WELCOME HUNTER DICKINSON

[pdub]

Ah, I misread.
I thought you were comparing Kevin to Remy.

No you are comparing Kevin to Hunter.

Answer is simple.
Hunter is a douche bag who just wants money.

[MICHHAWK]

the criticism the kid takes is unfair.

but. he is the highest paid player. on our worst team in 20 years. so. he is the obvious whipping boy.

[TDub]

It's a culmination of things with HD I think. Some his fault, some not his fault.

Especially because guys like PDub and TDub aren't usually the ones to dislike any of our players typically. At least not that I remember, unless a specific player was involved in off court stuff that warranted the dislike.

I think the only other Jayhawks player I ever really talked down about was Dedric. Generally i
I'm pretty positive.

This year has been rough, I don't like Hunter, and I have been hard on Timberlake. I dont dislike Timberlake though, I just haven't veen real kind in my analysis of his play. He's a likeable guy, just has been disappointing.

Hunter isn't even likeable.

[MICHHAWK]

i bet the kid would be very likeable if we were living up to our preseason expectations/rankings. if we were top 5 with a 1 seed, he would be darn right loveable.

[jfish26]

Ah, I misread.
I thought you were comparing Kevin to Remy.

No you are comparing Kevin to Hunter.

Answer is simple.
Hunter is a douche bag who just wants money.

I just don't recall - and maybe it's my issue - there being nearly this much angst over all of the other douche bags we've had, or all of the other guys who just want money as we've had, or the combinations of both we've had.

[pdub]

I wasn't the hugest fan of Dedric either but could respect his game to a level.
Guy was a talent and was basically our entire offense after Vick went full Vick so while he too was a mercenary ( and he and his fam prob got $$ under the table ) I don't remember him acting like Hunter has this season.

Hunter came in hot.
First with that god awful look at me decision video and then:

"The people hating on me would leave their job right now for a $10,000 increase," Dickinson said. "I got, at Michigan, less than six figures. I got less than six figures at Michigan for the year."

"But I just felt like, man, it was the best decision for me. It took a lot of courage. I don't think people realize how much courage it took for a guy who was there for three years, an All-American for the team."

This is before our PR team came swooping in and said, oh no no no no no.
He showed his true colors early.

He has at least 1 ( if not more ) obnoxious celebration a game and has done so when we've been loosing.

He will give up trying to get back down the court if he thinks someone fucked up. He doesn't put out extra effort when hustling for rebounds ( and he's an excellent rebounder ) out of his zone. He tells Dajuan, who has been in this offense for years, where to go on the floor. He exudes douche in his interviews.

He's a super talented dude.
Not saying he doesn't deserve 1st team B12 accolades, and that he makes our team better, he absolutely does, he's just the antithesis of what I think the sport should be.

You can like him all you want - I just cannot stand the guy.

[DeletedUser]

It's a culmination of things with HD I think. Some his fault, some not his fault.

Especially because guys like PDub and TDub aren't usually the ones to dislike any of our players typically. At least not that I remember, unless a specific player was involved in off court stuff that warranted the dislike.

I think the only other Jayhawks player I ever really talked down about was Dedric. Generally i
I'm pretty positive.

This year has been rough, I don't like Hunter, and I have been hard on Timberlake. I dont dislike Timberlake though, I just haven't veen real kind in my analysis of his play. He's a likeable guy, just has been disappointing.

Hunter isn't even likeable.

I didn't like Dedric or Remy (if we are being honest).

[jfish26]

I wasn't the hugest fan of Dedric either but could respect his game to a level.
Guy was a talent and was basically our entire offense after Vick went full Vick so while he too was a mercenary ( and he and his fam prob got $$ under the table ) I don't remember him acting like Hunter has this season.

Hunter came in hot.
First with that god awful look at me decision video and then:

"The people hating on me would leave their job right now for a $10,000 increase," Dickinson said. "I got, at Michigan, less than six figures. I got less than six figures at Michigan for the year."

"But I just felt like, man, it was the best decision for me. It took a lot of courage. I don't think people realize how much courage it took for a guy who was there for three years, an All-American for the team."

This is before our PR team came swooping in and said, oh no no no no no.
He showed his true colors early.

He has at least 1 ( if not more ) obnoxious celebration a game and has done so when we've been loosing.

He will give up trying to get back down the court if he thinks someone fucked up. He doesn't put out extra effort when hustling for rebounds ( and he's an excellent rebounder ) out of his zone. He tells Dajuan, who has been in this offense for years, where to go on the floor.

He's a super talented dude.
Not saying he doesn't deserve 1st team B12 accolades, and that he makes our team better, he absolutely does, he's just the antithesis of what I think the sport should be.

You can like him all you want - I just cannot stand the guy.

Truly just talking - not intending at all to be antagonistic. I agree that he brought it on himself to a major degree.

It does feel to me like he is being punished, to at least some degree, for being honest, genuine and authentic. Now, one might find him to be honestly, genuinely, authentically an asshole.

I can't tell someone they're wrong for thinking that, and nor can someone tell me I'm wrong for finding the transparency to be refreshing.

I just look back on things like Shady's dream, and feel somewhat like where Hunter messed up wasn't in feeling the way he feels, but in saying it out loud.

[randylahey]

Guess who's freshman stats these are:

10 mpg, 3.3 pts, 1.5 assists

Not any of the freshman guard lotto picks around the country I am guessing?

Jamal shead

[randylahey]

Jamal shead just won big 12 POY and DPOY. Best player on the best team.

His freshman stats:
3.3 pts, 1.5 assists. Only played 10 minutes a game

What's my point? There is still a lot of value in developing players and being patient

[jfish26]

Jamal shead just won big 12 POY and DPOY. Best player on the best team.

His freshman stats:
3.3 pts, 1.5 assists. Only played 10 minutes a game

What's my point? There is still a lot of value in developing players and being patient

I don't think anyone disputes that.

[pdub]

Some fucking Baylor guard like LJ Cryer or something.

Pretty damn close.

[pdub]

"...one might find him to be honestly, genuinely, authentically an asshole."

Not only one but like a lot of people.

[jfish26]

"...one might find him to be honestly, genuinely, authentically an asshole."

Not only one but like a lot of people.

Yeah, I was specifically NOT trying to make this a pdub thing. I'm genuinely curious about what's different here - and my thinking is that it's a combination of (1) general pissed-off-ness at the present state and direction of things, and (2) Hunter, specifically, screaming the quiet parts at rock-show volume.

[DeletedUser]

Jamal shead just won big 12 POY and DPOY. Best player on the best team.

His freshman stats:
3.3 pts, 1.5 assists. Only played 10 minutes a game

What's my point? There is still a lot of value in developing players and being patient

Absolutely.

We all agree.

Especially with 3 star players like Shead (and Frank and Devonte).

Elmarko, right or wrong, was billed as an NBA caliber type guy. He was ranked ahead of Rob Dillingham. Of all the top 30 recruits from last year, he's got to be one of the 5 worst seasons (without even looking).

[pdub]

"2. Hunter, specifically, screaming the quiet parts at rock-show volume."

But not every player who is good at basketball thinks like Hunter even quietly.
People are raised differently. Have different thoughts on things. Different priorities.
He's screaming the quiet parts of what we might be assuming high end athletes all think like -- but I think there's probably athletes out there who would never say what Hunter said and aren't thinking it either.

And then there are levels of what someone thinks and then knowing when not to say what they are thinking. That's just being a human. And someone who doesn't have that filter, well, they are often known as assholes because that's how living in a society works.

[jfish26]

Jamal shead just won big 12 POY and DPOY. Best player on the best team.

His freshman stats:
3.3 pts, 1.5 assists. Only played 10 minutes a game

What's my point? There is still a lot of value in developing players and being patient

Absolutely.

We all agree.

Especially with 3 star players like Shead (and Frank and Devonte).

Elmarko, right or wrong, was billed as an NBA caliber type guy. He was ranked ahead of Rob Dillingham. Of all the top 30 recruits from last year, he's got to be one of the 5 worst seasons (without even looking).

And, as best as I can figure it, the common thread in our recent series of whiffs has been that they're guys who were good enough as preps to warrant NBA caliber type guy treatment, but not good enough as freshmen to perform like it.

Bill expanded on this on Hawk Talk maybe a month ago, but it does seem to me like - in two completely different ways - the portal means that's the LAST type of guy we should be hunting.

[jfish26]

"2. Hunter, specifically, screaming the quiet parts at rock-show volume."

But not every player who is good at basketball thinks like Hunter even quietly.
People are raised differently. Have different thoughts on things. Different priorities.
He's screaming the quiet parts of what we might be assuming high end athletes all think like -- but I think there's probably athletes out there who would never say what Hunter said and aren't thinking it either.

And then there are levels of what someone thinks and then knowing when not to say what they are thinking. That's just being a human. And someone who doesn't have that filter, well, they are often known as assholes because that's how living in a society works.

I think Hunter's a pretty unique case, in that he knows it's never going to be this much fun again, and that if he wants to stay stateside anyway, this might well be his annual earning potential at its highest. He doesn't have an 8- or 9-figure career trajectory to protect, or even to encourage him to keep his head down. He's also seen so much more than our typical OAD types - he's almost 24!

I say this not to try to change your mind, or even to defend his words or actions. I'm just genuinely interested in why he gets demonized where others get passes.

[DeletedUser]

Jamal shead just won big 12 POY and DPOY. Best player on the best team.

His freshman stats:
3.3 pts, 1.5 assists. Only played 10 minutes a game

What's my point? There is still a lot of value in developing players and being patient

Absolutely.

We all agree.

Especially with 3 star players like Shead (and Frank and Devonte).

Elmarko, right or wrong, was billed as an NBA caliber type guy. He was ranked ahead of Rob Dillingham. Of all the top 30 recruits from last year, he's got to be one of the 5 worst seasons (without even looking).

And, as best as I can figure it, the common thread in our recent series of whiffs has been that they're guys who were good enough as preps to warrant NBA caliber type guy treatment, but not good enough as freshmen to perform like it.

Bill expanded on this on Hawk Talk maybe a month ago, but it does seem to me like - in two completely different ways - the portal means that's the LAST type of guy we should be hunting.

Yes.

3 buckets:

Program guys - who are typically going to have limitations and reachable ceilings. DHs and Kjs.

High end transfers - KMs, Remys, and HDs.

High end recruits - 1 to 2 year guys. Gradey Dicks, Johnny Furphys.



We've had A LOT of misses on guys the last 5-7 years. And it wasn't from the "program guys" bucket.

[jfish26]

Absolutely.

We all agree.

Especially with 3 star players like Shead (and Frank and Devonte).

Elmarko, right or wrong, was billed as an NBA caliber type guy. He was ranked ahead of Rob Dillingham. Of all the top 30 recruits from last year, he's got to be one of the 5 worst seasons (without even looking).

And, as best as I can figure it, the common thread in our recent series of whiffs has been that they're guys who were good enough as preps to warrant NBA caliber type guy treatment, but not good enough as freshmen to perform like it.

Bill expanded on this on Hawk Talk maybe a month ago, but it does seem to me like - in two completely different ways - the portal means that's the LAST type of guy we should be hunting.

Yes.

3 buckets:

Program guys - who are typically going to have limitations and reachable ceilings. DHs and Kjs.

High end transfers - KMs, Remys, and HDs.

High end recruits - 1 to 2 year guys. Gradey Dicks, Johnny Furphys.



We've had A LOT of misses on guys the last 5-7 years. And it wasn't from the "program guys" bucket.

Right - I think you always need to be sprinkling in guys with different trajectories. To build floor and ceiling at the same time.

But you ALSO need to be bringing in guys at their right level. If you're bringing in a guy to play, then he's gotta be ready to play. And if you're bringing in a guy to develop, then he's gotta be willing to develop.

Jury's out on Jackson there, and I know dick-all about him as a person. But our recent history of whiffs that look just like him (profile-wise) don't make me hopeful.