Kansas Crimson

pdub wrote: ↑Tue Dec 17, 2019 1:28 pm

jfish26 wrote: ↑Tue Dec 17, 2019 12:13 pm

pdub wrote: ↑Tue Dec 17, 2019 11:46 am Vick and Dedric were stat stuffers ( though they were both really good at that ).
Neither Lawson brothers hustled.
Grimes more often than not was a slog on offense.

This team would beat last years team 9 times outta 10.
Vick would score 38 points going 8/10 from 3 and steal the 10th.
( here comes the Vick hate! )

It's not so much hate, it's just confusion for why you put a guy who, at his best, was a borderline all-conference player, on such a pedestal. 14/4/2? Meh. And that's before getting into, you know, the troubles.

It's more he's not as awful as we ( not everyone on the bored included ) make/made him out to be.
A good player under Self if you look at all the players under Self who could completely take over a game.

But, if he belongs in that category at all (which: debatable), he's among the least good players in the category. So, on top of topping out (very generously!) at "among the worst of Self's good players", he's ALSO a terrible person and team cancer.

I just don't get picking that horse.

Not an awful player at Kansas. Not a bad player at Kansas. Not an average player at Kansas. Not an above average player at Kansas.

A good player at Kansas.

Whatever you say about his character is likely ( not definitely ) valid.
But Bragg pushed a girl down the stairs. And then he didn't.

Bragg, an angel by comparison. Only got kicked off the team once instead of twice. The independent body cleared Bragg of an assault on a female while Vick didn't fare as well.

pdub wrote: ↑Tue Dec 17, 2019 2:12 pm Not an awful player at Kansas. Not a bad player at Kansas. Not an average player at Kansas. Not an above average player at Kansas.

A good player at Kansas.

Whatever you say about his character is likely ( not definitely ) valid.
But Bragg pushed a girl down the stairs. And then he didn't.

I'm not sure what this all means. I guess my point is that, whatever you want to call Vick's level of on-court performance, it doesn't seem to be nearly enough to make a logical person want to ride for the guy.

Bragg and Vick were/are both headcases...just at the opposite ends of the spectrum.

I don't 100% trust that particular University institution ( who also resides over title IX policy ) on what they believe a male student athlete may or may not have done. Here is what is on their homepage:

"The Office of Institutional Opportunity and Access (IOA) is responsible for administering the University of Kansas equal opportunity and non-discrimination policies and procedures, as well as, encouraging a campus climate of respect and understanding of all aspects of the human experience."

I don't believe they would be very objective.
Vick wasn't charged with a crime.

This of course, is my opinion. It may differ than others. That is OK.

is it up to them to charge vick, or the victim of the alleged assault?

Some dude for Arizona State came off their bench and scored 43 of their 56 points. Never seen a box score for a team look so bizarre. Only three players scored for Arizona State.

Oh, and Kentucky lost to Utah in the middle of the night.

TraditionKU wrote: ↑Tue Dec 17, 2019 5:42 pm is it up to them to charge vick, or the victim of the alleged assault?

wait but I thought Laura Bauer was judge jury and executioner?

twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Dec 19, 2019 7:15 am Some dude for Arizona State came off their bench and scored 43 of their 56 points. Never seen a box score for a team look so bizarre. Only three players scored for Arizona State.

Oh, and Kentucky lost to Utah in the middle of the night.

Whoa, this time last year Arizona State beat us. Seems like forever ago.

The Arizona State bench dude had only made 26 baskets all year before making 18 last night. It was a 40 minute heat check.

twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Dec 19, 2019 7:15 am Some dude for Arizona State came off their bench and scored 43 of their 56 points. Never seen a box score for a team look so bizarre. Only three players scored for Arizona State.

Oh, and Kentucky lost to Utah in the middle of the night.

That "dude" (Alonzo Verge) is a Chicago area kid and I have seen him play in person.
I could be mistaken but I think he's one of the guys I gave praise to on .net a few years ago.
Obviously he has skills. I think he was an academic question mark from day 1 and that's why schools shied away from him.
Besides being a Chicago area kid, he has something else in common with Anthony Davis, Derrick Rose, Patrick Beverly, Eric Gordon, and Tyler Ulis.

I watched part of that UK Utah game. Kentucky looked lost and like a team that had never played together before. I imagine calipari will fix some of those things, his teams always look like pick up game teams in december. I just dont think they have the talent to overcome their issues this year. We shall see.

Lots of flashbacks happening this week to 14 years ago when KU went to snowy Philly and lost to an up and coming Villanova team under Jay Wright.

That game was also the demise of the crimson jerseys under Self. I want him to bust those back out to exercise the demons when KU wins by 10 or more.

TDub wrote: ↑Thu Dec 19, 2019 8:49 am I watched part of that UK Utah game. Kentucky looked lost and like a team that had never played together before. I imagine calipari will fix some of those things, his teams always look like pick up game teams in december. I just dont think they have the talent to overcome their issues this year. We shall see.

Cal could use a bit of a strategy adjustment.

He's run the same offense and strategy for 20 years. Don't think he'll change. He's too damn stubborn.

He'll throw his arms, yell, stomp around, and stand dumbfounded once his dribble-drive offense gets stopped and he doesn't know what to do next because he STINKS at Xs and Os.

NewtonHawk11 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 19, 2019 9:24 am He's run the same offense and strategy for 20 years. Don't think he'll change. He's too damn stubborn.

He'll throw his arms, yell, stomp around, and stand dumbfounded once his dribble-drive offense gets stopped and he doesn't know what to do next because he STINKS at Xs and Os.

I don't think he stinks at Xs and Os. I think he's fine in that area. It's just difficult to work stuff in when, by design, you don't have a lot of year-to-year roster stability.

Philly game: I remember that game well.
It dumped 30 inches of snow where I was living and I couldn't get out to watch the game.

I'm thinking more recruiting and roster buildup. I think the lack of dominance on the court has hurt his brand a little, and it seems much more to do with his roster construction. Replacing year in and year out is hard when duke is doing the same thing. We hear the same excuses from Cal every season.

I know a lot gets made of Cal's gameday coaching, and I don't think he's Self or Izzo or Wright, etc. with X's and O's. But, he has enough Final Fours and wins that it can't be questioned as a giant weak spot. It's all relative because of where he coaches and who he is compared to.

True, but a lot of his Xs and Os get exposed when he doesn't have 5 of the top 15 guys playing for him every year.

Now he's getting 5 of the top 50 guys and they are not as ready for college basketball at this level and they get exposed because he doesn't put them in the best places to succeed.