Kansas Crimson

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 10:36 pm Ok. So the "whole new level" means what?

See that post, it's explained there.

I have a problem with all the other President's pardoning the undeserved. But he took it to another level by adding the self-destruction of his recent impeachment defense.

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 8:50 pm

Feral wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 8:35 pm Trump's just softening us up, so when he pardons Giuliani, &/or Manafort, Stone, Kushner, Flynn et al., we'll take it in stride.

I asked there, so I'll also ask here.

Anyone know why Obama pardoned Oscar Lopez Rivera?

I do not know 100% for sure nor do I think anyone else does - but I would like to participate in the anyone know why ________ pardoned _____________inquiries.
If I may, can I ask does anyone know why Bush "pardoned" Orlando Bosch?

Well...obviously, he didn't pardon him -- which I assume you know, given the scare quotes.

That said, you know the answer as well as I do: because Bosch was a Bush "asset" from when the latter was DCI.

Mjl wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 7:56 pm I am just curious what all the pubs who insisted during impeachment that Trump is an anti-corruption warrior think about this.

^^^^^^^^

Mjl wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:58 pm

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 10:36 pm Ok. So the "whole new level" means what?

See that post, it's explained there.

I have a problem with all the other President's pardoning the undeserved. But he took it to another level by adding the self-destruction of his recent impeachment defense.

Wait, he had an impeachment defense?

ousdahl wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:02 am

Mjl wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:58 pm

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 10:36 pm Ok. So the "whole new level" means what?

See that post, it's explained there.

I have a problem with all the other President's pardoning the undeserved. But he took it to another level by adding the self-destruction of his recent impeachment defense.

Wait, he had an impeachment defense?

He did. And they did a pretty good job. Explained what is required for something to be a quid pro quo.

and the best defense against an obstruction charge is to obstruct the investigation?

Is that what happened?

IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:05 am

ousdahl wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:02 am

Mjl wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:58 pm

See that post, it's explained there.

I have a problem with all the other President's pardoning the undeserved. But he took it to another level by adding the self-destruction of his recent impeachment defense.

Wait, he had an impeachment defense?

He did. And they did a pretty good job. Explained what is required for something to be a quid pro quo.

Trump's lawyers offered absolutely zero refutation of the facts. They didn't even really advance any legal arguments. It was really not a lot more than gussied up Fox News talking points, and finger-pointing back at the democrats.

IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:47 am Is that what happened?

This is one among a number of reasons why it’s impossible to take you seriously, no matter how hard I try.

jfish26 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:55 am

IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:05 am

ousdahl wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:02 am

Wait, he had an impeachment defense?

He did. And they did a pretty good job. Explained what is required for something to be a quid pro quo.

Trump's lawyers offered absolutely zero refutation of the facts. They didn't even really advance any legal arguments. It was really not a lot more than gussied up Fox News talking points, and finger-pointing back at the democrats.

For some things, yes I'd agree there was a lot of that (which was true for both sides at various points of the "trial" that I watched).

For the Ukraine call stuff it seemed to me that they argued it's not a quid pro quo if the other side doesn't know (in this case that the aid was being temporarily held back). Essentially, it's not wrong (or uncommon) for something (in this case aid) to be held back while waiting to see what the other side does about something. They argued that without Trump saying something along the lines of "if you don't investigate the Bidens then I won't release this aid" then it's not a quid pro quo situation...and there wasn't any evidence that I saw presented that proved he said that.

it doesn't help perception that the Ukrainian president has publicly said there was no quid pro quo...and Zelensky clearly isn't a trump fan and has publicly criticized him saying things about Ukraine being corrupt...so he has no reason to lie for the president.

Obviously I trust your legal advice/analysis far more than whatever it is you'd call my impression I got from watching the "trial" on TV. So I'm far from saying you're wrong in your analysis. I trust your opinion more than most.

Feral wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:57 am

IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:47 am Is that what happened?

This is one among a number of reasons why it’s impossible to take you seriously, no matter how hard I try.

Well, in all fairness, I was just trying to be a smart ass by asking a question since 87% of ousdahls posts are statements disguised as questions (the other 13% are made up scenarios about work/roommates/and imaginary pet names).

Did you really crunch the numbers on all my posts?

cuz that’s not the number beaverfever came up wit!

ousdahl wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2020 9:30 am Did you really crunch the numbers on all my posts?

cuz that’s not the number beaverfever came up wit!

No. And I'm just kidding. Although I couldn't crunch the numbers on your posts because you've got some super secret settings on that make it so we can't see your most frequent topic %.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics ... o-himself/

Decent recap (goes against what I said above, but still recaps the very limited facts that exist).

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 9:14 pm

Mjl wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 9:13 pm Again, it's a whole new level when you claim to be the world's anti-corruption champion, and a week later you pardon the posterboy of American corruption

Bullshit.

Y'all are shitting little rings around yourself because Trump did what presidents do.

Joe Arpaio
Scooter Libby
Dinesh D’Souza
Conrad Black
Bernie Kerik
Rod Blagojevich
Michael Milken

It's what President's do!

I know, right?

Also, still no word on Rivera.

DCHawk1 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:43 am Also, still no word on Rivera.

Sorry, didn't see this before.

This holds a special "terrible" place for me as there is a section of Division Street not very far from Casa Chiknbut that honors Rivera. I admit to not being aware of the man until the pardon but I'm appalled by it.

Still has to go aways to match Matt Bevin and his horrible pardons.