Kansas Crimson

Vonte, Rozier, Ball.
Only two of the three will make it out with major minutes.
Let's hope it Vonte and Rozier - can't root for that family.

PhDhawk wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 5:54 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 11:37 am

Grandma wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 5:52 am Nice to see Wiggins doing what Wiggins can do. I'm telling you, I think Kerr is a great coach for him.

He took over in the 4th, and yeah, it's frustrating as hell that he doesn't do it all the time, which he is capable.

But, if you want to be glass half full, this was only like his 5th game ever playing next to Steph. Maybe they'll get it clicking.

Not sure what everyone's rush is to close the door on Wiggins career as a warrior..or this trade...or his career overall.

Because narratives and being mad about the Stanford game are more fun, I guess.

I don't think it's so much of closing the door on his career as it is accepting the type of player he is and will be. I don't see a ton of people saying he's a complete bust or doesn't deserve to be in the league. There's definitely a lot worse players who have made loads of money above what their production warranted.

I think where the door is being closed is on the hope of him being a career all-star/face of a franchise type superstar you associate with a #1 overall pick that was as hyped as he was. Over 6 years, he hasn't exactly shown much improvement. I don't know what thread it was, but someone posted a Top 10 plays of his 2019-20 season and I said all of those plays were also seen on his high school highlight tapes. If something works and can't be guarded, sure, stick with it, but there's also something to be said about not added anything to your game over the better part of a decade.

How long should someone wait before a narrative becomes a fact and just the way it is?

I think Wiggins still is young enough to improve but yes, he's not a franchise superstar nor will he ever be.
And that's fine.
While I don't see him making an All Star game in his career, I do see him being a top 100 player year in year out.

Sigh.

There was a time we KU fans were so high on the kid we thought he was the next Lebron.

But now, even we are resigned.

It sucks that Wiggins himself seems to think, meh I’ll just eek my way to being a top 100 player, who cares if I never make an all star game, that’s fine

Right on cue.

NDballer13 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 31, 2020 10:15 am I don't think it's so much of closing the door on his career as it is accepting the type of player he is and will be. I don't see a ton of people saying he's a complete bust or doesn't deserve to be in the league. There's definitely a lot worse players who have made loads of money above what their production warranted.

I think where the door is being closed is on the hope of him being a career all-star/face of a franchise type superstar you associate with a #1 overall pick that was as hyped as he was. Over 6 years, he hasn't exactly shown much improvement. I don't know what thread it was, but someone posted a Top 10 plays of his 2019-20 season and I said all of those plays were also seen on his high school highlight tapes. If something works and can't be guarded, sure, stick with it, but there's also something to be said about not added anything to your game over the better part of a decade.

How long should someone wait before a narrative becomes a fact and just the way it is?

Ummmmm......


More than 16 games.

Wiggins is 25. The Thib era was a waste.

Look at Steph Curry, he didn't make an all star team until he was 25, and became a truly great player after turning 27.

I'm just going to watch and enjoy his career. Not sure how it benefits anyone to put him in a box 1/3 of the way through his career.

I think you can be a fan of a player but also wish he would realize his potential. We’re talking about competitive greatness here, for a kid with exceptional natural gifts even by nba standards.

Heck, imagine if Self had that mentality.

“Yeah maybe could win a conference championship every year, but I’m sure it’ll be fine if we just squeeze by with a finish in the top half of the league.”

I always think of guys like Z Bo, a OAD player who didn't make an All-Star team until his 9th season. Or Jermaine O'Neal, HS to NBA player who didn't make an all-star team until his 6th season and then rattled off 6 straight. O'Neal is probably not a HOFer but closer than you'd think and has better numbers than some guys that are in.

Different era, but just shows that players can have different paths.

Right, but the difference with those guys and Wiggins is they weren't even lottery picks, let alone #1. They weren't hyped up by any and everyone as the next great player of the generation.

I agree with you guys that Wiggins still has a lot of basketball ahead of him. He's got another 10+ years of high level play in him, but there's a big gap between closing the door on him being a face of the franchise player who is in the elite of the elite and closing the door on his career.

I'm eager to be surprised - but ND is right - coming into college he was hyped, then was the number 1 pick - and he's currently maybe the 3rd best player on his team - and if Klay was healthy, he might be 4th.

And I don't see the progression in his game/career ( in fact, his best season was probably his third, and since then he's regressed slightly ) yet to where I see an All Star track. He's young still. It could happen.

NDballer13 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 31, 2020 11:22 am Right, but the difference with those guys and Wiggins is they weren't even lottery picks, let alone #1. They weren't hyped up by any and everyone as the next great player of the generation.

I agree with you guys that Wiggins still has a lot of basketball ahead of him. He's got another 10+ years of high level play in him, but there's a big gap between closing the door on him being a face of the franchise player who is in the elite of the elite and closing the door on his career.

That's a problem with the hot take sports fans these days fueled by daytime shows and twitter. You either do what LeBron did or you're a disappointment. If you're not Mahomes, then you're a shitty quarterback that shouldn't get a dime.

But again, as crazy as it sounds, I dunno if it’s entirely unfair to expect him to “do what Lebron did,” considering he’s been drawing comparisons to just that guy since he was like 13.

There’s a handful of stars good enough to expect their team to win on any given night, just cuz that guy is on the team.

Why can’t we expect that from Wiggins?

You wanna argue he doesn’t have the talent?

Does anyone feel that confident the could have/could go to a wolves/dubs game and think, don’t worry, Maple Jordan’s got this.

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Thu Dec 31, 2020 12:53 pm

NDballer13 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 31, 2020 11:22 am Right, but the difference with those guys and Wiggins is they weren't even lottery picks, let alone #1. They weren't hyped up by any and everyone as the next great player of the generation.

I agree with you guys that Wiggins still has a lot of basketball ahead of him. He's got another 10+ years of high level play in him, but there's a big gap between closing the door on him being a face of the franchise player who is in the elite of the elite and closing the door on his career.

That's a problem with the hot take sports fans these days fueled by daytime shows and twitter. You either do what LeBron did or you're a disappointment. If you're not Mahomes, then you're a shitty quarterback that shouldn't get a dime.

Absolutely agree. It also seems to be the higher you're drafted, the quicker people are to write you off. Dwayne Haskins is a perfect example there. You have to wonder if he would still be on the roster if he was a 5th round pick, compared to a 1st round pick expected to compete for a starting spot as soon as he steps in the building. He gets cut and all of a sudden he's the next Jamarcus Russell and is career is over. Good luck in the 3rd XFL reboot, kid.

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Thu Dec 31, 2020 12:53 pm That's a problem with the hot take sports fans these days fueled by daytime shows and twitter. You either do what LeBron did or you're a disappointment. If you're not Mahomes, then you're a shitty quarterback that shouldn't get a dime.

If you are referring to the people on the thread talking 'down' on Wiggins, I don't think we're saying he's a disappointment. Just that he hasn't lived up to the hype that came with him, justified or not. He's a good player. Just not an All Star. That's OK.

I went through and compared Kobe Bryant's career statistics to Wiggs. and if you look at them year by year there isn't a whole ton of difference in age 19-25. They both shot a very similar 2pt and 3pt percentage, had high usage rates and comparable numbers all across the board (pts, rbs, ast, stl, blk, all of it.)

about age 23/24 kobe started to really come on strong, but thats when wiggins was dealing with tibbs and a very disfunctional minnesota organization and a trade. he's shown the ability to take over games and close out 4th quarters against people.

Let's see what wiggins does the next 6 years. lates 20s/early 30s. sky is still the limit

Yeah, cuz Kobe would have also been cool with passively standing there and letting Marty Frankamp take the last shot against Stanford

ousdahl wrote: ↑Thu Dec 31, 2020 5:28 pm Yeah, cuz Kobe would have also been cool with passively standing there and letting Marty Frankamp take the last shot against Stanford

Starting to feel like a personal vendetta.

Gross.

Kobes 5th year in the league he was averaging 28.5, 5.9 and 5.

What?