B), students and others who are legally in the country, pay local, State and Federal taxes. For that matter most unauthorized workers also pay these taxes. Heck, they have likely paid more taxes than our immediate past President.

Second point is regarding student loans. I am of the opinion that availability of student loans is a major cause of the high cost of college education. Most educational institutions inflate their cost to attend precisely because there are student loans available. Turn off the spigot and the costs will come down because the market can’t bear these high costs. I may be a contrarian on this, but I think it’s student loans themselves which are the problem, and not the solution. The analogy to a for-profit hospital charging insurance $25 for a Tylenol wouldn’t be a stretch. The consumer is blissfully unaware of the larger consequences and is only tuned to the immediate relief.

As to how we extricate ourselves from the stranglehold of Big Education is beyond me, but stopping the subsidies laundered as student loans could be a start

zsn wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 3:59 pm Second point is regarding student loans. I am of the opinion that availability of student loans is a major cause of the high cost of college education. Most educational institutions inflate their cost to attend precisely because there are student loans available. Turn off the spigot and the costs will come down because the market can’t bear these high costs. I may be a contrarian on this, but I think it’s student loans themselves which are the problem, and not the solution. The analogy to a for-profit hospital charging insurance $25 for a Tylenol wouldn’t be a stretch. The consumer is blissfully unaware of the larger consequences and is only tuned to the immediate relief.

As to how we extricate ourselves from the stranglehold of Big Education is beyond me, but stopping the subsidies laundered as student loans could be a start

Love this. I think there is definitely merit to this theory. The trend of rising cost of college is likely mirrored in the trend of average student debt.

This go here today?

I watched The Forever Purge last night.
5 years ago, it would seemed unfathomable.

Today, somewhat unlikely.

ousdahl wrote: ↑Fri Oct 01, 2021 1:35 pm

Scary words, run away!

Whatever it is, it's about the amount spent on all of WW2, adjusting for inflation. That's insane.

The per year spend is about half of the per year Pentagon budget. So there’s that

zsn wrote: ↑Fri Oct 01, 2021 2:57 pm The per year spend is about half of the per year Pentagon budget. So there’s that

So we play whataboutism until the dollar is worthless?

Pentagon budget is insane too.

I’ve also seen headlines that like almost half of the U.S. dollars ever printed have been printed in the past year