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Re: Vick
Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:07 pm
by pdub
I knew you were going to say that.
It's pointless arguing with you.
I don't know how I get drawn in, like driving by a car accident.
Re: Vick
Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:09 pm
by Deleted User 75
Re: Vick
Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:46 pm
by Mjl
pdub wrote: ↑Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:07 pm
I knew you were going to say that.
It's pointless arguing with you.
I don't know how I get drawn in, like driving by a car accident.
That's why I put him on ignore. I can't tell if it's intellectual dishonesty, plain old stupidity, or more likely both.
Re: Vick
Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:47 pm
by Mjl
And I am curious as to which stats jfish would want you to bring up...
Re: Vick
Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 9:14 pm
by Deleted User 75
Mjl wrote: ↑Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:46 pm
pdub wrote: ↑Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:07 pm
I knew you were going to say that.
It's pointless arguing with you.
I don't know how I get drawn in, like driving by a car accident.
That's why I put him on ignore. I can't tell if it's intellectual dishonesty, plain old stupidity, or more likely both.
To point out Bragg got kicked off the team?
Wtf are you even talking about. LOL
Re: Vick
Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 9:44 pm
by DrPepper
I use ‘ignore’ and I don’t think I miss anything I care about. In other words, threads still read perfectly.
The only thing that still sucks is that I check threads for new posts, but the new post(s) is from the person I have on ignore. That is a small price to pay.
Re: Vick
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 7:29 am
by twocoach
pdub wrote: ↑Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:29 pm
"glass-half full statistical summaries"
PPG. FG%. 3FG%.
Glass-half full.
I'll be sure to remember that whenever JFish or CnB uses any of those metrics as an argument, that they are simply using glass-half full statistical summaries.
Agreed. The voices saying we are better without Vick wont claim the same if Agbaji and Dotson don't continue to have career nights every night and the three point shooting goes cold.
This team needs capable bodies especially one that can shoot a three. Plug Vick back in off the bench instead of Moore. He is a huge upgrade in that role.
Re: Vick
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:14 am
by Deleted User 75
What if the other players don't want Vick on the team anymore?
And LOL @ anyone thinking Vick would buy in to coming off the bench in a support role...I just don't see that happening.
Re: Vick
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:18 am
by TDub
dammit. Did you guys chase off hawklin again?
Re: Vick
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:20 am
by Deleted User 75
He's lurking and occasionally posting. Avoiding the nonsense that inevitably transpires is my guess.
Re: Vick
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:08 am
by jfish26
Mjl wrote: ↑Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:47 pm
And I am curious as to which stats jfish would want you to bring up...
Well I'm sort of stuck - I'm told that PPG, FG% and 3FG% matter (despite their flaws), but that other flawed stats (like +/-) don't matter. I can't quickly find a source for things like game-by-game win probability added, to demonstrate (or disprove!) a recent decline.
Absent ShotTracker and similar data, I can't demonstrate (or disprove!) that Vick is playing with low energy, and that the ball (and our offense) sticks when he's on the floor.
Which is all
sort of the point of cherry-picking the checkers-level stats to say he's a good player right now.
Re: Vick
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:10 am
by CrimsonNBlue
IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:14 amAnd LOL @ anyone thinking Vick would buy in to coming off the bench in a support role
Vick doesn't hold any cards right now.
Re: Vick
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:14 am
by Deleted User 75
CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:10 am
IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:14 amAnd LOL @ anyone thinking Vick would buy in to coming off the bench in a support role
Vick doesn't hold any cards right now.
But if he's not going to buy in and it's going to cause a distraction then why even bring him back.
Re: Vick
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:16 am
by CrimsonNBlue
IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:14 am
CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:10 am
IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:14 amAnd LOL @ anyone thinking Vick would buy in to coming off the bench in a support role
Vick doesn't hold any cards right now.
But if he's not going to buy in and it's going to cause a distraction then why even bring him back.
You don't.
You're now arguing two different things. I'm saying it's likely that Vick will yet again have conditions on any return to the team. He either accepts them or he doesn't. And, not accepting them is pretty dangerous for his career/life at this point.
Re: Vick
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:16 am
by Deleted User 75
jfish26 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:08 am
Mjl wrote: ↑Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:47 pm
And I am curious as to which stats jfish would want you to bring up...
Well I'm sort of stuck - I'm told that PPG, FG% and 3FG% matter (despite their flaws), but that other flawed stats (like +/-) don't matter. I can't quickly find a source for things like game-by-game win probability added, to demonstrate (or disprove!) a recent decline.
Absent ShotTracker and similar data, I can't demonstrate (or disprove!) that Vick is playing with low energy, and that the ball (and our offense) sticks when he's on the floor.
Which is all
sort of the point of cherry-picking the checkers-level stats to say he's a good player right now.
There's video is Steve Kerr discussing +/- with Steph Curry during a game....
Kerr says "I know you're not shooting well, but look at your +/-, you impact the game in so many ways, keep plugging away, don't worry about the shots not falling, you do so much for us when you're out there"
If Kerr is looking at +/- during a game then I tend to think it's at least somewhat worthwhile.
Re: Vick
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:18 am
by Deleted User 75
CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:16 am
IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:14 am
CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:10 am
Vick doesn't hold any cards right now.
But if he's not going to buy in and it's going to cause a distraction then why even bring him back.
You don't.
You're now arguing two different things. I'm saying it's likely that Vick will yet again have conditions on any return to the team. He either accepts them or he doesn't. And, not accepting them is pretty dangerous for his career/life at this point.
I'm not arguing with you.
My guess, Self isn't going to lay out more "terms and conditions" in mid February after not even wanting him back in the first place...he failed at his original terms and conditions to return in the 1st place quite possible (if this isn't truly a personal issue).
If it's not a personal issue, then the ride is over.
We will probably never know the truth.
Re: Vick
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:22 am
by CrimsonNBlue
Bruh, you can't follow anything.
Your original statement: "And LOL @ anyone thinking Vick would buy in to coming off the bench in a support role."
It's exhausting.
Re: Vick
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:23 am
by Deleted User 75
Vick ain't coming back to be a bench player.
He just won't come back. He's not going anywhere but overseas regardless.
Is that better?
I have no idea what you want my opinion or response to be.
It's either a personal issue and he'll come back to his normal role, or its not and he was sent home in a media friendly way.
Re: Vick
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:27 am
by chiknbut
CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:10 am
IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:14 amAnd LOL @ anyone thinking Vick would buy in to coming off the bench in a support role
Vick doesn't hold any cards right now.
Exactly. It's very possible in the coming weeks Vick will approach Self about re-joining the team. I'm sure Self will tell Vick that he's welcome as long as he has the support of his teammates.
They may want him, they may not. But the Soap Opera that has been Vick is pretty much neutralized. The team is playing well without him. At this point the only thing he has to offer is as a long-range shooter off the bench. If he doesn't accept it, bye, good luck and thanks.
Re: Vick
Posted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:31 am
by CrimsonNBlue
chiknbut wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:27 am
CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 9:10 am
IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:14 amAnd LOL @ anyone thinking Vick would buy in to coming off the bench in a support role
Vick doesn't hold any cards right now.
Exactly. It's very possible in the coming weeks Vick will approach Self about re-joining the team. I'm sure Self will tell Vick that he's welcome as long as he has the support of his teammates.
They may want him, they may not. But the Soap Opera that has been Vick is pretty much neutralized. The team is playing well without him. At this point the only thing he has to offer is as a long-range shooter off the bench. If he doesn't accept it, bye, good luck and thanks.
Chikn gets it!
