Kansas Crimson

Harden has until Wednesday to decide on player option for next season. 47.4mil. Yuck.

I can't see a scenario where Curry legitimately enters the GOAT conversation but if he wins a 5th title he has to be a strong consideration for Top 10 all-time.

Cascadia wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 2:15 pm I can't see a scenario where Curry legitimately enters the GOAT conversation but if he wins a 5th title he has to be a strong consideration for Top 10 all-time.

Just awfully hard to decide who he knocks out.

Cascadia wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 2:15 pm I can't see a scenario where Curry legitimately enters the GOAT conversation but if he wins a 5th title he has to be a strong consideration for Top 10 all-time.

For me, the 5th title would need to be paired with a no-doubt-about-it Finals MVP award to be included in that conversation.

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 2:24 pm

Cascadia wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 2:15 pm I can't see a scenario where Curry legitimately enters the GOAT conversation but if he wins a 5th title he has to be a strong consideration for Top 10 all-time.

For me, the 5th title would need to be paired with a no-doubt-about-it Finals MVP award to be included in that conversation.

No particular order

6 - Jordan
2 - Wilt
6 - Kareem
3 - Bird
5 - Magic
4 - Shaq
5 - Kobe
5 - Duncan
4 - LeBron
11 - Russell

Cascadia wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 2:39 pm

CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 2:24 pm

Cascadia wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 2:15 pm I can't see a scenario where Curry legitimately enters the GOAT conversation but if he wins a 5th title he has to be a strong consideration for Top 10 all-time.

For me, the 5th title would need to be paired with a no-doubt-about-it Finals MVP award to be included in that conversation.

No particular order

6 - Jordan
2 - Wilt
6 - Kareem
3 - Bird
5 - Magic
4 - Shaq
5 - Kobe
5 - Duncan
4 - LeBron
11 - Russell

All have 2+ Finals MVP's except Wilt and Russell because it wasn't awarded back then.

I'd also have Olajuwon and Durant over him as it currently stands.

@CnB, I don’t disagree but still think a 5th ring puts him in the conversation. I don’t think he’s in that conversation today.

Agreed.

For me, 5 titles and 2 Finals MVP's, you're absolutely in the convo. You probably shut the door, really.

If the 5th title is like when he's 42 and the 13th man, different story for me then.

And of course, this all goes to say, let's see what happens.

Durant could certainly end up with 4 Finals MVP's.

What if Kawhi gets hot and has 3 or 4 Finals MVP's?

The truth here, I think, is that Top 10 seemed to be so prestigious, but there are just so many great performances now that Top 20-25 is going to be seen as the elite of the elite.

It's just hard to put together lists with active players. James clearly is Top 10 because of the volume of stats and rings he has accumulated but none of the other current guys are easy to slot in there until they are done.

@CnB - Agree that Top 20-25 will soon be (if not already) seen as the elite of the elite.

@twocoach - Agree that careers need to play out and this recent conversation ponders Curry getting a 5th ring

——-

But I think Top 10-12 will be reserved for players who have both individual and team accolades. Wilt and Russell are the two exceptions but they have extreme accolades in 1 of the 2.

That’s why guys like Hakeem, Dr. J, Malone and others just miss the list. I think Durant might end up with that 2nd tier if he wins 1 or less more titles. Not sure how much credit he’ll get for the 2 in GS considering they won before and after him.

i’m sure it’s been said and argued about before, but i wonder how inflated the individual stats of modern players are due to their not having played as much, or at all, in college

bron has several years of pro productivity that Wilt was never allowed

Well, that’s why I don’t consider career totals to be that meaningful.

Career totals are meaningful.
I'd put them above titles otherwise you got your Horry's, Fishers and Coopers.
Health and longevity is important.

illustrative of the notion that all of the metrics need to be taken with a grain of salt and looked at within their own contexts and timeframes

with a sport that is 3/4 of a century old that has seen a bunch of rule changes through the years, you can’t really directly compare many of the stats and accolades, whether they’re individual- or team-based

jmo

I feel like you can, to an extent, after the advent of the 3 point shot.

pdub wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 9:46 am I feel like you can, to an extent, after the advent of the 3 point shot.

that’s definitely a defining rule

i was going to counter that with the 3 second rule, but it was adopted long before it would’ve mattered for this discussion (1936)

Westbrook opts in to his 47+ million salary ( duh ) this year.

That is 3rd highest in the NBA.
Westbrook was 151st in PER last season.

Kudos to his agent (and the Wasserman group).
The not so funny thing is how Pelinka has basically gone from being the flavor of the year (2020 Championship) to being just another foolish (and shitty?) GM.

James Harden and Bradley Beal both declined their player options and will become free agents. I am surprised by Harden as I dont see him making that much on the free agent market but maybe I am wrong.

Also, the Hawks traded for Spurs All Star Dejounte Murray. Nice pick up for them. Spurs get Danilo Gallinari and 3 first round picks ('23, '25 and '27)

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/341 ... -gallinari