IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jul 27, 2020 11:34 am
All lives matter wouldnt have been viewed as racist if it existed before black lives matter and if it wasnt frequently used as a rebuttal for the statement black lives matter...but it didnt exist before the black lives matter phrase started circulating.
If all lives matter then black lives matter and it doesnt need to be used against the phrase black lives matter. The phrase isnt "ONLY black lives matter" and if it did then i wouldnt agree with it and all lives matter would be an acceptable response....but since it isnt about ONLY black lives mattering then it is a the very least rude, and possibly racist in some scenarios, to respond to black lives matter with all lives matter.
An observation from a constant lurker with a paucity of posts:
This is one of your best posts, Illi. Taking it one step past the potential for rudeness or racism the use of the phrase in that context also reflects ignorance of and the lack of compassion or empathy for a race that has endured centuries of oppression in nearly every aspect of their daily life, even after they've been "freed."
To me, those that use the phrase all lives matter, in that context, are subconsciously exposing their true feelings about their own insecurities and their own status in their respective races, and responding as such gives them another moment to avoid confronting their own demons.
Thanks. I was fortunate to grow up in diverse schools and have a diverse group of friends from a young age. That is immensely helpful in someone becoming understanding and empathetic to people with different backgrounds and upbringings.
Also agree with what you said.
Re: George Floyd and the Ensuing Protests
Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2020 9:55 pm
by Walrus
Pretty difficult to say one can read another person's intentions, unless you are in their mind. I tend not to assume one is racist unless it's blatantly obvious. Most "all lives matter" supporters I've known have not shown any hint of racism. They just want inclusiveness and an equal playing field for all.
Re: George Floyd and the Ensuing Protests
Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2020 10:10 pm
by Deleted User 310
Walrus wrote: ↑Mon Jul 27, 2020 9:55 pm
They just want inclusiveness and an equal playing field for all.
Why do they feel like they are being excluded? Black lives matter movement is about equal treatment. Not special treatment. Nobody is being excluded. They arent saying white lives dont matter. They arent saying treat white people worse. They are trying to improve some things that are happening to make black lives feel valued less. Why do the white people need to be catered to? If they want to feel included then they should include themselves in the black lives matter movement so that they better understand it. They are centering it on their whiteness instead of accepting it for what it truly is. Again, it is black lives matter TOO. Not black lives matter ONLY.
I agree it is hard to read peoples minds. Thats why i always say they are either incredibly rude/misinformed or possibly racist. Hopefully it is mostly the former, but frequently it is the latter. Either way it is an unacceptable and unnecessary response to someone saying black lives matter.
Re: George Floyd and the Ensuing Protests
Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2020 10:20 pm
by PhDhawk
The guy who claims to be a sincerity expert can't understand intent. No shit. I don't think he understands much of anything.
Well context matters too.
Re: George Floyd and the Ensuing Protests
Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2020 11:00 pm
by Walrus
"Birds of a feather...." as Chikinbut said recently.
"Antifa militant and convicted pedophile Blake David Hampe was arrested in the early hours of Saturday following his alleged stabbing of a black Trump supporter in Portland."
IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jul 27, 2020 10:10 pm
Why do they feel like they are being excluded?
Again, the problem is that the assumption of them being "privileged" or "having an easier life" is what is not inclusive. No one group based on race should be treated like they had an advantage in life. It's ludicrous and embarrassing that people believe such nonsense. Treat people as individuals is the better path.
IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jul 27, 2020 10:10 pm
Why do they feel like they are being excluded?
Again, the problem is that the assumption of them being "privileged" or "having an easier life" is what is not inclusive. No one group based on race should be treated like they had an advantage in life. It's ludicrous and embarrassing that people believe such nonsense. Treat people as individuals is the better path.
Not all white people are privileged.
Some black people are privileged.
The problem is that a greater portion of white people are privileged and it is easier to become privileged as a white person than it is as a black person.
Just because some white people have had a tough life doesnt mean that white privilege doesnt exist in many forms.
I dont know many (probably any?) white people who truly think their life would be easier in this country if they had black/brown skin.
IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jul 27, 2020 10:10 pm
Why do they feel like they are being excluded?
Again, the problem is that the assumption of them being "privileged" or "having an easier life" is what is not inclusive. No one group based on race should be treated like they had an advantage in life. It's ludicrous and embarrassing that people believe such nonsense. Treat people as individuals is the better path.
Not all white people are privileged.
Some black people are privileged.
The problem is that a greater portion of white people are privileged and it is easier to become privileged as a white person than it is as a black person.
Just because some white people have had a tough life doesnt mean that white privilege doesnt exist in many forms.
I dont know many (probably any?) white people who truly think their life would be easier in this country if they had black/brown skin.
Seriously, why try to explain yourself to Walrus/Lobby? He doesn't care. You're never going to get him to try and understand your position. That would take integrity and intelligence - two things he lacks significantly.
Again, the problem is that the assumption of them being "privileged" or "having an easier life" is what is not inclusive. No one group based on race should be treated like they had an advantage in life. It's ludicrous and embarrassing that people believe such nonsense. Treat people as individuals is the better path.
Not all white people are privileged.
Some black people are privileged.
The problem is that a greater portion of white people are privileged and it is easier to become privileged as a white person than it is as a black person.
Just because some white people have had a tough life doesnt mean that white privilege doesnt exist in many forms.
I dont know many (probably any?) white people who truly think their life would be easier in this country if they had black/brown skin.
Seriously, why try to explain yourself to Walrus/Lobby? He doesn't care. You're never going to get him to try and understand your position. That would take integrity and intelligence - two things he lacks significantly.
Remember when he was all about nuance...then he started to take an exaggerated example from the opposing side of an argument as evidence to validate his stance on the opposite extreme?
IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jul 27, 2020 10:10 pm
Why do they feel like they are being excluded?
Again, the problem is that the assumption of them being "privileged" or "having an easier life" is what is not inclusive. No one group based on race should be treated like they had an advantage in life. It's ludicrous and embarrassing that people believe such nonsense. Treat people as individuals is the better path.
Not all white people are privileged.
Some black people are privileged.
The problem is that a greater portion of white people are privileged and it is easier to become privileged as a white person than it is as a black person.
Just because some white people have had a tough life doesnt mean that white privilege doesnt exist in many forms.
I dont know many (probably any?) white people who truly think their life would be easier in this country if they had black/brown skin.
It is true that blacks can have it more difficult, but that's because other blacks commit more crime. It's not white privilege. Young blacks committing more crime creates an expectation that young blacks might commit more crime. It's not racism -- it's called playing the probabilities. Even black police will tell you they are more concerned about young blacks more than whites. But again, this does not apply to all blacks. Just like Tatum's video suggested, people who dress more normal will be treated more normal. Blacks who wear their pants with their ass hanging out, they will be looked at more suspiciously. Don't like it? Then change what you are projecting to the world.
I would rather listen to actual blacks than some random white dude on here.
Re: George Floyd and the Ensuing Protests
Posted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 5:07 pm
by Deleted User 89
you obviously can’t read, or choose not to
willful ignorance at its finest
Re: George Floyd and the Ensuing Protests
Posted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 6:34 pm
by Deleted User 310
chiknbut wrote: ↑Wed Jul 29, 2020 2:58 pm
Seriously, why try to explain yourself to Walrus/Lobby? He doesn't care. You're never going to get him to try and understand your position. That would take integrity and intelligence - two things he lacks significantly.
I feel like he engages me genuinely so i try to do the same for him. I think he understands my position even if he disagrees with me. I am not trying to change his mind necessarily. But i dont want to hold my tongue either when he posts something i feel some type of way about.
chiknbut wrote: ↑Wed Jul 29, 2020 2:58 pm
Seriously, why try to explain yourself to Walrus/Lobby? He doesn't care. You're never going to get him to try and understand your position. That would take integrity and intelligence - two things he lacks significantly.
I feel like he engages me genuinely so i try to do the same for him. I think he understands my position even if he disagrees with me. I am not trying to change his mind necessarily. But i dont want to hold my tongue either when he posts something i feel some type of way about.
You happen to know how to have a discussion and are always polite. Therefore, I try to be respectful of you and treat you the same.
Others on here, not so much. I just treat others as they treat me, or ignore them if it's not worth engaging.
Re: George Floyd and the Ensuing Protests
Posted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 9:37 pm
by ousdahl
care to comment on the Slocum massacre?
Re: George Floyd and the Ensuing Protests
Posted: Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:17 am
by ousdahl
lobster, your silence speaks volumes.
Re: George Floyd and the Ensuing Protests
Posted: Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:19 pm
by chiknbut
ousdahl wrote: ↑Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:17 am
lobster, your silence speaks volumes.
He's only treating you like you treat him. You brought this on yourself, you know.