Who is the GOAT

[Deleted User 310]

You really like Tom Chambers.
In his peak year, he'd be the maybe the 50th best player in the NBA on a roster today.
NBA rosters just better now.

50th would maybe even be a stretch.

[PhDhawk]

You really like Tom Chambers.
In his peak year, he'd be the maybe the 50th best player in the NBA on a roster today.
NBA rosters just better now.

Tell that to Mark Jackson.

[Deleted User 289]

I'm not a Jordan-defender, but I've often considered the Portland team he beat to be possibly the best team to never win a title. That team was loaded with talent and made a couple finals.

The Lakers team they beat was not very good. Magic, and the next best player was Sam Perkins.

The Suns team with Chuck was VERY VERY good. Lots of talent on that team. Tom Chambers was on that team.

Seattle was a great team. For perspective Sam Perkins was only the 5th best player on that team.

The Jazz were pretty boring but had 2 HoFers on it. Plus Ostertag. But not a lot of depth.

I think you gave a very accurate assessment but......

The Lakers team they beat in 91 had Worthy, Byron Scott, and Vlade to go along with Magic (and Perkins). I'm not sure why you feel Perkins was their 2nd best player. I feel Worthy was easily their 2nd best player.

[pdub]

100+ players in the NBA today could jump from that spot on the court and dunk over 6 foot Marc Jackson.

[CrimsonNBlue]

91-92 Bulls could very well be greatest team ever.

Ya....but i still think those warriors teams beat them. So i go with the warriors as the best team ever.

The best Warriors team by far was the 2017 version when they were heads and shoulders above every team in the stronger west conference.

The 2017 Warriors had an ORtg of 115.6, which is the 2nd best mark in NBA history.

The 1992 Bulls had an ORtg of 115.5, which is the 3rd best mark in NBA history.

Def RTg: 17 Warriors 109.5, Bulls 104.5--Bulls significantly better.

And, then you get to choose between prime Jordan and prime Durant. Tough choice, I know.

[Deleted User 310]

Prime Jordan relative to who he played against is better than Prime Durant relative to who he played/plays against....but Prime Durant against 90s players would be the best player in the world at that time.

[CrimsonNBlue]

If prime Durant is better than prime Jordan, then Jordan must rank around #15 all time for you. It's a bold take, but kudos for not being afraid to say it.

[Deleted User 289]

You really like Tom Chambers.
In his peak year, he'd be the maybe the 50th best player in the NBA on a roster today.
NBA rosters just better now.

Chambers was a nice player. I refuse to try and even pretend to figure out how good or bad he would be in today's game.

One thing many fail to NOT give Chambers credit for is that he was an All-Star game MVP.
You know who else played in that game?
Magic
Hakeem
Kareem
Bird
Michael Jordan
Dominique
Barkley
Dr. J
Isiah
Moses
Just to name a few.
At least for one night, in an exhibition game, Tom Chambers was a fucking stud.

Other things of note. Take them for what they are worth.
88-89 season Chambers finished 9th in league MVP voting.
89-90 season Chambers finished 8th in league MVP voting.

[pdub]

Bulls playing against easier teams ( 17 NBA rosters >> 92 NBA rosters ) which inflates or diminishes said stats.

92 Bulls weren't the 3rd best team on offense in NBA history.

[pdub]

Other things of note. Take them for what they are worth.
88-89 season Chambers finished 9th in league MVP voting.
89-90 season Chambers finished 8th in league MVP voting.

Only proving my argument of rosters now v rosters then.

[PhDhawk]

I'm not a Jordan-defender, but I've often considered the Portland team he beat to be possibly the best team to never win a title. That team was loaded with talent and made a couple finals.

The Lakers team they beat was not very good. Magic, and the next best player was Sam Perkins.

The Suns team with Chuck was VERY VERY good. Lots of talent on that team. Tom Chambers was on that team.

Seattle was a great team. For perspective Sam Perkins was only the 5th best player on that team.

The Jazz were pretty boring but had 2 HoFers on it. Plus Ostertag. But not a lot of depth.

I think you gave a very accurate assessment but......

The Lakers team they beat in 91 had Worthy, Byron Scott, and Vlade to go along with Magic (and Perkins). I'm not sure why you feel Perkins was their 2nd best player. I feel Worthy was easily their 2nd best player.

Perkins was a better rebounder, more blocks, slightly more efficient shooter.

That team was Magic....then a big gap to the next guy. I'd have Perkins then Worthy, Scott, Divac. ymmv

[pdub]

Jordan > Durant for sure.
But Durant's PER matched Jordan's that season ( against tougher competition ).
It's Steph and Thompson that I think would create nightmares for the Bulls.

Horace Grant isn't making waves in todays NBA - I think 16-17 Draymond wouldn't have an issue.

I think the Warriors could win 4 of 7.
I think the Bulls could win 4 of 7.

[Deleted User 89]

nice math skills there, bud

[Deleted User 310]

If prime Durant is better than prime Jordan, then Jordan must rank around #15 all time for you. It's a bold take, but kudos for not being afraid to say it.

That is not what i am saying....i am saying if prime durant had played in the 80s/90s he would have been the best player in the world (other than maybe MJ). Like a better Larry Bird. Durant in the 80s/90s would have been almost unstoppable for even the best defenders on most teams. Todays competition is way better imo.

I have MJ ranked #1 all time imo. LeBron #2....Durant not near the top 10 at this point.

[CrimsonNBlue]

If prime Durant is better than prime Jordan, then Jordan must rank around #15 all time for you. It's a bold take, but kudos for not being afraid to say it.

That is not what i am saying....i am saying if prime durant had played in the 80s/90s he would have been the best player in the world (other than maybe MJ). Like a better Larry Bird. Durant in the 80s/90s would have been almost unstoppable for even the best defenders on most teams. Todays competition is way better imo.

I have MJ ranked #1 all time imo. LeBron #2....Durant not near the top 10 at this point.

Prime Durant was the 2nd best player in the world in the 2010's. A top 15ish player all time. He would dominate the 80's and 90's players like he dominated the 2010's players. His talent was on par with pretty much every perimeter player in the history of the game.

This is not a good point.

[pdub]

nice math skills there, bud

4 of 7 meaning - either team could win a 7 game series.
It would be close - no clear favorite.

[pdub]

Peak Durant's numbers in the 90's would be a bit better.
Maybe:
35 PPG, 5.5 APG, 8.5 RPG, 2 BPG, 53%FG, 41%3FG for a peak season.

Those numbers, of course, could compare with Jordan's.

[Deleted User 310]

If prime Durant is better than prime Jordan, then Jordan must rank around #15 all time for you. It's a bold take, but kudos for not being afraid to say it.

That is not what i am saying....i am saying if prime durant had played in the 80s/90s he would have been the best player in the world (other than maybe MJ). Like a better Larry Bird. Durant in the 80s/90s would have been almost unstoppable for even the best defenders on most teams. Todays competition is way better imo.

I have MJ ranked #1 all time imo. LeBron #2....Durant not near the top 10 at this point.

Prime Durant was the 2nd best player in the world in the 2010's. A top 15ish player all time. He would dominate the 80's and 90's players like he dominated the 2010's players. His talent was on par with pretty much every perimeter player in the history of the game.

This is not a good point.

In all of the 2010's?

He was not a consensus top 2 player in all of those years in todays NBA imo.

The same (top 2) has been said in a given year about Steph, Kawhi, Giannis, LeBron (obviously), maybe AD, maybe Rose for a season as a top 2 player...now we have Doncic who i think is already the 1st or 2nd best player in the world. I absolutely think an argument can be made in some of those years that KD is/was top 2....but not each year for the entire decade.

KD has only has 1 MVP so far.

It is just much more stacked in today's NBA. Nobody else would be close to him in the 80s/90s other than Jordan imo.

Either way....i still think the warriors team with Steph Klay KD and Draymond would beat the 91 Bulls.

[Deleted User 89]

nice math skills there, bud

4 of 7 meaning - either team could win a 7 game series.
It would be close - no clear favorite.

i know, just giving you shit

[CrimsonNBlue]

That is not what i am saying....i am saying if prime durant had played in the 80s/90s he would have been the best player in the world (other than maybe MJ). Like a better Larry Bird. Durant in the 80s/90s would have been almost unstoppable for even the best defenders on most teams. Todays competition is way better imo.

I have MJ ranked #1 all time imo. LeBron #2....Durant not near the top 10 at this point.

Prime Durant was the 2nd best player in the world in the 2010's. A top 15ish player all time. He would dominate the 80's and 90's players like he dominated the 2010's players. His talent was on par with pretty much every perimeter player in the history of the game.

This is not a good point.

In all of the 2010's?

He was not a consensus top 2 player in all of those years in todays NBA imo.

The same (top 2) has been said in a given year about Steph, Kawhi, Giannis, LeBron (obviously), maybe AD, maybe Rose for a season as a top 2 player...now we have Doncic who i think is already the 1st or 2nd best player in the world. I absolutely think an argument can be made in some of those years that KD is/was top 2....but not each year for the entire decade.

KD has only has 1 MVP so far.

It is just much more stacked in today's NBA. Nobody else would be close to him in the 80s/90s other than Jordan imo.

Either way....i still think the warriors team with Steph Klay KD and Draymond would beat the 91 Bulls.

The talent pool today is deeper, no doubt. But, that doesn't necessarily mean it's better ball. Much more nuanced. And, as always, only 10 guys can step on the court.


The best part about this: The 91-92 Bulls being the best ever Jordan team is a minority opinion.