Kansas Crimson

The NFL SHOULD be accountable to the public who pay their bills.

pdub wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 11:01 am The NFL SHOULD be accountable to the public who pay their bills.

Ah, the old "we pay your salary" thing. That always goes so well for the public when we cry for more accountability from our politicians, law enforcement, etc..

twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 11:02 am

pdub wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 11:01 am The NFL SHOULD be accountable to the public who pay their bills.

Ah, the old "we pay your salary" thing. That always goes so well for the public when we cry for more accountability from our politicians, law enforcement, etc..

God, man, i'm not saying how things are, i know how things are, I am saying how things should be.
0's and 1's is all you see.
"That is not what is happening now therefore it does no good to talk about it." - you must be fun at parties.

Chiefs fans, myself included, are RIGHTFULLY upset that officiating in the last two games has been wildly unbalanced in key situations which have resulted in not having chances to win those games. That's all we are saying. And it's true. It's not ( at least not from me/most of us ) "the refs are in it against the Chiefs and have a grand conspiracy to prevent us from winning" ( though maybe Cheffers is ) it's, "man have the officials done a shitty job these last two games and it's likely affected the score in our opponents favor". That's it!

We aren't talking about officiating over the course of this season ( though it's related ). We aren't talking about officiating over the course of NFL history. We aren't talking about how other teams get screwed by calls throughout the season at different points in time. We aren't talking about how poorly the Chiefs have played in these two games. We understand all this.

We are talking about these last two particular games and how we got unfairly officiated in important moments.

pdub wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 11:20 am We are talking about these last two particular games and how we got unfairly officiated in important moments.

^^^ And those calls definitely affected the outcomes of those two games.

as in any sport or game, when the story becomes about the officiating there’s a problem

officials/refs should only ever be an afterthought

pdub wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 11:04 am

twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 11:02 am

pdub wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 11:01 am The NFL SHOULD be accountable to the public who pay their bills.

Ah, the old "we pay your salary" thing. That always goes so well for the public when we cry for more accountability from our politicians, law enforcement, etc..

God, man, i'm not saying how things are, i know how things are, I am saying how things should be.
0's and 1's is all you see.
"That is not what is happening now therefore it does no good to talk about it." - you must be fun at parties.

Most people I party with don't sit around and whine about all the horrible things that happen to them. Yes, I am definitely not a lot of fun at a pity party.

But we're definitely all in agreement that refs suck and that it sucks when our teams get burned by their inconsistency. Hopefully we either start playing well enough that their shitty call at a key time doesn't hurt us bad enough to lose a game like we have in a few past games, we avoid getting a shitty call made that hurts us at a key time like we have in a lot of past games, or we benefit from the shitty call like we have in a few past games.

AlOerter wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 11:40 am

pdub wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 11:20 am We are talking about these last two particular games and how we got unfairly officiated in important moments.

^^^ And those calls definitely affected the outcomes of those two games.

To be fair, Buffalo would have had more than a minute left and three timeouts. We don't know that it definitely affected the outcome. It most likely did as KC would have been up 4 vs. 3 when KC needed just 13 seconds to drive for their infamous tying kick that got them to OT but that's a decent amount of time with 3 TOs in pocket.

Imagine you're at a party full of Chiefs fans a few days after the game grabbing a drink and some guy goes, "jeez has the officiating been bad in these last two games -- the non called DPI, maybe even two honestly, two games ago, and then the when is this ever called offensive offsides just this last game that cost us one of the most memorable plays in Chiefs history".

Do you say:
A. "Yea, woof. The officials really have blown it recently. Hopefully that doesn't happen again this Sunday."

or

B. "Line up onside. It is quite literally the easiest thing to do on a football field. Every fan base in every sport has a list of games that they feel they lost due to the shitty, erratic and/ inconsistent performance by the referees. It's part of every sport that has refs. Oh, and video replay shows that Von Miller was NOT offsides on the next play. People are assuming he is based off of a screen shot from a weird angle. Oh, also, Buffalo would have had more than a minute left and three timeouts. We don't know that it definitely affected the outcome. It most likely did as KC would have been up 4 vs. 3 when KC needed just 13 seconds to drive for their infamous tying kick that got them to OT but that's a decent amount of time with 3 TOs in pocket."

pdub wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 11:52 am Imagine you're at a party full of Chiefs fans a few days after the game grabbing a drink and some guy goes, "jeez has the officiating been bad in these last two games -- the non called DPI, maybe even two honestly, two games ago, and then the when is this ever called offensive offsides just this last game that cost us one of the most memorable plays in Chiefs history".

Do you say:
A. "Yea, woof. The officials really have blown it recently. Hopefully that doesn't happen again this Sunday."

or

B. "Line up onside. It is quite literally the easiest thing to do on a football field. Every fan base in every sport has a list of games that they feel they lost due to the shitty, erratic and/ inconsistent performance by the referees. It's part of every sport that has refs. Oh, and video replay shows that Von Miller was NOT offsides on the next play. People are assuming he is based off of a screen shot from a weird angle."

I would say "Yea, woof. The officials really have blown it recently. Hopefully that doesn't happen again this Sunday." because it's a party designed for one-time interactions of a max of a few fun hours not a message board forum designed to have more nuanced, potentially multi-day conversation.

"nuanced"

A word that you might not quite understand.

"Our restaurant got a B rating this week because of some ticky tacky violations that very rarely get written up."

"Restaurants all over New York get called for violations that are subjective."

"Right. We get that. We are specifically talking about our restaurant, this week."

"You should follow the rules. Simple as that."

"No, we understand that technically we are getting docked for something on this list, but we are specifically saying that it is very unusual to get written up for these minor violations, usually you'll just get a warning. And we think it's shitty and unfair."

"Remind me not to attend your pity parties."

"But we're definitely all in agreement that refs suck and that it sucks when our teams get burned by their inconsistency. Hopefully we either start playing well enough that their shitty call at a key time doesn't hurt us bad enough to lose a game like we have in a few past games, we avoid getting a shitty call made that hurts us at a key time like we have in a lot of past games, or we benefit from the shitty call like we have in a few past games."

OK, we're on to something here, almost there.
Just say, "the refs have sucked more so than usual these last two games in favor of our opponents and it's likely affected the outcome of the games" without the "BUT......." and we are there.
That's all we are trying to say.

I was watching some old Chiefs games on Youtube from the 60-90s. Lining up a little forward of the ball is not a new thing--just estimating when you are the direct LOS WR. Never called. Which supports what Reid's numbers say.
What pisses me off is that the refs are flagging the Chiefs at about twice the total of their opponents this year and have been stalling drives religiously in the red zone and within scoring distances. That seems contrived--especially holding calls. The fact that they waited to flag Toney until it mattered was what reminded me of the Pine Tar game. Let Brett use the bat until you can turn the outcome of a game. He had the same bat for numerous series.

Whoa. Selective memory there, Sparko. The umpires were oblivious to the pine tar infraction until Billy Martin (fucking Yankees) pointed it out to the ump. Brett was called out. Yankees won the game.

I thought the reference to the pine tar instance was the steaming hot player being held back by his team.

DrPepper wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 1:21 pm Whoa. Selective memory there, Sparko. The umpires were oblivious to the pine tar infraction until Billy Martin (fucking Yankees) pointed it out to the ump. Brett was called out. Yankees won the game.

I thought the reference to the pine tar instance was the steaming hot player being held back by his team.

To be clear, which I wasn't, Martin waited until it was advantageous in the Pine Tar game. He waited thru at least one road series. The umpires were unconcerned then let Martin make a big deal of it. And the anger was the same too.

DrPepper wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 1:21 pm Whoa. Selective memory there, Sparko. The umpires were oblivious to the pine tar infraction until Billy Martin (fucking Yankees) pointed it out to the ump. Brett was called out. Yankees won the game.

I thought the reference to the pine tar instance was the steaming hot player being held back by his team.

Speaking of selective memories....
The Yankees did NOT win the game.

But it spoiled the moment and season. Hoping the rando offisides enforcement game doesn't sink the chiefs

RainbowsandUnicorns wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 4:54 pm

DrPepper wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 1:21 pm Whoa. Selective memory there, Sparko. The umpires were oblivious to the pine tar infraction until Billy Martin (fucking Yankees) pointed it out to the ump. Brett was called out. Yankees won the game.

I thought the reference to the pine tar instance was the steaming hot player being held back by his team.

Speaking of selective memories....
The Yankees did NOT win the game.

The Yankees won the game that day.
What was NOT the same between the Pine Tar Game and the Chief's last game was that MLB reversed calling Brett out, and so they replayed the end of the Pine Tar Game on another day. On that day the Royals won. I was 5 years old at the time (but do remember it).

It was a crushing blow at the time. And anti-climatic by the time Quisenberry got the save. Billy Martin. Sigh

DrPepper wrote: ↑Fri Dec 15, 2023 9:15 am

RainbowsandUnicorns wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 4:54 pm

DrPepper wrote: ↑Thu Dec 14, 2023 1:21 pm Whoa. Selective memory there, Sparko. The umpires were oblivious to the pine tar infraction until Billy Martin (fucking Yankees) pointed it out to the ump. Brett was called out. Yankees won the game.

I thought the reference to the pine tar instance was the steaming hot player being held back by his team.

Speaking of selective memories....
The Yankees did NOT win the game.

The Yankees won the game that day.
What was NOT the same between the Pine Tar Game and the Chief's last game was that MLB reversed calling Brett out, and so they replayed the end of the Pine Tar Game on another day. On that day the Royals won. I was 5 years old at the time (but do remember it).

Correct on all accounts!