Kansas Crimson

pdub wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 11:04 am To hasbeen and jfish, there have only been 3 good seasons under Bill Self and 1 great one.
What a shitty fan experience.

You conveniently leave out one side of my point (which I've made clear over and over and over).

The Streak > an NCAA title.

And by more than one >.

The Streak will not happen again, which makes it unique, and it's cool to have unique things. True trump cards that no one else can play.

BUT - that's a double-edged sword. We're among the programs that will not beat the Streak.

So yes, from the moment the streak ended, Final Fours and NCAA titles have become, to me, the brass rings to be sought.

Would I rather have a NCAA title than a Big 12 title?
That's easy, yes.
If the NCAA tournament hasn't even started yet, do I want a Big 12 title?
That's easy, yes.
Is the NCAA tournament the sole reason of a team's success?
That's easy, no.

pdub wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:13 pm Would I rather have a NCAA title than a Big 12 title?
That's easy, yes.
If the NCAA tournament hasn't even started yet, do I want a Big 12 title?
That's easy, yes.
Is the NCAA tournament the sole reason of a team's success?
That's easy, no.

Again, you're misrepresenting my point to keep your teetering one balanced on its stilts.

I have never not once one time said that the NCAA tournament is the sole determinant of the team's success.

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 11:49 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 11:42 am

pdub wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 11:41 am I think we will sneak in as the last 1 seed actually.

Which is almost a bummer to me as I don't think Kansas is even remotely one of the four best teams in the country this year. It just makes it more of an "upset" when they lose.

This is peak KU/Roy fan: I don't want a 1-seed because I don't want to choke again.

I want a 1 seed every year.

But, I do think I'd rather get to be a 1 seed by actually being a top 4 team and consistently playing like it over being what looks more like a 3 seed but gets to be a 1 because of quad 1 wins, SOS, and other metrics.

More than anything, what I don't want is to be an underdog against a worse seeded team.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:19 pm

pdub wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:13 pm Would I rather have a NCAA title than a Big 12 title?
That's easy, yes.
If the NCAA tournament hasn't even started yet, do I want a Big 12 title?
That's easy, yes.
Is the NCAA tournament the sole reason of a team's success?
That's easy, no.

Again, you're misrepresenting my point to keep your teetering one balanced on its stilts.

I have never not once one time said that the NCAA tournament is the sole determinant of the team's success.

"Point is, I could give a shit about the league."
Weird way of saying it though.

For me, I just want to play the easiest team.
Usually if you're the 1 seed you play easier teams for the first two rounds.

pdub wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:20 pm

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:19 pm

pdub wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:13 pm Would I rather have a NCAA title than a Big 12 title?
That's easy, yes.
If the NCAA tournament hasn't even started yet, do I want a Big 12 title?
That's easy, yes.
Is the NCAA tournament the sole reason of a team's success?
That's easy, no.

Again, you're misrepresenting my point to keep your teetering one balanced on its stilts.

I have never not once one time said that the NCAA tournament is the sole determinant of the team's success.

"Point is, I could give a shit about the league."
Weird way of saying it though.

Taking things out of context, another in your bag of tricks.

I couldn't give a shit about the league in the context of a conversation about when to bring Remy back.

PhDhawk wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:19 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 11:49 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 11:42 am

Which is almost a bummer to me as I don't think Kansas is even remotely one of the four best teams in the country this year. It just makes it more of an "upset" when they lose.

This is peak KU/Roy fan: I don't want a 1-seed because I don't want to choke again.

I want a 1 seed every year.

But, I do think I'd rather get to be a 1 seed by actually being a top 4 team and consistently playing like it over being what looks more like a 3 seed but gets to be a 1 because of quad 1 wins, SOS, and other metrics.

More than anything, what I don't want is to be an underdog against a worse seeded team.

Sure, that makes sense. And, while it's not completely fool proof, generally, the worse seeded the opponent, the more likely you are to be favored against them. And, generally, the worse seeded a potential opponent is, the more likely they are to be upset before you meet them.

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:26 pm

PhDhawk wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:19 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 11:49 am

This is peak KU/Roy fan: I don't want a 1-seed because I don't want to choke again.

I want a 1 seed every year.

But, I do think I'd rather get to be a 1 seed by actually being a top 4 team and consistently playing like it over being what looks more like a 3 seed but gets to be a 1 because of quad 1 wins, SOS, and other metrics.

More than anything, what I don't want is to be an underdog against a worse seeded team.

Sure, that makes sense. And, while it's not completely fool proof, generally, the worse seeded the opponent, the more likely you are to be favored against them. And, generally, the worse seeded a potential opponent is, the more likely they are to be upset before you meet them.

My thinking has evolved a little on this over the years, due to the routine overseeding of power five teams (and attendant underseeding of midmajors). I personally feel that, most years, we're better-equipped for success against high-majors, so I'm not as strongly committed to the concept you're describing as I used to be.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:19 pm

pdub wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:13 pm Would I rather have a NCAA title than a Big 12 title?
That's easy, yes.
If the NCAA tournament hasn't even started yet, do I want a Big 12 title?
That's easy, yes.
Is the NCAA tournament the sole reason of a team's success?
That's easy, no.

I have never not once one time said that the NCAA tournament is the sole determinant of the team's success.

Right, that's me. pdub is so mad online that he's conflating different people.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:29 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:26 pm

PhDhawk wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:19 pm
I want a 1 seed every year.

But, I do think I'd rather get to be a 1 seed by actually being a top 4 team and consistently playing like it over being what looks more like a 3 seed but gets to be a 1 because of quad 1 wins, SOS, and other metrics.

More than anything, what I don't want is to be an underdog against a worse seeded team.

Sure, that makes sense. And, while it's not completely fool proof, generally, the worse seeded the opponent, the more likely you are to be favored against them. And, generally, the worse seeded a potential opponent is, the more likely they are to be upset before you meet them.

My thinking has evolved a little on this over the years, due to the routine overseeding of power five teams (and attendant underseeding of midmajors). I personally feel that, most years, we're better-equipped for success against high-majors, so I'm not as strongly committed to the concept you're describing as I used to be.

I think that what you're saying about overseeding/underseeding trends is probably largely true (although NET rankings should help that). But, your own seed is the only thing you can control.

I think for a program like Kansas, you want to majorly avoid the 4 and 5 seed.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:29 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:26 pm

PhDhawk wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:19 pm
I want a 1 seed every year.

But, I do think I'd rather get to be a 1 seed by actually being a top 4 team and consistently playing like it over being what looks more like a 3 seed but gets to be a 1 because of quad 1 wins, SOS, and other metrics.

More than anything, what I don't want is to be an underdog against a worse seeded team.

Sure, that makes sense. And, while it's not completely fool proof, generally, the worse seeded the opponent, the more likely you are to be favored against them. And, generally, the worse seeded a potential opponent is, the more likely they are to be upset before you meet them.

My thinking has evolved a little on this over the years, due to the routine overseeding of power five teams (and attendant underseeding of midmajors). I personally feel that, most years, we're better-equipped for success against high-majors, so I'm not as strongly committed to the concept you're describing as I used to be.

USC and Auburn say otherwise.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:23 pm I couldn't give a shit about the league in the context of a conversation about when to bring Remy back.

But
A. bringing Remy back a game early or a game late isn't likely going to make as much impact in the NCAA tournament as it would to winning the B12. If he's rusty, and we loose a game, maybe we stumble and don't win the league.
B. Not winning league means not having a top seed which influences our path to success in the NCAA tournament.
C. Saying you don't give a shit about the league leads one to believe you don't find it important. My bad if that's not the case.

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:32 pm

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:29 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:26 pm

Sure, that makes sense. And, while it's not completely fool proof, generally, the worse seeded the opponent, the more likely you are to be favored against them. And, generally, the worse seeded a potential opponent is, the more likely they are to be upset before you meet them.

My thinking has evolved a little on this over the years, due to the routine overseeding of power five teams (and attendant underseeding of midmajors). I personally feel that, most years, we're better-equipped for success against high-majors, so I'm not as strongly committed to the concept you're describing as I used to be.

I think that what you're saying about overseeding/underseeding trends is probably largely true (although NET rankings should help that). But, your own seed is the only thing you can control.

I think for a program like Kansas, you want to majorly avoid the 4 and 5 seed.

The problem is we've been doing this by, not playing any bad teams, relying on the Big12 not having any cellar dwellars, boosting our SOS, and having lots of Quad1 games. We know what the committee is looking for.

I'd rather control our seed by being a dominant team, not by gaming algorithms.

We did that in 2020.
Gonzaga might be that team this year but I'm not sure if anyone else is. Maybe Zona?
Kentucky just got spanked.

PhDhawk wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:36 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:32 pm

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:29 pm

My thinking has evolved a little on this over the years, due to the routine overseeding of power five teams (and attendant underseeding of midmajors). I personally feel that, most years, we're better-equipped for success against high-majors, so I'm not as strongly committed to the concept you're describing as I used to be.

I think that what you're saying about overseeding/underseeding trends is probably largely true (although NET rankings should help that). But, your own seed is the only thing you can control.

I think for a program like Kansas, you want to majorly avoid the 4 and 5 seed.

The problem is we've been doing this by, not playing any bad teams, relying on the Big12 not having any cellar dwellars, boosting our SOS, and having lots of Quad1 games. We know what the committee is looking for.

I'd rather control our seed by being a dominant team, not by gaming algorithms.

I think it's best that we both try and be as good as we can be AND schedule smartly, including playing bigtime non-con opponents, which we usually do.

pdub wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:34 pm

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 12:23 pm I couldn't give a shit about the league in the context of a conversation about when to bring Remy back.

But
A. bringing Remy back a game early or a game late isn't likely going to make as much impact in the NCAA tournament as it would to winning the B12. If he's rusty, and we loose a game, maybe we stumble and don't win the league.
B. Not winning league means not having a top seed which influences our path to success in the NCAA tournament.
C. Saying you don't give a shit about the league leads one to believe you don't find it important. My bad if that's not the case.

C is only true in the case of people who mistakenly, deliberately or are induced to take things out of context.

"My bad if that's not the case."

pdub wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 11:49 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 11:41 am

pdub wrote: ↑Wed Feb 16, 2022 11:30 am Meaning, test out the knee in game action.
Don't want to go completely cold into the NCAA tournament, especially not at point.

I just dont see any different between game action vs practice when it comes to something like this. Reps are reps from a physical standpoint. A joint can either hold up to x pounds of pressure or it can't.

This isn't quite true because there's a different game speed in real games than practice.
It's why you'll get more major injuries per minute in actual games.

I am sure that you just make that stat up. And Kansas has had far more injuries in practice than in games the last several years.

I did not.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2 ... 083932.htm
https://training-conditioning.com/artic ... mpetition/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1941286/